Tape recordings

[levathian860]

I'm currently involved in a case against my ex-boyfriend who is charged with domestic violence. He has a long history of threatening me and I was wondering if I could record his threats or important information he plans to lie about with or without him knowing and use it as evidence in court? I live in Illinois. Thanks for any information.

[outonbail]

Originally Posted by levathian860

I'm currently involved in a case against my ex-boyfriend who is charged with domestic violence. He has a long history of threatening me and I was wondering if I could record his threats or important information he plans to lie about with or without him knowing and use it as evidence in court? I live in Illinois. Thanks for any information.

How would you know he is about to lie about important information? Sounds like your trying to entrap him into saying something?

[Ohiogal]

Originally Posted by outonbail

How would you know he is about to lie about important information? Sounds like your trying to entrap him into saying something?

The thing is entrapment is only if a state official convinces someone to do something that they normally wouldn't do. So technically she couldn't entrap him unless she was a state official.

[outonbail]

Originally Posted by Ohiogal

The thing is entrapment is only if a state official convinces someone to do something that they normally wouldn't do. So technically she couldn't entrap him unless she was a state official.

From Merriam Webster

entrap

Pronunciation: in-'trap, en-
Function: transitive verb
Etymology: Middle French entraper, from en- + trape trap
1 : to catch in or as if in a trap
2 : to lure into a compromising statement or act
synonym see CATCH


Well then it sounds like she's trying to bait him into saying something. Just my opinion, but I don't see how anyone can know that someone else is about to lie about some important information, unless they were conspiring together. Obviously much more to this story

[outonbail]

Originally Posted by levathian860

I'm currently involved in a case against my ex-boyfriend who is charged with domestic violence. He has a long history of threatening me and I was wondering if I could record his threats or important information he plans to lie about with or without him knowing and use it as evidence in court? I live in Illinois. Thanks for any information.

I believe Illinois is one of the states which require all parties to the conversation have to made aware and agree to allow a tape recording. So no, you can't tape any conversations without informing him you are doing so. Of course, anything in the way of a threatening message that is left on your telephone answering machine is fair game.

The following may apply:

(720 ILCS 5/14-2) (from Ch. 38, par. 14-2)
Sec. 14-2. Elements of the offense; affirmative defense.
(a) A person commits eavesdropping when he:
(1) Knowingly and intentionally uses an eavesdropping device for the
purpose of hearing or recording all or any part of any conversation
or intercepts, retains, or transcribes electronic communication
unless he does so (A) with the consent of all of the parties to
such conversation or electronic communication

[Blue Meanie]

Originally Posted by levathian860

I'm currently involved in a case against my ex-boyfriend who is charged with domestic violence. He has a long history of threatening me and I was wondering if I could record his threats or important information he plans to lie about with or without him knowing and use it as evidence in court? I live in Illinois. Thanks for any information.

If your ex assaulted you, you should have received a Protection Order, if you have one and the ex is still contacting you in ANY way...that is a violation of the order...Call your police department and report it at once.
You should also talk to someone in Victim Wittness about the threats.

[levathian860]

Originally Posted by outonbail

I believe Illinois is one of the states which require all parties to the conversation have to made aware and agree to allow a tape recording. So no, you can't tape any conversations without informing him you are doing so. Of course, anything in the way of a threatening message that is left on your telephone answering machine is fair game.

The following may apply:

(720 ILCS 5/14-2) (from Ch. 38, par. 14-2)
Sec. 14-2. Elements of the offense; affirmative defense.
(a) A person commits eavesdropping when he:
(1) Knowingly and intentionally uses an eavesdropping device for the
purpose of hearing or recording all or any part of any conversation
or intercepts, retains, or transcribes electronic communication
unless he does so (A) with the consent of all of the parties to
such conversation or electronic communication

See this is where it gets blurry because I wouldn't be eavesdropping, I'd be having a recorded conversation with him. I know on those TV court shows in Chicago they have secretly recorded conversations entered as evidence.

The reason I know he'll say something incriminating is because he has in the past. He frequently threatens me. Right now he's trying to threaten me out of testifying against him. That's what I intend on recording him doing. I was thinking about starting a conversation about the case, and asking him what he wants to do, what he'll do if I go to court.

I do have a order of protection, but not and exclusive one so he still gets to live here. I'm looking for a new place though.

[levathian860]

Originally Posted by outonbail

How would you know he is about to lie about important information? Sounds like your trying to entrap him into saying something?

The lie was he told the judge he didn't talk to me for two weeks when he had talked to me in both of the past few days. I was hoping somehow I could say something like "remember what you said the night before we went to court" and then having that conversation compared to the court recorded testimony. He's lied about a lot of stuff though, because if he didn't he'd have no defense.

[outonbail]

Originally Posted by levathian860

See this is where it gets blurry because I wouldn't be eavesdropping, I'd be having a recorded conversation with him. I know on those TV court shows in Chicago they have secretly recorded conversations entered as evidence.

The reason I know he'll say something incriminating is because he has in the past. He frequently threatens me. Right now he's trying to threaten me out of testifying against him. That's what I intend on recording him doing. I was thinking about starting a conversation about the case, and asking him what he wants to do, what he'll do if I go to court.

I do have a order of protection, but not and exclusive one so he still gets to live here. I'm looking for a new place though.

I don't understand how come your living with him if he's so threatening? That just doesn't make any sense at all. It will certainly take credibility away from any claims of being in fear of your life.

You will be committing eavesdropping according to my interpretation

(a) A person commits eavesdropping when he:

(1) Knowingly and intentionally uses an eavesdropping device for hearing or recording

A tape recording device, attached to the phone line, is an eavesdropping device. If he lives with you, I assume you will be using a device like radio shack sells, which starts the recorder automatically whenever the phone's handset is lifted off of the receiver, whether your home or not. But even if you use some device you have to turn on yourself, it will be illegal unless:

(A) with the consent of all of the parties to such conversation.

So if your breaking the law to obtain this evidence, it will not be allowed.

One other thing, television is for news and entertainment and rarely depicts reality...

[CdwJava]

Some (maybe most) states have an exception when taping to intercept threats or obtaining evidence of a criminal conspiracy, larceny, or one of an assortment of crimes. So, there may be no crime to record the coversation depending on the circumstances.

You should really check with an attorney (DA, domestic violence advocate - someone) whether or not your situation will permit such a surreptitious recording or not.

My state might permit a recording in these circumstances (depending ont he details) and I cannot imagine CA is alone in that.

In fact:

"* * * The following activities shall be exempt from the provisions of this Article:
(i) Recording of a conversation made by or at the request of a person , not a law enforcement officer or agent of a law enforcement officer, who is a party to the conversation , under reasonable suspicion that another party to the conversation is committing, is about to commit, or has committed a criminal offense against the person or a member of his or her immediate household, and there is reason to believe that evidence of the criminal offense may be obtained by the recording."

A discussion of the law from the IL Attorney General in 1996 can be found at:

[url]http://www.ag.state.il.us/opinions/1996/96-036.html[/url]


- Carl

[outonbail]

Very good Carl, I hadn't seen that article. I read the link you provided (several times) it does go around in circles a bit, but it does end by saying it would be OK for one party of the conversation to record the conversation if the believe they will obtain evidence to a crime or one which is about to happen.

Now if the OP lives with the person she is trying to record, then she can not simply place a recording device on the phone line and record all his conversations. Only one she is party to and which she is told of a crime that has occurred, is happening or is about to happen.

They don't clearly identify what type of crime but it does hint at a crime that would harm the party or a member of their family. If I'm reading it correctly?

[CdwJava]

I would think that she might have an exception in there somewhere. However, there may also be subsequent court rulings that have further modified this. The OP should really speak to an attorney before doing this.

- Carl