Is this search Legal?

[StandAblaze]

What is the name of your state? -Pennsylvania

Tonight I was arrested and charged with some stuff, thats not the point though I am wondering if what the police did to obtain everything was legal, here is what happened.

At about 11:30PM tonight me and three other people were sitting in my car in the parking lot of an apartment complex. Police drive up behind my car and shine the spotlight in and then approach the vehicle. They ask us what we are doing, (we had only been there about 20 minutes) I reply that we were just sitting there getting ready to leave we stopped because we were bored and looking for somewhere to go. Everyone in the car is 18 and we all provide ID. He then continues to ask us about drugs, and he has a dog and if we have any drugs now we should fess up to it etc etc. We all say no nothing is going on. He sees nothing in the car suspicious and then comes to the car and searches us all, one by one patting us down. Finds nothing on us, except a cut straw. He tells us to stand over by the police car, and him and another officer begin to search through my car. They never asked me for permission or anything, just began searching. I say "Excuse me sir, I have to get my girlfriend home (she was one of the 4 people there) I do not believe this search is necessary." He tells me to shut up, and continues to search. Then they tell us to sit in the back of the police car, Then they shut the door. 5 minutes later I knock on the window and I say I do not consent this search and he just shuts the door in my face. (I was not even arrested at this point) About 10 minutes later they find a bag with white powder residue. Is this search legal?

 

[Shay-Pari'e]

What is the name of your state? -Pennsylvania

Tonight I was arrested and charged with some stuff, thats not the point though I am wondering if what the police did to obtain everything was legal, here is what happened. Actually, that is the point.


At about 11:30PM tonight me and three other people were sitting in my car in the parking lot of an apartment complex. Police drive up behind my car and shine the spotlight in and then approach the vehicle. They ask us what we are doing, (we had only been there about 20 minutes)

I reply that we were just sitting there getting ready to leave we stopped because we were bored and looking for somewhere to go. Everyone in the car is 18 and we all provide ID. He then continues to ask us about drugs, and he has a dog and if we have any drugs now we should fess up to it etc etc. We all say no nothing is going on. He sees nothing in the car suspicious and then comes to the car and searches us all, one by one patting us down. Finds nothing on us, except a cut straw. He tells us to stand over by the police car, and him and another officer begin to search through my car. They never asked me for permission or anything, just began searching. I say "Excuse me sir, I have to get my girlfriend home (she was one of the 4 people there) I do not believe this search is necessary." He tells me to shut up, and continues to search. Then they tell us to sit in the back of the police car, Then they shut the door. 5 minutes later I knock on the window and I say I do not consent this search and he just shuts the door in my face. (I was not even arrested at this point) About 10 minutes later they find a bag with white powder residue. Is this search legal?[

So they denied having anything, yet they found the dope? Is this what your problem is?What did you think the doggies were for?

It sounded like a lawfull search, but please update us when your lawyer win's this case.

 

[StandAblaze]

The dogs were never used they were left in the back of the vehicle, never taken out. They just began searching my vehicle after they searched each individual, I denied the search 2 times and they ignored me. They found bag in the car.

 

[Shay-Pari'e]

The dogs were never used they were left in the back of the vehicle, never taken out. They just began searching my vehicle after they searched each individual, I denied the search 2 times and they ignored me. They found bag in the car.

Find that bag, and flush it. You are going to be posting these type of questions your whole life, if you do not get away from drugs.

 

[StandAblaze]

Yeah, I am done with that stuff now, but I still want to know if my rights were violated.

 

[Some Random Guy]

Based on observing your vehicle and the 'cut straw' the officer felt that he had probable cause to search the vehicle. However, this is predicated by the search of your persons being legal.

He sees nothing in the car suspicious and then comes to the car and searches us all, one by one patting us down

Since pat-down searches for weapons are generally legal (ostensibly for officer safety), so long as he discovered the straw from the pat down and then retrieved it from the pocket, you will have a tough time fighting the cause for this search.

 

[acmb05]

No they were not

Yeah, I am done with that stuff now, but I still want to know if my rights were violated.

You were sitting in an apartment building parking lot doing nothing probably with your lights out at 11:30 at nite. This would give police reason to beleive you were either up to no good or possible planning a robbery or vandalism. I dont suppose any of you lived there?

Anyway did you expect the police to just take your word for it that you werent doing anything? Btw I dont suppose this was in a known drug area was it? The police had every right to search each one of you and as soon as they found the straw they had probable cause to search the car also. I would think they had it anyway but the straw just makes it even better for them.

 

[justalayman]

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:VxeoqymOx1wJ:www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/previous/wpd/06280204.pdm.doc+"terry+searches"&hl=en

This is a link that you will find interesting. Although it is about Indiana, you will find many sites for "Terry searches". The original case did go to the SCOTUS.

The search may very well be highly suspicious and unjustified. It depends on more info than can be reviewed on an internet forum.

This is the SCOTUS brief of the original Terry v. ohio case that makes this type of search legal (in certain situations, not all) and the results of the "evidence" found.

http://supct.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0392_0001_ZS.html


This link also involves the use of Terry searches

http://supct.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0463_1032_ZD.html

 

[Some Random Guy]

justalayman,

Although Terry searches have limits, the OP never said that he did not consent to the search of his person, only the search of his vehicle. Without that protestation, the OP will have the same problems as the person in the link cited.

 

[StandAblaze]

Alright Thank you for you're replies. I am wondering what fines I may face etc. APparently I am being charged with possession (.1-.2)g of a controlled substance, and paraphenelia. I am 18 years old. I completely cooperated with the officers. I have no prior record. Although I do beleive the pat search they conducted was unreasonable. They had no reason to search us. We simply were sitting in my car getting ready to leave.

 

[HomeGuru]

Alright Thank you for you're replies. I am wondering what fines I may face etc. APparently I am being charged with possession (.1-.2)g of a controlled substance, and paraphenelia. I am 18 years old. I completely cooperated with the officers. I have no prior record. Although I do beleive the pat search they conducted was unreasonable. They had no reason to search us. We simply were sitting in my car getting ready to leave.

**A: your fine will be 10 years.

 

[Kane]

In order to search your car, they have to have probable cause. Even to make a "Terry stop" they need reasonable suspicion.

Based on your post, the search was illegal.

However, probable cause and reasonable suspicion are determined from the officers' point of view, at the time they conduct the search. The judge's decision will be based in large part on the officers' testimony about why they thought they had the right to search you and the car. They may have additional reasons to search, beyond what you're aware of.

Search and seizure law is complicated, and sometimes ambiguous, or even contradictory. It's also constantly evolving. You need to get a lawyer (you'll need one anyway), from your state, who can file a motion to suppress on your behalf.

 

[justalayman]

justalayman,

Although Terry searches have limits, the OP never said that he did not consent to the search of his person, only the search of his vehicle. Without that protestation, the OP will have the same problems as the person in the link cited.

If you read the links I gave, there are referrences to a dozen or so cases.

A terry search is not an automatic given for the cops and lack of protesting does not neccessarily give permission. It cannot be standard operating procedure.

I did not intend to validate or inalidate the OP's situation, just give info and insight.

Now from the opinion corner: I believe that evidence obtained from a terry pat should not be admissable as evidence. Evidence obtained during a terry pat and any search that that evidence allows being allowed into court is merely the current method of sidestepping the need for warrants. If there was no justification for a search other than the terry pat, then that evidence should not be admissable due to the fact that it was, in essence, obtained without any warrant.

 

[StandAblaze]

**A: your fine will be 10 years.

10 years ??? I believe if its your first possesion offense, you are giving a strict warning and obviously fines etc.

 

[acmb05]

You were loitering

In a parking lot of an apartment complex where so far you have not said if any of you lived there at 11:30 at nite. The police may have thought you were staking the lot out to burglerize cars as such they pulled you all out to look for burglary tools, they then found a straw commonly used for a controlled substance and at that time had probable cause to search the vehicle.

Does this sound accurate?