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Victim having problems with PD & Prosecutor? What to do?

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nsnryan

Junior Member
I am a fraud investigator for a financial company that provides bill payment automation for mortgage holders in Michigan.

Through the use of a falsely filed affadavit (under the penalty of purjury) with her federally insured bank, one of our members caused four ACH transactions to be returned causing a loss to our company. This fits a few different potential charges: theft by wire, theft by false pretense, use of a revoked financial transaction device, bank fraud, uttering and publishing, perjury, and some others.

After contacting various federal and state agencies, we were told that the best option was to contact the local PD in the jurisdiction where the false affadavit was signed. We did so and a report was taken and subsequently lost. We then filed a second report. This second report was sent to the county prosecutor who furthered the case for more information.

The information in response to the further was provided to the detective and in turn the prosecutor who declined to issue a warrant stating that it was a civil case. Upon contacting the prosecutor for an explanation of her findings, it was determined that there were some things missing from the original report that she was unaware of, so she furthered the case a second time with the understanding a crime truely was commited with intent.

I provided a response to the second further to the detective, and he dropped the ball. When I called to follow up, he was no longer a detective there. So, I spoke with a Sergeant who said he would do some research. Meanwhile I contacted the Prosecutor's Office who informed me that the Prosecutor working the case was no longer there and that they recieved no response to the second further. They further informed me that although they show the status as waiting for a response, they cannot locate the file to tell me anything else. Apparently it's been lost.

A new detective contacted me in response to my call to the Sergeant, who kept giving me the run around and finally told me that their file was also missing and he would have to do some research. It is determined that they will have to create a whole new report so I faxed the detective everything I had. A month later I contact him and he hasn't even looked at the fax. At that point I contacted the Captain of that division via email and the only response I recieved was a letter from the detective telling me their system shows the PO's office as declining a warrant.

I called the detective and captain and left voicemails explaining that this status was not considering the second further which is shown open at the PO's office and that the status was changed after the last date they show in their computer.

It's now another month later and despite numerous messages for the detective and the captain, I am getting no response. Can anyone give me some advice?

In all, a great deal of time has elapsed and i'm not sure how to proceed. It seems that the PD and the PO are incompetent, so should I just consider this a complete loss and give up or keep persuing the matter? Would going to the press be apropriate, I mean I don't think it's necessarily a good idea to let criminals in that city know their crimes will not be prosecuted, but I need to somehow prompt action. It seems suspicious that both the PD and the PO can loose files, and that the detective AND captain are unwilling to call me back. Makes me wonder - Is the suspect someone's sister or daughter?What is the name of your state?
 


nsnryan

Junior Member
Not new to the company, but this is luckily the first case of fraud we've had to deal. In that aspect, yes, this is new to me. Legal process however is not entirely new to me although the complete lack of action at the PD and PO does have me baffeled. Not really, I know they're too busy to care about a financial crime near but under $1000, yet it is still a crime. A felony at that.
 
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rmet4nzkx

Senior Member
nsnryan said:
Not new to the company, but this is luckily the first case of fraud we've had to deal. In that aspect, yes, this is new to me. Legal process however is not entirely new to me although the complete lack of action at the PD and PO does have me baffeled. Not really, I know they're too busy to care about a financial crime near but under $1000, yet it is still a crime. A felony at that.
Then you need to discuss this with your supervisors in how they want to proceed, perhaps your employer has a legal department?
 

nsnryan

Junior Member
No, what I NEED is the advice and opinion of those with at least some experience in interacting with the police department and prosecutor's office. That's why i'm here.

I think you are missing the point. I'm not a general office peon who reports to a departmental supervisor who has a huge manual with every if and or but. I am the decision maker on how to proceed, but being inexperienced in dealing with the PD and PO, I am here asking for some advice. As an informed person, what would you do?

We are not a fortune 500 company with many tiers of supervison and procedures. Nor do we have a corporate attorney, let alone an entire legal department. We are a small company, sailing on waters that to us are uncharted and I was hoping for some constructive input.

Apparently i must have missed the thread that states that this forum is only for use by suspects & criminals needing advice, not the victim of the crime.
 
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rmet4nzkx

Senior Member
Unfortunately we are not responsible for your incompetence or the small size of the company for which you work. It has nothing to do with being a victim or a criminal. The police department doesn't replace the need for your company to have legal counsel.
 

averad

Member
nsnryan said:
No, what I NEED is the advice and opinion of those with at least some experience in interacting with the police department and prosecutor's office. That's why i'm here.

I think you are missing the point. I'm not a general office peon who reports to a departmental supervisor who has a huge manual with every if and or but. I am the decision maker on how to proceed, but being inexperienced in dealing with the PD and PO, I am here asking for some advice. As an informed person, what would you do?

We are not a fortune 500 company with many tiers of supervison and procedures. Nor do we have a corporate attorney, let alone an entire legal department. We are a small company, sailing on waters that to us are uncharted and I was hoping for some constructive input.

Apparently i must have missed the thread that states that this forum is only for use by suspects & criminals needing advice, not the victim of the crime.
LOL, man if I was the decision maker of a company I would not be online posting questions to random people. usually this would be something you would want to keep internal and have a legal representative review and manage.

Think about the legal ramifications if you do not do this properly, log off and pick up your phone and spend a little money to protect the company (If not can I submit my resume?).
 

nsnryan

Junior Member
Unfortunately we are not responsible for your incompetence or the small size of the company for which you work. It has nothing to do with being a victim or a criminal. The police department doesn't replace the need for your company to have legal counsel.
I never said you were responsible for anything. I was asking what you would do in the same situation, and it seems that you would simply hire someone else to handle the issue rather than advancing your knowledge.

I'm not asking for legal counsel, just trying to generate some fresh ideas or some inside knowledge of what might elicit the proper attention from the parties involved.

Furthermore I fail to see where I am incompetent. The lack of experience in itself is not an indication of incompetence, and since you do not know me personally that statement was meritless.

As for the small size of the company, I do not see it as a negative other than the obvious fact that we are limited on resources to hire counsel when it is not needed. It's simple really: a law was broken, the police department doesnt care, and I wanted to know how to press the issue.

The only assistance I feel a paid attorney could provide is additional pressure for action through established contacts. And I really don't feel like paying $250 an hour for someone to share their network just to have the police department take a crime seriously.



LOL, man if I was the decision maker of a company I would not be online posting questions to random people. usually this would be something you would want to keep internal and have a legal representative review and manage.

Think about the legal ramifications if you do not do this properly, log off and pick up your phone and spend a little money to protect the company (If not can I submit my resume?).
And why exactly do you feel the posting of a question online would have any negative impact? Thats like telling your children that asking questions is bad. lol Isn't that the point of this forum?

I don't see any specifics that would allow one to determine anything even remotely close to confidential information. Worst case scenario would be for the PD to recognize that this thread matches an issue they are working (or not working) on and become upset. I mean really, what are they going to do? Stop communicating with me? Oh wait, that means they'd have to be returning calls to begin with.

And what legal ramifications are you referring to? Just curious since I see absolutely nothing improper about the questions i've asked. If you would like to submit your resume, you are more than welcome as i'd much prefer that I didn't have to deal with this.

Regardless, the mood on this forum is not one that seems to be one of the desire to offer assistance and opinions so I will consider this question closed. Good day gentlemen.
 
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CdwJava

Senior Member
From the law enforcement perspective, I have to say that if these agencies are really saying that they "lost" all these reports, there are som serious problems with the way they do business and I would venture to guess that any prosecution on this matter initiated based on an investigation by these folks would have sufficient holes to allow a dump truck to be driven through.

If I were you, I would consider taking this through a civil court in order to get your money back. And, perhaps, contact the feds (the FBI) and see if they are willing to take up the ball on the matter. Depending on the amount of the loss it might not be worthwhile to do any of these things.

Also, to be brutally honest, most police departments do NOT know what to do with this kind of thing. In all but the largest of agencies, this kind of investigation is way beyond the means and the training of any of the officers. In some counties they have DA Investigators or contractors that can help flush out the case, but very often they rely solely on documents provided to them. And if they cannot locate the suspect for a statement or follow-up, very often the case is left unprosecuted on the local level.

Sadly, this is an area of crime that is beyond the scope and experience of the vast majority of law enforcement agencies. It is also why many banks and other institutions do their own follow-up and investigations on these matters.

- Carl
 

garrula lingua

Senior Member
OP, you describe the 'crime' as:

"one of our members caused four ACH transactions to be returned causing a loss to our company"

Even at this late date, you do not, clearly, describe acts that constitute a crime.

The fact that a police report was taken, does not mean there is a 'triable' crime.
The filing Prosecutor has to decide whether the 'corpus' of the crime, and the identification of the 'defendant', can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt.

Sounds like you have a civil suit.

PS: I doubt if the reports were lost. I believe people were saying, "You deal with him". "No, you deal with him" etc.

The Prosecutor would be wasting gov money (and putting all of you through unncecessary stress) if s/he filed cases which were unprovable at trial.
 

CdwJava

Senior Member
garrula lingua said:
PS: I doubt if the reports were lost. I believe people were saying, "You deal with him". "No, you deal with him" etc.
Very true.

Plus, for some reason many people who talk to the police seem to believe that a "report" was generated. Very often this is not the case. It could be that the officer or detective took some notes and said hbe'd look in to it and was later told by his boss that this was a civil matter, or, they made a CAD entry or other brief note of the contact within the department's system but not a "report".

If I wrote a report for every conversation I had with people who thought they had a crime, I'd be in the office all day just typing.

- Carl
 

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