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  1. #1
    BeingHarassed is offline Junior Member
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    Title 18 U.S.C Section 3571 AND 3559

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? CA

    This question has reference to the American Consumer Survey or the "long form" of the US census which is an intrusive document, demanding answers to very private personal, employment, financial and other questions. Amongst other things, the ACS asks if the respondent is employed, the sum total of his or her wages, tips, bonus and unearned income, if the respondent is elderly, his or her monthly mortgage payments and whether that payment includes property taxes, the number of rooms in the house, whether the house has PLUMBING and hot water facility, the amount of home owner's insurance being paid, if the respondent has full possession of his or her faculties, has a college degree and if yes, in what major, has any physical or psychological trouble running errands by themselves or climbing stairs, has any medical issues, gave birth in the past 12 months, has custody of grand-kids, where s/he works, how long it takes them to commute to said work, and how long it took the individual - particularly LAST WEEK - to get to work etc etc etc.

    This is just a SAMPLE of the questions being asked.

    In addition, the Census Bureau sends out some rather threatening literature with the survey that demands that the receiver answer the "long form" of the census survey or face fine pursuant to Title 13 of USC and that "Title 18 United States code section 3571 and 3559" that seemingly "amends" Title 13 to impose fines of "up to $5000" to residents who refuse to answer these intrusive questions

    I have NO idea why a law-abiding citizen would be interrogated and threatened by the federal government in such a manner. I would like to know if these sections actually provide for a $5000 fine if we attempt to protect our privacy and refuse to answer these extremely intrusive questions?

    Please advice.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by BeingHarassed; 07-18-2009 at 02:54 AM.
  2. #2
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeingHarassed View Post
    I would like to know if these sections actually provide for a $5000 fine if we attempt to protect our privacy and refuse to answer these extremely intrusive questions?
    Though I agree with the poster, this really isn't a legal question. It is kind of a political 'rant' about why the administration (obama) is being so intrusive on the census data... and whether a citizen can refuse to answer all the questions.
    The US Constitution (Article 1, Section 2) only provides for an 'enumeration' to be taken to determine the House of Representatives that each state is entitled to.

    The Congress has passed laws to try to force responses that go beyond the Constitutional requirement. This is in 13 USC 221, as follows:
    221. Refusal or neglect to answer questions; false answers
    (a) Whoever, being over eighteen years of age, refuses or willfully neglects, when requested by the Secretary, or by any other authorized officer or employee of the Department of Commerce or bureau or agency thereof acting under the instructions of the Secretary or authorized officer, to answer, to the best of his knowledge, any of the questions on any schedule submitted to him in connection with any census or survey provided for by subchapters I, II, IV, and V of chapter 5 of this title, applying to himself or to the family to which he belongs or is related, or to the farm or farms of which he or his family is the occupant, shall be fined not more than $100.
    (b) Whoever, when answering questions described in subsection (a) of this section, and under the conditions or circumstances described in such subsection, willfully gives any answer that is false, shall be fined not more than $500.
    (c) Notwithstanding any other provision of this title, no person shall be compelled to disclose information relative to his religious beliefs or to membership in a religious body.


    You are only required to answer "to the best of (your) knowledge" and to NOT provide "any answer that is false".
    So, the solution is simple. For any question that you don't want to answer, simply put 'UNKNOWN' or "Not Known".
  3. #3
    racer72 is offline Senior Member
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    It is kind of a political 'rant' about why the administration (obama) is being so intrusive on the census data
    Obama had nothing to do with this. This was started under the Shrub regime. These pre census questionaires have been around since 2005, I got one 2 years ago.
    If you feel my answer is rude, mean, snarky or in anyway not to your liking, I did my job. You don't need to tell me.

    No private messages, I do not reply to them.
  4. #4
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by racer72 View Post
    Obama had nothing to do with this. This was started under the Shrub regime. These pre census questionaires have been around since 2005, I got one 2 years ago.
    Yep... but not to the extent that the current 'American Community Survey' goes.
    And no, Bush didn't start all of this. Please get your FACTS straight and don't just spout nonsense.

    The subjects to be included on the 2010 Census and the American Community Survey were submitted to Congress in March 2007.... AFTER Pelosi and her band of crooks took over in 2006!!
  5. #5
    racer72 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JETX View Post
    Yep... but not to the extent that the current 'American Community Survey' goes.
    And no, Bush didn't start all of this. Please get your FACTS straight and don't just spout nonsense.

    The subjects to be included on the 2010 Census and the American Community Survey were submitted to Congress in March 2007.... AFTER Pelosi and her band of crooks took over in 2006!!
    And Shrub signed off on it. Nuff said.
    If you feel my answer is rude, mean, snarky or in anyway not to your liking, I did my job. You don't need to tell me.

    No private messages, I do not reply to them.
  6. #6
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by racer72 View Post
    And Shrub signed off on it. Nuff said.
    What the hell are you talking about... there is NO 'sign off'... this is NOT a bill to be signed... this is a COMMITTEE issue.
    And yep, Pelosi, Reid and the other brain-dead liberal 'warm-fuzzy, kumbaya' idiots created this monster.

    You are so blinded by BUSH... that you can't even get your history straight.
  7. #7
    BeingHarassed is offline Junior Member
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    Hi Jetx,

    Thanks for responding. I have been repeatedly hounded by the census bureau field rep, and have been subject to unsolicited phone calls and personal (UNANNOUNCED) visits. I have been sent multiple mails from the local district office and the worse part is that the last mail addressed me BY NAME, rather than the generic "RESIDENT". So, they have been looking up my info and already seem to know quite a bit about me.

    Does not the Fourth Amendment protect me against unnecessary searches and interrogation and / or uphold my right to privacy in my own home?

    I an really at my wits' end ... the brochure claims that the federal government conducts this survey to benefit the community, but how does knowing what my mortgage is and what portion of my mortgage is property tax "help" my "local community"????? What business is it of Uncle Sam if I am married and if so, if this is my first marriage?! How does it help my community if I have custody of any grand-kids and if I am not in full possession of my faculties and / or have trouble climbing stairs?


    If I refuse to submit to this interrogation, does the law (the title and sections mentioned above) actually provide for Uncle Sam to criminally prosecute me, fine me and / or send me to jail as the brochure claims it can?? Please help... I am sick of being harassed by the Gestapo in this manner and I am a law abiding citizen who has never even had a speeding ticket up until now. Please help... I am being threatened and hounded like a criminal on the run by our government.

    Thanks for helping me out.
    Last edited by BeingHarassed; 07-18-2009 at 06:25 PM.
  8. #8
    justalayman is offline Senior Member
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    Does not the Fourth Amendment protect me against unnecessary searches and interrogation and / or uphold my right to privacy in my own home?
    privacy, no. unneccesary searches, no. interrogation, no

    the 4th states

    Amendment IV

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
    additionally, the 4th is not applicable to the situation at all.

    I an really at my wits' end ... the brochure claims that the federal government conducts this survey to benefit the community, but how does knowing what my mortgage is and what portion of my mortgage is property tax "help" my "local community"?????
    If you quit being paranoid about it and think about what they are asking, there truly is use for what they ask. This allows them to make determinations of the state of the citizens, as well as the state of their living standards. As to the health questions; I suspect it is a basis for attempting to assist in determining future costs of the health system they are now working on.


    [B]
    If I refuse to submit to this interrogation, does the law (the title and sections mentioned above) actually provide for Uncle Sam to criminally prosecute me, fine me and / or send me to jail as the brochure claims it can?? Please help... I am sick of being harassed by the Gestapo in this manner and I am a law abiding citizen who has never even had a speeding ticket up until now. Please help... I am being threatened and hounded like a criminal on the run by our government.
    You won't be a criminal, at least concerning this, unless you refuse to answer. While I, and many others believe it is intrusive, as I stated, there is use for the info gleaned and, unless you can afford many dollars to fight the requirement, and most likely lose anyway, it is one of the "if I have to I have to but I don't like it" actions the government requires of its' citizens.

    anyway, although this census may be more intrusive than the 2000 census, the 2000 census did include many intrusive questions as well.

    go to this link. There are explanations along with the questions of the 2000 census questionnaire.

    [url]http://www.census.gov/dmd/www/pdf/09h_di.pdf[/url]

    and here is a list of questions and reasoning for those questions for the 2010 census questionnaire.

    [url]http://2010.census.gov/2010census/pdf/2010ACSnotebook.pdf[/url]
  9. #9
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    Luckily, I have not been approached by Acorn... excuse me, the 'census folks'. But when I am, you can bet I will answer the information I want... and won't be able to answer the things that are 'not known'. Let them prove that I knew them or lied in my answer!!!
  10. #10
    BeingHarassed is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JETX View Post
    Luckily, I have not been approached by Acorn... excuse me, the 'census folks'. But when I am, you can bet I will answer the information I want... and won't be able to answer the things that are 'not known'. Let them prove that I knew them or lied in my answer!!!

    I am especially angry about the probing questions into the physical and psychological health, marital status, race and the IQ level of the residents of the household. These questions are followed by others that demand to know the fertility status of all the females living in that household. Is it just me or is does anyone else also see a sinister undertone here?

    Thanks, JETX, for your suggestion. NO, it is unknown to me whether I am of sound body and sane mind. NO, I do not know what my IQ is. NO, I am unaware of my abilities to run errands, climb stairs and or otherwise be out in the world by myself and NO, I do NOT know the fertility status of the females in my home ...
    Last edited by BeingHarassed; 07-19-2009 at 02:28 AM.
  11. #11
    justalayman is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeingHarassed View Post
    NO, it is unknown to me whether I am of sound body and sane mind. NO, I do not know what my IQ is. NO, I am unaware of my abilities to run errand...
    there you go. Answer that you are a loon and the rest is defensible regardless of how you answer.

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