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In court arguments for no support

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What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California, San Bernardino.
Material facts: Time of marriage 9 yrs. No children. 2 houses. 3 - 401Ks totaling about 60K. During marriage, wife worked part time ($300/mo income) and went to school full time. Graduated with a B.A. in Art History and now has had a $14/hr job for almost 1 year. I worked full time/nights and overtime to keep up our lifestyle up to last year. I grossed $106K.
Now, there is no more overtime so my base pay of $40/hr is my only income. I kept the house with the larger monthly payment (2K/mo), have a car payment, and a son from my previous marriage.
She has the less expensive house payment of $1100/mo, no car payment and no children.

Reason for my seeking divorce is her continuing Alcoholism, which led to a 5 car accident/DUI which was the last straw for me.

During the Alimony proceedings, what arguments can be used or should be avoided to minimize the chances of having to pay spousal support?
 


Ohiogal

Queen Bee
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California, San Bernardino.
Material facts: Time of marriage 9 yrs. No children. 2 houses. 3 - 401Ks totaling about 60K. During marriage, wife worked part time ($300/mo income) and went to school full time. Graduated with a B.A. in Art History and now has had a $14/hr job for almost 1 year. I worked full time/nights and overtime to keep up our lifestyle up to last year. I grossed $106K.
Now, there is no more overtime so my base pay of $40/hr is my only income. I kept the house with the larger monthly payment (2K/mo), have a car payment, and a son from my previous marriage.
She has the less expensive house payment of $1100/mo, no car payment and no children.

Reason for my seeking divorce is her continuing Alcoholism, which led to a 5 car accident/DUI which was the last straw for me.

During the Alimony proceedings, what arguments can be used or should be avoided to minimize the chances of having to pay spousal support?
Most likely you are gong to have to pay alimony/spousal support for a period of time. You earn 83200 a year if you earn $40 an hour. She earns 29120 approximately. Your son does NOT figure into the equation quite frankly as his mother should be paying child support. Expect to pay probably 2k a month in spousal support for a few years. That is a rough guess. The marital portion of the 401ks will be divided -- you will each get 30k.
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California, San Bernardino.
Material facts: Time of marriage 9 yrs. No children. 2 houses. 3 - 401Ks totaling about 60K. During marriage, wife worked part time ($300/mo income) and went to school full time. Graduated with a B.A. in Art History and now has had a $14/hr job for almost 1 year. I worked full time/nights and overtime to keep up our lifestyle up to last year. I grossed $106K.
Now, there is no more overtime so my base pay of $40/hr is my only income. I kept the house with the larger monthly payment (2K/mo), have a car payment, and a son from my previous marriage.
She has the less expensive house payment of $1100/mo, no car payment and no children.

Reason for my seeking divorce is her continuing Alcoholism, which led to a 5 car accident/DUI which was the last straw for me.

During the Alimony proceedings, what arguments can be used or should be avoided to minimize the chances of having to pay spousal support?
Realistically, there is no way that she is going to be able to pay a 1100.00 mortgage and support herself on 29k a year. Even with no car payment, she will be lucky to take home 1600.00 a month, and that isn't going to pay the house payment, utilities, food, gasoline etc.

With the big disparity in your incomes you can expect to pay some short term alimony.
 
Her take home pay is $1700 every 2 wks, my take home is $5K every month ( I get paid monthly). Because my bills are higher than hers, my take home also puts me in a month to month situation. I have half time custody of my son and NO child support to or from ex.
Since there is no calculator like in child support, what arguments should I make or avoid to minimize chances of having to pay much or at all?
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
Her take home pay is $1700 every 2 wks, my take home is $5K every month ( I get paid monthly). Because my bills are higher than hers, my take home also puts me in a month to month situation. I have half time custody of my son and NO child support to or from ex.
Since there is no calculator like in child support, what arguments should I make or avoid to minimize chances of having to pay much or at all?
What bills are higher than hers? What marital debts are you taking? What marital debts is she keeping? How much equity is in each home? Is that being split? One argument is that your taxes will be decreased if you are paying her alimony. What type of car do you drive? What is your car payment? Does she have a vehicle/license? What other assets exist? Avoid stating you don't make a lot of money. Because quite frankly you do and that will NOT win your friends or influence people if you start crying poor.
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
Her take home pay is $1700 every 2 wks, my take home is $5K every month ( I get paid monthly). Because my bills are higher than hers, my take home also puts me in a month to month situation. I have half time custody of my son and NO child support to or from ex.
Since there is no calculator like in child support, what arguments should I make or avoid to minimize chances of having to pay much or at all?
California being California, I am nearly certain that you are going to be paying alimony for a few years. Probably at least 3.

The question is how much? 2000.00 would be a worst case scenario. As OG briefly mentioned, it effects your tax. Its tax deductible to you and taxable income to her. Therefore your net cost would likely be about 2/3rd of the actual amount.

Since you are the one keeping the house with the higher house payment, you might get away with less. You might consider asking the judge to order that you can pay her house payment rather than give her the money directly. That would help protect your credit. Since her house payment is about 900.00 less than yours, 1100.00 would be pretty equitable, and would protect her credit as well.
 
I know California is a 'no fault' state, so should I even bother to bring up the Alcoholism? (Much of her current financial situation stems from fines from this)

During the marriage, I paid for her to get her B.A., should I bring that up; does that count for anything?

Any money she earned throughout the marriage she kept and used as she wanted. Does it hurt me to bring this up?
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
I know California is a 'no fault' state, so should I even bother to bring up the Alcoholism? (Much of her current financial situation stems from fines from this)

During the marriage, I paid for her to get her B.A., should I bring that up; does that count for anything?

Any money she earned throughout the marriage she kept and used as she wanted. Does it hurt me to bring this up?
During the marriage you made choices. The B.A. was a choice you made. Bring it up however to show her earning potential. Why did she keep all the money to use as she wanted? Did it benefit you at all? Her fines for criminal activity should be hers.
 
She kept the money because "I make so little." The only benefit for me was that at least she used the money for 'her needs' -makeup, clothes, etc. and thus my expenses on those items was less - She always spent more than she made. This led to a few financial fights, but it never changed.

When we separated in January of this year, she took over 6K of our savings with her (her rightful half), and now claims to be broke because of the DUI fines. She moved into our other house and didn't have to put a down payment safety security or anything. She chose to pay all her fines in full, that's why she's 'broke.' I feel that my giving her spousal support to bring her back up is like her having NO financial responsibilities due to her DUI.
 
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Based on the answers posted, it seems that one way to minimize or eliminate spousal support would actually be an UNequal division of assets. (A higher percentage to her.) Am I wrong? AND, could I ask this of the judge OR would it have to be an agreement between parties?
 
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LdiJ

Senior Member
Based on the answers posted, it seems that one way to minimize or eliminate spousal support would actually be an UNequal division of assets. (A higher percentage to her.) Am I wrong? AND, could I ask this of the judge OR would it have to be an agreement between parties?
Why would you do that? Its not logical.

She is going to get half of the marital assets and be responsible for half of the marital debt. The only portion of the 401ks that are marital assets are those that accrued during the marriage.

She makes 14.00 an hour you make 40.00 an hour. You simply have to live with the fact that you are going to be paying alimony for a few years.

The only way that you could possibly argue the issue with the JUDGE, is if you could prove that she was significantly underemployed. That she could easily get a job making significantly more money than her current job. With her degree, and that degree being almost brand new, I don't see that happening.

You might get her to AGREE to not take alimony if you could offer her a significant amount of liquid assets in addition to her share of the marital assets...so that she could supplement her income for a few years with the additional assets. To me, that isn't logical. What if you did that and she remarried in a year? You would have thrown away a significant amount of liquid assets for nothing.
 

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