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Father wants to terminate his rights

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MHeikkinen

Junior Member
What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? Michigan

I have two daughters 9 & 6. their father has yet again express his desire to terminate his rights. He wants my husband to adopt them. However he seems to think that even after doing so he still has the right to see them. CAn you please give me some feed back as to the law on this. I want him out once & for all. He is basically doing it to get out of paying support. & this is not the first time he has offered to do so.
 


rmet4nzkx

Senior Member
Of course he is trying to get out of paying child support. He is obligated to pay child support whether or not he exercises his visitaiton or has a relationship with his children, that is his and their loss. Your husband cannot be compelled to adopt the children just so you ex can get out of his child support obligation, yet at the same time, your husband can and should try to be the best step father he can be because he is really the only father figure they have, right?
 

VeronicaGia

Senior Member
MHeikkinen said:
What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? Michigan

I have two daughters 9 & 6. their father has yet again express his desire to terminate his rights. He wants my husband to adopt them. However he seems to think that even after doing so he still has the right to see them. CAn you please give me some feed back as to the law on this. I want him out once & for all. He is basically doing it to get out of paying support. & this is not the first time he has offered to do so.
If he terminates his rights, he does just that - terminates them. He will be a legal stranger to the children with no more rights than I have to the kids.

Tell him it's all or nothing, that's the law.
 

MHeikkinen

Junior Member
father wants to terminate his rights.

Right! But is there any law that would enable him to still see them? I would think there would be NO loop holes. I WOULD be interested to see if there is anyway to hold him liable for what he is in arrears fro right now. Prior to writing them off could he still be heald accountable? Hmmm....
 

VeronicaGia

Senior Member
MHeikkinen said:
Right! But is there any law that would enable him to still see them? I would think there would be NO loop holes. I WOULD be interested to see if there is anyway to hold him liable for what he is in arrears fro right now. Prior to writing them off could he still be heald accountable? Hmmm....
He will continue to owe any arrears but ongoing support will stop. Unless you agree to it in the adoption, he will, once again, have no more rights that I do to the kids.

Tell him to go pound sand. He either terminates his rights (and his current support obligation) or he keeps his rights and his obligations.
 

MHeikkinen

Junior Member
Veronica Do you ahve any idea how to start this whole process? Do I file something with friend of the court? Should I get a Lawyer?
 

VeronicaGia

Senior Member
MHeikkinen said:
Veronica Do you ahve any idea how to start this whole process? Do I file something with friend of the court? Should I get a Lawyer?
Yes, you should get a lawyer. If you want this done right, you must get one. If he's adamant about not terminating his rights unless he still has some type of visitation, cancel it and file contempt after contempt on him for non-payment of support until he gets tired of jail and allows the termination or pays up.

Friend of the court is mostly for child support. You will still have to see a judge.

A link to MI court forms: http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/courtforms/index.htm#forms

I don't know if what you need is in there, but it's good to familiarize yourself with this stuff.
 

MHeikkinen

Junior Member
thank you for the link I think I was on that last night trying to figure a few things out. I am going to get a lawyer for sure I think. I am just absolutly cluless on how I should tell my girls about this. He would like me to tell them he is moving out of State. I think it is worse to lie. But do I do it to spare their feelings now & chance them being mad at me in the future for not being truthfull?? GOD how do you tell kids their dad does not want them...
 
GOD how do you tell kids their dad does not want them... :confused:
Why should you have to tell them? If he is such a man he should tell them! By the way I didn't feel like being a daddy anymore. After nine years I wanted to trade you in for a lower monthy payment. It makes me sick that these men act like a child is a something you can just throw out.
 

tigger22472

Senior Member
I did a step-parent adoption and TPR this year (my husband adopted my kids). The first and formost thing we felt important was that the children were ok with it. At 9 and 6 they might not understand completely(heck some of us never understand how a parent can give up their children because of money) but then again they may understand more then you realize. Part of the reason we did it was due to the legalities. We wanted to assure that if somethign were to happen to myself that the children didn't lose their mom, their home, school, friends(we live far away from any other family), and the only person that's treated them as if he was their dad. My kids are 11 and 13 and it's done well.
As far as the contact thing I totally understand where you coming from. The question however is though, how much contact does bio-dad have now? If he has any or even half way frequent contact it will definately be harder for the kids to understand if you cut off all contact. In my case the last contact bio had with children was April of 2002(initiated by myself) and before that it was July of 2001. By some sort of miricle (yeah right) the state found him and got him served for the $24,000 in arrears he owed the month following the finalization of the adoption. Per his MO he contacted by mail less then a month after a wage withholding was taken out. It was birthday cards to my youngest son, a month late. I got them, and we did show and tell the children. I did tell the older that if he gets cards next month(which I'm not counting on) that we would show him also but that the ones we received, and anything else in the future if there is anything would be saved but not shown to them. We explained that they need to concentrate on being children, their school and their activities and friends and not worry how long this man was going to hang around this time then worry what they did when he took off again. One son handled it well. With the other one you could see the excitement that his 'daddy' had contacted even though he was the one who really wanted the adoption done. This was about 3 weeks ago and we're already back to normal. I considered contacting bio and telling him that no contact would be accepted but that feeds into him so as I said we promised to save the things and when they are 18 or ask for if there was anything they would see the things.
BTW... as stated if you don't 'forgive' the arrears they are always owed. In my case the support went from $113 owed a week to $30 a week paid toward arrears.
Something I've come to learn and accept is that although there is an adoption it never erases biology and your children will be left with the question as to how a parent can simply 'give them up'. I tell my children that I can't answer that question for them and that once they are older and try to speak with their bio he would have to answer that. I've also prepared them for the lies that will be told to them and keep my documentation to counter those lies, it's always helped me by showing my kids reality.
Good luck!
 

VeronicaGia

Senior Member
militarybrats said:
GOD how do you tell kids their dad does not want them... :confused:
Why should you have to tell them? If he is such a man he should tell them! By the way I didn't feel like being a daddy anymore. After nine years I wanted to trade you in for a lower monthy payment. It makes me sick that these men act like a child is a something you can just throw out.
Women do it too.
 

tigger22472

Senior Member
militarybrats said:
GOD how do you tell kids their dad does not want them... :confused:
Why should you have to tell them? If he is such a man he should tell them! By the way I didn't feel like being a daddy anymore. After nine years I wanted to trade you in for a lower monthy payment. It makes me sick that these men act like a child is a something you can just throw out.
That is tough. When my ex didn't contest our TPR and adoption I sat both my kids down and told them and they asked questions about things I had NEVER EVER discussed with them and I was honest with them. A few weeks ago my 13 year old and I were alone for a while and he was talking about his bio and how life was with him. I told him that I hate what they had to endure but that I ALWAYS try to look at the bright side of every situation. He looked at me with that deer in the headlights look as if to say "yeah right Mom, tell me the BRIGHT side of this". I told him I look at it that unlike myself who was sheltered by my parents because they both had hard childhoods my children will not grow up and be as naive as I was. They know life isn't always rosy and it isn't always easy.
The parent that leaves doesn't care enough or know enough to know that the parent that sticks it out is constantly answering questions like this and I just tell my kids that I can't answer all the questions. I tell them that I would never ever do to them what their bio has and it's never crossed my mind. I tell them we don't associate with people that do these things. I let them know that I kick myself often for allowing myself to be with someone who can walk away from their children because of money. Of course my kids are older then the OP's children but they seem to accept it and understand the best they can.
 

MHeikkinen

Junior Member
thank you both

For your personal stories it helps me shead some light on mine. I just had it out with him this morning, havent stopped crying since. It breaks my heart to think of their faces when I have to tell them. My 9 year old is very preceptive, always has been she is the type of kid that needs a logical explanation for everything. Otherwise you get the "Come on now mom tell me the truth" look. At the bottom here I copied his very last e-mail this morning. I'm sure you can see from that he is not a very smart man. None the less. He acts as though the girls are blockbuster movies. Rent them only when you want to see them. Funnyt thing is I refused for a long time to answer his calls or return his e-mails, yet he says he is doing this so the girls dont see us fight. lol. He is the one insistant on talking to me & I've said 100 x's I would just like to raise my babies in peace, let them be happy little girls. My husband now is notto big on the idea simply b/c he doesnt think we should "let him off the hook" Which is true. But as a mother, you know it is not about $$ its your babies youwant to protect... the problem I have with them talking to him downt he road is the lies I know he will tell them. I am documenting everything & plan to keep it for when the time comes.

This is from the Bio... Notice how he says Put up with YOUR S*&# JUST to see my kids, like its not worth his time... Also keep in mind I left HIM.

I know how permenant this is and its crazy so many people couldn't agree more with me that they would not want to put up with your **** just to see and talk to my kids but I am going to go now I do not care to talk to you on the computer or phone we will just talk when it is time to take care of business and that is that. I never said they will run to me in open arms but do i think they wil come to me with questions? Yes and I will be there with phone records email print out and my tape recorder of your messages on my voice mail. i never said that those things will help them forgive me but it may help them to better understand. So all I am trying to say is do not bother me with your immature comments on me getting a hard on and stuff. I will live my life you live yours and much happier we will all be with out dealing with you and your mouth
 

tigger22472

Senior Member
The biggest thing I saw in that post was that your husband isn't big on the idea of the adoption and that is the MOST important thing really. If your husband were to adopt and you were to divorce he would be as liable as the bio father is right now. If your husband says he doesn't want to do it so as not to let bio off the hook, that's true but it's also not ALL that he feels about it. He doesn't want it. That doesn't mean he doesn't love your children, it just means he's not prepared to do this. As you said, for you it's not about the money, it shouldn't be for him either.

As far as the bio goes he could be right in a way. You need to watch EVERYTHING you say. I'm not saying that he is right in any way but if when the kids are older he shows them things you said he could manipulate it into meaning things you didn't and try and turn your children against you. The biggest thing I have with my children is I have spoken logical to them and let them come to their own conclusions about their bio. I bit my tongue as often as I could and just let bio dig his hole, and that's what he did.
 

MHeikkinen

Junior Member
tigger

Thats exactly what I have tried to do, I make sure that all my emails come across with out to much "Ill Will" I think that my husband has some hesitaion, but then from a maternal stand point as you know we wont let anyone hurt our babies. Fathers/men I think , think more logically. We are so compelled by shear emotion. We jsut spoke to a lawyerr who advised us NOT to move forwad. He is only getting what he wants (out of support) rather he suggested I file a motion to change visitation. I'm torn as to wehter I sit my oldest down & fill her in as much as I can with out hurting her. As logical as she is, I would rather have the oppurtunity to pave the road. Rather than him having it later on.
 

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