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Retirement and Spousal Support

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mom22boyz

Member
What is the name of your state? Ohio

This question is for my father who is not so computer literate but has a legal question.

Backgound, hope this is enough info.... My mother filed for divorce last week after 33 years of marriage. He has been the primary breadwinner and she was a SAHM who never realy went back to work fulltime even after the kids were grown. He is 65 and was plannng on retiring from being a self-employed brick layer. He does have SS money coming as well as a small pension from working odd union jobs throughout the years.

The question is, how is spousal support calculated when the divorce is filed and the defendant is still working, yet wishs to retire. Is it based on current wages, or can it be calculated solely based on retirmement? He is worried about actually retiring if he will still be forced to pay a higher amount of support as if he was still working. Should he retire now while the proceedings are still on-going? Or could this be seen as voluntary under employment (as in a CS situaton)

Thanks in advance for your help. If there are any additional details that need to be included in order to give advice, please let me know.What is the name of your state?
 


nextwife

Senior Member
What is the name of your state? Ohio

This question is for my father who is not so computer literate but has a legal question.

Backgound, hope this is enough info.... My mother filed for divorce last week after 33 years of marriage. He has been the primary breadwinner and she was a SAHM who never realy went back to work fulltime even after the kids were grown. He is 65 and was plannng on retiring from being a self-employed brick layer. He does have SS money coming as well as a small pension from working odd union jobs throughout the years.

The question is, how is spousal support calculated when the divorce is filed and the defendant is still working, yet wishs to retire. Is it based on current wages, or can it be calculated solely based on retirmement? He is worried about actually retiring if he will still be forced to pay a higher amount of support as if he was still working. Should he retire now while the proceedings are still on-going? Or could this be seen as voluntary under employment (as in a CS situaton)

Thanks in advance for your help. If there are any additional details that need to be included in order to give advice, please let me know.What is the name of your state?
Many retire once they reach "full benefit age", so fiiling for SS and retirement now is not necessarilly a "ploy" to avoid SSupport. If he were 50, that would be a different story. His STBX is also entitled to the same benefits he gets, as they were married over ten years.

She WILL be entitled to a split of all marital assets and all retirement accounts accrued during the marriage.
 

mom22boyz

Member
"She WILL be entitled to a split of all marital assets and all retirement accounts accrued during the marriage."

Yes, absolutely.

So if he retires now, he will not be subject to paying any spousal support? Or will it be 1/2 of retirement funds (and all other assets) plus a monthly stipend from what he is living on based on his actual monthly "income".
 

Bali Hai

Senior Member
"She WILL be entitled to a split of all marital assets and all retirement accounts accrued during the marriage."

Yes, absolutely.

So if he retires now, he will not be subject to paying any spousal support? Or will it be 1/2 of retirement funds (and all other assets) plus a monthly stipend from what he is living on based on his actual monthly "income".
Since SHE wants the divorce, you would think that SHE has all the details worked out to support herself without looking for a handout.
 

Bali Hai

Senior Member
Many retire once they reach "full benefit age", so fiiling for SS and retirement now is not necessarilly a "ploy" to avoid SSupport. If he were 50, that would be a different story. His STBX is also entitled to the same benefits he gets, as they were married over ten years.

She WILL be entitled to a split of all marital assets and all retirement accounts accrued during the marriage.
I don't believe STBX will receive the same amount.
 

nextwife

Senior Member
I don't believe STBX will receive the same amount.
http://www.socialsecurity.gov/gethelp1.htm

If she retires at the proper age, it IS correct that SS will calculate a spouses benefits based upon the working spouses credits:

How divorce affects your future retirement benefits
If you are divorced after at least 10 years of marriage, you can collect retirement benefits on your former spouse's Social Security record if you are at least age 62 and if your former spouse is entitled to or receiving benefits. If you remarry, you generally cannot collect benefits on your former spouse's record unless your later marriage ends (whether by death, divorce, or annulment).
 
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nextwife

Senior Member
"She WILL be entitled to a split of all marital assets and all retirement accounts accrued during the marriage."

Yes, absolutely.

So if he retires now, he will not be subject to paying any spousal support? Or will it be 1/2 of retirement funds (and all other assets) plus a monthly stipend from what he is living on based on his actual monthly "income".
He may be subject to SSupport. I do NOT know what the age difference is. If they are BOTH retirement age and retired, they would end up with comparable incomes utilizing retirment income.
 

mom22boyz

Member
Thanks for all of the help so far.

To answer your question, mom is 62 and is I suppose "retired" as she does not work, nor does she plan to start working. Does that mean they would both collect their own SS (from his employment) and then just divide up the pension equally?


I'm sorry I have so many questions, it just that dad cannot afford an atty and mom is being represented by a legal aid atty free of charge (not sure why she can do so but dad can't as I thought legal aid was based on household income). The truth is, they have been living close to the poverty line as is, and I am concerned for both of them how there will somehow be enogh money to support 2 households. Mom plans on applying for state aid and/or SSI for disability for fibromyalgia, and her atty seems to think she qualifies. So if she has the that additional income, yet dad is forced to live of retirement alone, I don't see how he should have to pay her Spousal Support in addition.

Thank you in advance for any additional input you can offer.
 

Bali Hai

Senior Member
http://www.socialsecurity.gov/gethelp1.htm

If she retires at the proper age, it IS correct that SS will calculate a spouses benefits based upon the working spouses credits:

How divorce affects your future retirement benefits
If you are divorced after at least 10 years of marriage, you can collect retirement benefits on your former spouse's Social Security record if you are at least age 62 and if your former spouse is entitled to or receiving benefits. If you remarry, you generally cannot collect benefits on your former spouse's record unless your later marriage ends (whether by death, divorce, or annulment).

If a spouse divorces a worker after 9 years, 11 months and 27 days of marriage, the spouse gets nothing from Social Security in auxiliary benefits and is entitled to no share of the worker's benefit. (Spouses can still get benefits on their own earnings records.)

If a worker has five spouses in succession, each for 10 years and 1 day of marriage, those spouses are entitled to hundreds of thousands of dollars more in Social Security benefits due to the marriage than the always-married spouse of another worker paying the same amount of taxes.

If a spouse divorces a worker after 40 years of marriage, the spouse is entitled to a spousal benefit of only one-half the benefit garnered by the worker as long as the worker is alive; however, should the worker die, the divorced spouse is entitled to a survivor's benefit equal to the worker's full benefit.

If a single head of household raises children and works for 40 years at $10,000 a year, she is entitled to substantially lower Social Security benefits than a spouse who never works and never raises children, as long as she was married to a rich worker for 10 years or more.

A divorced person who was married to a much older worker will, on the average, get substantially more benefits than a divorced person who was married to a worker of the same age because those who marry older workers are more likely to get survivor's benefits, which are more generous than spousal benefits.

A middle-class divorced spouse of a rich worker could face a significant marriage penalty forfeiting her survivor's benefits if she marries another middle-class worker.
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
Both of them are going to collect Social Security Retirement benefits. Since your mom is a bit younger it would be in her best interest to delay collecting benefits until she is 65....which is where the spousal support might come into play.

Its really sad that they are divorcing after all of these years, but its likely that the very best thing that you could do for them is to act as a mediator and help them figure out how to make things the best for both of them in their elder years.

They can agree to anything that they like. Your father could agree to keep working until your mother is age 65, and could agree to provide a certain amount of spousal support until that age....and your mother could agree that the spousal support stops at age 65...or she could agree that spousal support will only equal whatever it takes to equalize their incomes.

In other words....they need someone to help them talk and research what will really work. What they don't need is lawyers who will cost them both huge amounts of money. They need lawyers to draw up the paperwork and make sure its fair...but that is all.

Each of them needs to get a good handle on what they will recieve from Social Security..which takes some research...you can help there. They also need to research whether or not they can make things better for both of them if your father works longer.

SS benefits increase if someone works to age 67 now.

Help your parents by doing serious research...and mediating between the two of them, it may make BOTH their lives better in the long run.
 

nextwife

Senior Member
Your father could agree to keep working until your mother is age 65, and could agree to provide a certain amount of spousal support until that age.. .
Yeah, that's fair. Dad supports mom her whole life so she doesn't have to work, then when he's finally at about full retirement age, mom thanks him by forcing him to keep working to nearly 70 so she can get to continue not working AND have her own place.
 

Bali Hai

Senior Member
Both of them are going to collect Social Security Retirement benefits. Since your mom is a bit younger it would be in her best interest to delay collecting benefits until she is 65....which is where the spousal support might come into play.

BS, she is the one throwing away a 33 year marriage! Let her sink or swim!

Its really sad that they are divorcing after all of these years, but its likely that the very best thing that you could do for them is to act as a mediator and help them figure out how to make things the best for both of them in their elder years.

Sad?? It's downright stupid on her part!

They can agree to anything that they like. Your father could agree to keep working until your mother is age 65, and could agree to provide a certain amount of spousal support until that age....and your mother could agree that the spousal support stops at age 65...or she could agree that spousal support will only equal whatever it takes to equalize their incomes.

Why should HE have to keep working because SHE got a wild hair up her ***!

In other words....they need someone to help them talk and research what will really work. What they don't need is lawyers who will cost them both huge amounts of money. They need lawyers to draw up the paperwork and make sure its fair...but that is all.

If I were him, I would get a good divorce lawyer and go broke fighting this ungrateful poor excuse for a spouse. He doesn't stand to lose much and he could die knowing he stuck it to her.

Each of them needs to get a good handle on what they will recieve from Social Security..which takes some research...you can help there. They also need to research whether or not they can make things better for both of them if your father works longer.

SS benefits increase if someone works to age 67 now.

Help your parents by doing serious research...and mediating between the two of them, it may make BOTH their lives better in the long run.
OP should stay out of their divorce.
 

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