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Is an Ip Address Enough to Convict a Person/Have Them Locked Up

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supervegeta

Junior Member
My question involves criminal law for the province of: Ontario in Canada.

Someone might me posing as me using my IP because my accounts got hacked and I want to know: if the police can trace the hacker's IP to me, will they be able to charge me? I read that you can't charge someone on an IP alone because it does not indicate who it was SPECIFICALLY who did it.

And if they can't charge me in court, can they still lock me up in holding until the court date? Like at the police station or courthouse?
 
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quincy

Senior Member
My question involves criminal law for the province of: Ontario in Canada.

Someone might me posing as me using my IP because my accounts got hacked and I want to know if the police can trace the hacker's IP to me will they be able to charge me? I read that you can't charge someone on an IP alone because it does not indicate who it was SPECIFICALLY who did it.

And if they can't charge me in court, can they still lock me up in holding until the court date? Like at the police station or courthouse?
This site handles US law questions only, supervegeta. You will need to find assistance in Ontario to determine what the police in your area can and cannot do or will or won't do.

An IP address on its own will only provide someone with a general location of a person (and often not even that). It takes a subpoena served on the internet service provider to discover account information connected to the address.

A lot needs to be accomplished by the one seeking the identity of the person behind the computer being investigated before any legal action is initiated.

You would probably not be jailed unless you are charged with a serious internet crime (like distribution of child pornography) and that will be after your computer or computers are seized and examined by authorities.

If you fear your computer might be connected to an internet crime and you might be charged with a crime, you should consult with an attorney in your area if/when authorities contact you. You should not speak to the police before speaking to your attorney.
 
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supervegeta

Junior Member
An IP address on its own will only provide someone with a general location of a person (and often not even that). It takes a subpoena served on the internet service provider to discover account information connected to the address.
(Forgot if I said this in my reply and can't see as it is being reviewed by an admin before being posted)

What will knowing the account information prove? If the account activity is not mine, then am I safe? What can I do?
 

quincy

Senior Member
(Forgot if I said this in my reply and can't see as it is being reviewed by an admin before being posted)

What will knowing the account information prove? If the account activity is not mine, then am I safe? What can I do?
The account information may prove nothing. If you are the sole owner and user of a computer and there has been illegal activity on this computer, however, I would not say that you are "safe."

You will generally (but not always) receive notice from your ISP that a subpoena has been issued for your account information. You have only a few days from the date of this ISP notification before the ISP is required to release your account information. If the ISP does not release the information upon receipt of the subpoena, they will be in contempt of a court order.

A response to a notification that your ISP has received a subpoena can be to file a motion to quash the subpoena, on a variety of grounds. For this, you will want an attorney's assistance. Again, you only have a few days to respond to a subpoena that has been served on your ISP, so if you want to keep your account information private, get an attorney to help you with a motion to quash.

Your IP address is used to identify your computer on the internet so whenever you visit a website, there is (generally) a record of your computer's visit. An IP address, therefore, is recorded and can be tracked backwards to a specific computer and the specific date and time the computer was used to gain access to the internet and a specific website or web page.

The IP address, in other words, is only a starting point. The IP address and account information cannot necessarily prove who used the computer, especially if there are several people who use the computer or the network is unsecured, but it can be enough to get a warrant for computer search and seizure.

Evidence of illegal activities on the computer can often be enough to file charges (e.g., pornography) or file suit (e.g., copyright infringement, defamation) against the computer owner/account holder. Even when material has been deleted from a computer, computer forensics can find evidence of illegal activity that has been wiped or deleted.

Again, you will need to find assistance in Ontario. If you are afraid your computer will be connected to illegal activity, it would be smart for you to discuss this with an attorney in your area - and you definitely should contact an attorney if you are contacted by the authorities.

Speak with an attorney in your area before reporting to the police what you suspect might be computer hacking. Reporting to the police that you may be a victim of hacking may or may not be smart.
 
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CavemanLawyer

Senior Member
Its difficult to answer your question because saying your accounts got hacked doesn't tell us anything. In order to know what evidence would exist where I'd need to know exactly what information the person might have used, where, and how. If an individual used one of your logins or something to do an illegal act on the internet that won't necessarily have anything to do with your ip address. The ip address associated with that act would still be whatever one the other person is using to access the internet. If that ip address is investigated then it will lead law enforcement to that person, not necessarily to you at all. The only way your ip address would be directly implicated in an online crime would be if someone accessed your internet connection to do it. This occurs when you have an open wifi or poor encryption method for your wifi which they bypass. If you give us the scenario that you afraid might have happened then I can answer your question much more specifically.

I cannot comment on how Canadian isps work in this regard, but in America you will NOT be notified by them if your account is subpoenaed by the government for a criminal matter. ISPs, or any company for that matter, in America can and will be ordered under the subpoena/court order to not disclose the production of records or the investigation to the target. You are only notified that your account has been subpoenaed if it is a civil lawsuit. I have dealt with one company in Canada (KIK messaging app) and they will not notify the account holder before producing records in a criminal investigation.
 

quincy

Senior Member
Canadian law differs on this as it does in many other ways, this even when the same ISPs might be involved. He really needs to find assistance in Canada.

But supervegeta's title question is not really hard to answer. An IP address on its own cannot get a person sued or get a person arrested, charged or convicted of any crime. The IP address tells very little about the computer connected to that address or the person behind the computer. Based on the IP address, however, account information can be subpoenaed.

With civil actions (like defamation or copyright infringement), the ISP will as a general rule notify the account holder when it receives a subpoena for release of the account holder's identifying information. The account holder will have the chance to protect their privacy and their rights by responding to the subpoena.

For criminal actions, whether the ISP notifies the account holder of the receipt of the subpoena depends on the type of subpoena received.

Here for a good look at what law enforcement must do in order to access private accounts is a link to the ABA standards for law enforcement access to third party records: http://www.americanbar.org/groups/criminal_justice/standards/law_enforcement_access.html

Of course, this applies to the US. It is different in Canada and will depend on many facts and factors that should be discussed with an attorney in Canada if the need arises.
 
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