IS THIS abnormal?

[Perdiccas]

What is the name of your state? California

Here's the thing. My sister just got attacked/assaulted by some ex-girlfriend of hers whom were in disagreement over an issue and had not seen each other for around about 8 months. I was knocked on my room door by my mother telling me to call the police and so I did. I explained what I understood from the situation to the operator and they sent a dispatch or whatnot. Officer comes along, and by god, he is the most stupid officer on earth. He asked about two questions perhaps three. I and my mother kept asking him questions such as 'should we get a restraining order?', ' what do you do in these situations?' ' what do you recommend?' and his answers were so unsatisfactory it drove me mad. He would say 'depends what you want to do' and that's it. then he'd say after us bringing up the restraining order 'you could get one if you want' and that's it NO ADVICE on how to avoid this situation my sister got her head slammed against the cement twice and the officer calls it a misdemeanor and that's it. This guy spoke fewer words then me in math class!!! My mom then was debating weather to take my sister to the ER and this guy does not say a single thing. My mom, asks questions such as 'would the other girl pay if I take my daughter to the ER?' and the guy simply says 'you'd have to take her to court' I'm not kidding....this is my first time dealing with a police report, ARE ALL COPS THIS INEPT? I kept asking questions he kept looking at the sky waiting for god or something. NO ADVICE, NO ENCOURAGEMENT TO STOP CRIME OR AVOID A SIMULAR SITUATION NO NADA!!! It's like coming asking to use the bath room and leaving!! hardly anything was spoken on his behalf! It was so bad, that I told my sister, ME having logical sense, 'touch your head, since you have a lot of hair to see if you have any cuts' and sure enough she found some and a big bruise.... did the cop suggest that? NO me.. the one who has no clue or idea in regards to 'fights' the girl trespassed our property my sister was doing laundry and my MOTHER WITNESSED IT! the cop went outside to wait for another cop who would bring a camera... and THREE NEIGHBOORS were outside washing their lawn and our downstairs neighbor was obviously awake and did he bother to ask what had happened? any witness reports? NO... NOTHING.... this was so pathetic. HOW ON EARTH can we stop crime if police officers don't educate the general public on proper procedures! This is absolutely unacceptable! Please tell me it's not like this everywhere! And if so, what can I do to highlight this to everyone and perhaps complain through lawsuits or whatever it takes! ALL advice is greatly appreciated!

Thank you so very much

P.S this just happened two hours ago

Raul-

[CdwJava]

Originally Posted by Perdiccas

Officer comes along, and by god, he is the most stupid officer on earth. He asked about two questions perhaps three.

This is not the crime of the century. He may not have needed to ask many questions to figure out if he had a crime he could act on or not.

I and my mother kept asking him questions such as 'should we get a restraining order?', ' what do you do in these situations?' ' what do you recommend?' and his answers were so unsatisfactory it drove me mad. He would say 'depends what you want to do' and that's it.

First, the officer is not an attorney. Second, most departments FORBID officers from providing anything that could be remotely considered legal advice.

Most officers will provide you with access to resources so you can look into things yourself.

'should we get a restraining order?' ... It's up to you. If you want one, go to the court house or call to find out what the process is.

'what do you do in these situations?' ... Write a report and forward it to the District Attorney to determine if he wants to pursue charges.

' what do you recommend?' ... It depends on what you want to do.

Are those answers akin to what you heard?

then he'd say after us bringing up the restraining order 'you could get one if you want' and that's it

What did you expect him to say? he's not the judge, so he has no idea if a judge would grant the TRO or not.

NO ADVICE on how to avoid this situation my sister got her head slammed against the cement twice and the officer calls it a misdemeanor and that's it.

Was she injured? If not, it COULD be a a felony ADW charge ... BUT! Keep in mind that the other party is going to have a different version of events so it could end up being bad on both sides.

If the elements meet ADW then we can presume that the DA will file it as such. Some DAs want to see serious injury or the great likelihood of serious injury before charging a felony.

This guy spoke fewer words then me in math class!!! My mom then was debating weather to take my sister to the ER and this guy does not say a single thing.

Okay ... he probably should have asked if she desired medical attention. That should have been the first thing he asked the victim.

My mom, asks questions such as 'would the other girl pay if I take my daughter to the ER?' and the guy simply says 'you'd have to take her to court'

He was absolutely correct in that answer! The officer would have no idea! Remember, the vast majority of officers are not attorneys. They are unable to provide what can be construed as legal advice. Some officers can speak based on experience, and some officers have agencies that do not want them offering even that kind of advice as it leads to potential liability ... "The officer SAID that she would have to pay my bills!"

Ugh! The city attorney would just LOVE to see that claim!

I'm not kidding....this is my first time dealing with a police report, ARE ALL COPS THIS INEPT?

My biggest criticism of the officer is that he did not explain to you that he cannot answer these questions because it is not his place to do so, or, because he does not know the answers. I often don't answer some of those questions because I do not want to mislead someone. When I do answer them, I toss in a serious caveat that, "I am not sure, but ...", or, "You migth want to look in to this resource ...'

I kept asking questions he kept looking at the sky waiting for god or something.

Probably waiting for the next call just like this one.

NO ADVICE, NO ENCOURAGEMENT TO STOP CRIME OR AVOID A SIMULAR SITUATION NO NADA!!!

Well, you can start by not letting her back into the house ... or not doing whatever led to the confrontation in the first place.

He may not have been the most motivated cop on the block, but I don't see that he did anything horribly wrong. He won't get points for customer service or creativity, but neither did he do anything gravely wrong from what I can see.

NO... NOTHING.... this was so pathetic. HOW ON EARTH can we stop crime if police officers don't educate the general public on proper procedures!

If this was simple battery, then all he can do is make a report and forward it to the DA. Yeah, he should have probably talked to the witnesses. I would suggest that your sister get the witnesses to write up their statements today and tomorrow (along with their names, birthdates, addresses and phone numbers for home and work) and then bring them to the police department on Monday to have them added to the report.

This is absolutely unacceptable! Please tell me it's not like this everywhere!

Is there a panacea? No. Some places do a better job of it than others, and some officers are better than others. But fights are pretty much a dime a dozen and they are not likely to get too many cops or DAs excited.

And if so, what can I do to highlight this to everyone and perhaps complain through lawsuits or whatever it takes! ALL advice is greatly appreciated!

A lawsuit won't be productive and will enrich only the attorney you pay. Custmoer relations and enforcement are political (i.e. administrative) decisions. If your sister is dissatisfied with the service she received she certainly has the right to complain to the officer's supervisors. It could be that he is a poor officer with a bad attitude. or, it could be that everyone was yelling at once, he had been on a long chain of calls and this was the last in a series of complaining people, or that he did everything right and you were expecting too much.

I really cannot say since I wasn't there.

The bottom line is that a misdemeanor battery (PC 242) is not a huge deal. It usually involves two people fighting where both parties accuse the other of starting it. DAs usually discount family witnesses because they tend to side with their family member - so they are often left at square one: How do they prove the case beyond a reasonable doubt? Very often they cannot. Many counties (like mine, for example) regularly drop misdemeanor battery cases for the aforementioned reasons. Whether there is an impetus to investigate or dig is a matter of time and resource management, and most agencies just don't have the resources to pursue these matters.

I would go for getting the witness statements and then bringing them to the police department to add to any report. You sis might also benfeit from talking to the Watch Commander tonight - before it gets any later. She might get another officer, or she might get a better response from the officer, who knows. But if she gets on it now it is still fresh in everyone's mind.

- Carl

[garrula lingua]

The cop was probably trying to figure out what happened...

I don't know what happened - you just vented some conclusions (my sister was assaulted), not facts.

This may have been mutual combat, or the woman may have hit in self-defense...who knows ?

The 'assaulter' wasn't there, so all the cop could do is record the statements of the purported victim and any witnesses.

Who would ask a cop: should I take my daughter to the ER ? after she's 'assaulted' ?
Of course, if she's hurt. No, if she's not hurt.

The cop isn't an atty. Use your own common sense. If he clearly saw an emergency situation, he'd have called for paramedics. All he could do, in this situation is just record statements.

[Perdiccas]

"The cop isn't an atty. Use your own common sense. If he clearly saw an emergency situation, he'd have called for paramedics. All he could do, in this situation is just record statements."



Wounds to the head are to what I believe hard to diagnosed as a emergency situation or not. I once received a hit to the head in which a nurse simply placed a bandage upon, the wound however, being in the head, bleed continually putting me in a stage of panic... i do not believe one can easily determine, especially in my sisters case if it is a serious injury or not (another bandage case) now having said that, I will also point out our misfortune of not having our sister under our insurance policy, an ER trip is about the last thing we can afford right now, with my mother, myself and my sister unemployed. So common sense is sometimes a bit more complex then I personally would like it to be.


And Carl,

Hopefully you get this but, what of the fact that this girl clearly trespassed our property, can my mother bring this up in court? They can't or should not categorize this case as one that both parties accuse each other of starting it when that girl clearly came to our house.... that's like a robber saying we stole his house when we call the police on him.....It had only been 8 minutes when the Police Officer who coinsidently was in the block came to our assistance.

[CdwJava]

Originally Posted by Perdiccas

Wounds to the head are to what I believe hard to diagnosed as a emergency situation or not.

It is still generally up to the victim if they want medical treatment or not. With an ambulance ride potentially costing the VICTIM (not the city, the county or the state) more than a thousand dollars - plus the ER treatment which will be at least that much - the officer is going to call for an evaluation only when injury is obvious or to cover his own tail. She could easily have said to call, or, the family could have said they will take her (to save costs). It is not generally the policy in CA for police to call the medics to the scene of any fight (most of which include blows to the head). If we had to do that, costs for EMS would rise dramatically.

Hopefully you get this but, what of the fact that this girl clearly trespassed our property, can my mother bring this up in court?

Trespassing does not mean guilt in assault. The crime of trespassing is complete only when someone is asked to leave and then they refuse. At that point, the appropriate response is to call the police. Trying to remove the trespasser physically can expose the person doing the removing to civil and criminal liability.

They can't or should not categorize this case as one that both parties accuse each other of starting it when that girl clearly came to our house

That's only one part of the story.

If I am mad at you and I come to your house to demand the book I think you took from me, I am not guilty of assault if I defend myself from your attack.

The issue in your sister's case is going to be PROVING the primary aggressor. What you believe to be true (and you were not a witness to the incident), and what can be proven are different beasts. DA's don't take low-level cases to trial when they can't win or when they can't compel a plea deal.

Think of it this way, if the office has the resources to prosecute one attempted rape or four misdemeanor battery cases, which one do you think they are going to pursue? And, in all honesty, it really does come down to that kind of a decision. Not long ago I attended a very eye-opening seminar on the allocation of resources in a DA's office ... it was both eye-opening and frustrating at the same time. but, now I am not so angry at the DA when our cases get rejected with no prosecution pending.

I can't say what happened in your sister's situation, but getting the statements and calling the Watch Commander about the only two real angles of attack at this moment. And maybe a restriaing order on Monday (she can go to the courthouse and plunk down $125 or so to get it going).

- Carl

[TSOL]

You didn't say in your post but how old is your sister and how old is her ex? If they are both teenagers in many cases there doesn't seem to be too much follow up. You know kids will be kids etc.

About the only thing you can do is try pushing the DA to move forward with this case.