Got a ticket for drinking in public for no reason

[dave33]

Also there is no arrest in this story, it is detention. they just put me in handcuffs while they id'd me, and I am not arguing with that,
the deal is how can a police or RSO can ticket me for "drinking in public" while
a)they don't see me drink
b)they don't smell the spilled drink in soil (!) or the empty cup
c)and I don't show any signs of drunkness

The cop who gave me the ticket came 5-10 mins later than RSO

All that is needed in many arrests or tickets is an observation of the officer. Regardless of what the truth is all they have to do is articulate the facts to support the ticket or charge and you will be forced to defend yourself. They know in these situations it is much easier and cheaper for you tp plead guilty and pay the fine, even if you are innocent. The police are trained very well on writing a supporting document or police report to force a plea or discourage the average citizen from spending potentially thousands of dollars with possibly a worse outcome than accepting the plea. Unfortunately the more dealings you have with the system the more obvious it becomes as to it's extreme bias in preserving the status-quo. goodluck.

 

[CdwJava]

I'm guessing like most minor cases, the City Attorney declines to file the case, at least thats been my observation lately.

That wasn't the case when I was there ... and since most are filed in Traffic Court as infractions, the City Attorney is generally not even involved unless it is to forward the cite to the court.

 

[CdwJava]

If he was being arrested and held in custody he would have to be informed because the bail system is based on the arresting charge as set by each county's commissioner.

He was released on his own recognizance with a signed promise to appear. The citation would have the code section he is alleged to have violated on it. Ergo, he was informed.

 

[CdwJava]

Bail and arraignment are two different things. Sometimes, the officers at a jail will have a list of bail amounts for specific crimes. A person can bail himself out of jail and THEN go to an arraignment at a later date. At least, that's what someone on a different message board once told me.

Yes, that is possible. In CA you can be arrested and booked, and then make bail to be released prior to any arraignment. On release for a misdemeanor you will often be given an arraignment court date. At least that's how it tends to work in the OP's state of CA.

 

[CdwJava]

Also there is no arrest in this story, it is detention. they just put me in handcuffs while they id'd me, and I am not arguing with that,
the deal is how can a police or RSO can ticket me for "drinking in public" while
a)they don't see me drink
b)they don't smell the spilled drink in soil (!) or the empty cup
c)and I don't show any signs of drunkness

The cop who gave me the ticket came 5-10 mins later than RSO

So, you were detained by an RSO? What is an RSO?

If so, then the officer likely wrote the citation pursuant to a private person's arrest and likely won't be testifying at all at any trial ... unless he observed alcohol or smelled it emanating from your person.

Keep in mind that alcohol can have a distinctive odor. They wouldn't have to crawl on the ground or heft the cup right to their nostril to necessarily smell the odor. And if this was warm coke without any alcohol in it, then that would have been unlike any college party I have known. If correct, and the RSO and officer testify to not smelling any alcohol, you may be good to go.

Oh, and in my day when these went to trial they just about always resulted in a guilty verdict or plea. When they didn't it was when the officer didn't show or admitted that he never smelled alcohol or saw a marked container (i.e. a bottle of Captain Morgan).

 

[ardav]

So, you were detained by an RSO? What is an RSO?

I was approached by Residential Security Officer (campus security), he called the cops , cops detained me and gave me citation.

If so, then the officer likely wrote the citation pursuant to a private person's arrest and likely won't be testifying at all at any trial ... unless he observed alcohol or smelled it emanating from your person.

There is no arrest. 10-15 minute detention with cuffs. Which I don't make big deal out of it. There are no alcohol bottles or cans anywhere, he might say he smelled me of course.

Keep in mind that alcohol can have a distinctive odor. They wouldn't have to crawl on the ground or heft the cup right to their nostril to necessarily smell the odor. And if this was warm coke without any alcohol in it, then that would have been unlike any college party I have known.

There is no party going on at that moment, it was all over, i am sitting outside away from the house and the crowd and watching people leave and waiting for my friends to leave with that goddamn paper cup i used to to drink warm flat coke that has been sitting on the table all night to hydrate before i leave and couldn't toss anywhere.

If correct, and the RSO and officer testify to not smelling any alcohol, you may be good to go.

He might say he smelled alcohol (Though that was never his probable cause/suspicion but him seeing me dump something on the ground )

Oh, and in my day when these went to trial they just about always resulted in a guilty verdict or plea. When they didn't it was when the officer didn't show or admitted that he never smelled alcohol or saw a marked container (i.e. a bottle of Captain Morgan)

I don't who will show up; the RSO saw me dump something in the ground not drink, but the cops gave me the final citation who saw me with an empty cup

 

[CdwJava]

There is no arrest. 10-15 minute detention with cuffs. Which I don't make big deal out of it. There are no alcohol bottles or cans anywhere, he might say he smelled me of course.

You were issued a citation for a municipal code violation, that is a release from custody (i.e. an arrest). While it is not a big arrest, and may never show up on any state criminal offender record if you are not booked (and for this you probably won't be ... unless you FTA), it is still an arrest.

There is no party going on at that moment, it was all over, i am sitting outside away from the house and the crowd and watching people leave and waiting for my friends to leave with that goddamn paper cup i used to to drink warm flat coke that has been sitting on the table all night to hydrate before i leave and couldn't toss anywhere.

Okay.

He might say he smelled alcohol (Though that was never his probable cause/suspicion but him seeing me dump something on the ground )

You won't know what his probable cause was until you read any report he writes or hear his testimony at trial.

 

[tranquility]

ardav's main problem seems to surround probable cause. Clearly, there is enough information here where the police can arrest him for the crime. While I don't think this would be a valid search incident as it is not a normal custodial arrest, I agree with CdwJava that if ardav decided to NOT show the police ID they could bring him in and book him for failure to identify rather than cite and release.

Now, the burden is on the state/municipality to prove beyond a reasonable doubt the elements of the crime. Does ardav have a shot? This thread has gone round and round and I have no idea. Personally, I suspect all the facts certainly lead a reasonable man to think he did have alcohol in the cup (Dumping, he had recently drunk alcohol and might have been under the influence, the cup previously contained alcohol.), but proof beyond a reasonable doubt? ardav seems to want to make it an equation where either the strut supports or fails. Most people know that is not the way it works. People never have all the facts and they make inferences on the facts not known. I bet I know the inferences the judge will make on these facts.

 

[Zigner]

I filled it with coke before leaving and drinking, hydrating (this is at the end of the night) while waiting for my friends.

One does not hydrate with Coke.