Walart / Sam's Club Exit Searches

[kentulsa]

What is the name of your state? Oklahoma

I frequent Walmart and Sam's Club like many million others.

I head to the check out, pay for my goods and receive a bill of sale.

At this point, I believe that these goods are legally MY property.

Upon exiting the store, I am approached by a Store employee to "check" my purchases.

Does Walmart have the legal right to conduct these searches without probable cause?

Do I have the right to refuse and can I sue if they are wrong?

Am I responsible for the accuracy of the checkout procedure and any errors that could have been made by a cashier? How can I make Walmart solely responsible for my checkout if I am to share in the responsibility?

If they do have a right to search, where does their right end? In the parking lot? At my home?

If Walmart does have the right, then do I also have the right to search anyone on my property?

In my mind, theft prevention methods are not an excuse to violate my fellow citizen's rights.

Hire competent, honest employees.

Thanks for your advice.

[You Are Guilty]

[quote=kentulsa]

Originally Posted by kentulsa

Does Walmart have the legal right to conduct these searches without probable cause?

You bet. They also have the legal right to ask to look in your underwear.

Originally Posted by kentulsa

Do I have the right to refuse and can I sue if they are wrong?

You most certainly have the right to refuse, and in return, they most certainly may tell you never to come back. You can sue anyone for anything, since they are not "wrong" about anything, you'll lose.

Originally Posted by kentulsa

Am I responsible for the accuracy of the checkout procedure and any errors that could have been made by a cashier?

Usually not.

Originally Posted by kentulsa

How can I make Walmart solely responsible for my checkout if I am to share in the responsibility?

I suggest a sandwich board that says "I DISCLAIM ALL LIABILITY FOR INCORRECT CHECKOUT PROCEDURES" and wear it while shopping.

Originally Posted by kentulsa

If they do have a right to search, where does their right end? In the parking lot? At my home?

See first two answers.

Originally Posted by kentulsa

If Walmart does have the right, then do I also have the right to search anyone on my property?

You have the right to request it, sure.

Sounds to me like you are looking for a way to get some quick cash by suing?

Did you loose sleep trying to come up with this one?

If your an Honest person and didn't do anything wrong (like stealing)...what does it hurt to let them check your purchase? It takes what....a whole whopping 5 seconds? It's not like they are asking to go through your purse or wallet!

[kentulsa]

YAG:

I enjoyed the sandwich board scenario humor, but I actually agree with you. It would probably be the legal way to do it.

I still don't understand your first two answers.

First, who cares if Walmart won't have me back in their store. It's their economic loss, not mine. I'm not giving up my rights to shop in their store for any reason. I'm fine with Target.

Secondly, If I refuse, would they have to arrest me before they can search my property or can they search without an arrest? Then if they are wrong, I do have a right to sue on false arrest.

You are probably thinking....just quit shopping at Walmart stupid!!

If these are the legal condtions of me entering their store, then I probably will.

YAG will probably respond to your recent post, but it seems like you are just looking to start trouble with Walmart or Sam's club. Why? Are you just curious about policies and procedures or are you really thinking of pursuing suit against them if possible? Again...Why?

Now I'm curious!

[You Are Guilty]

Originally Posted by kentulsa

YAG:

I enjoyed the sandwich board scenario humor, but I actually agree with you. It would probably be the legal way to do it.

I still don't understand your first two answers.

First, who cares if Walmart won't have me back in their store. It's their economic loss, not mine. I'm not giving up my rights to shop in their store for any reason. I'm fine with Target.

I agree, but that's their decision.

Secondly, If I refuse, would they have to arrest me before they can search my property or can they search without an arrest? Then if they are wrong, I do have a right to sue on false arrest.

If you refuse, they either 1) let you go without incident (and possibly ban you from the store) or 2) detain you for a reasonable amount of time to determine if you did, in fact, attempt to shoplift. If they stop you and you did not steal anything, that does not automatically give you catre blance to start a false imprisonment suit. There are a number of grounds upon which they can validly detain you and investigate, even if you did not steal anything.

You are probably thinking....just quit shopping at Walmart stupid!!

The thought did cross my mind.

If these are the legal condtions of me entering their store, then I probably will.

And cross off Target, Sams Club, Costco, etc., etc. More and more stores are using this to try and stem the $4 billion per year losses they incur from shiplifters.

[BelizeBreeze]

We have a phrase for this in my neck of the woods....

"Deep-Pocket fishing"

[Curt581]

Originally Posted by BelizeBreeze

We have a phrase for this in my neck of the woods....

"Deep-Pocket fishing"

I thought that was called "pocket pool"...

[kentulsa]

I have no intention of pursing a suit of any kind. Never have filed a suit of any kind,ever.

It is a matter of principle. Or did some of you forget that some things are based on principle and not money.

I "feel" accused of shoplifting when a company searches my person for no cause and as an honest person, I don't like it.

Sure I have nothing to hide, but that doesn't mean I am going to allow the police department to come to my house and search it everyday to make sure I haven't done anything wrong for no reasonable cause.

It's my right.

Why I am really asking is that the next time WalMart ask's, I want to tell them NO and not go to jail.

Sorry that it isn't as exciting as some questions on here, but principles and the law was what I thought this forum was about.

If you were implying "nothing more than principles", then why in your original post did you state the following? NOTICE THE BOLD PRINT IN THE ORIGINAL THREAD!

I frequent Walmart and Sam's Club like many million others.

I head to the check out, pay for my goods and receive a bill of sale.

At this point, I believe that these goods are legally MY property.

Upon exiting the store, I am approached by a Store employee to "check" my purchases.

Does Walmart have the legal right to conduct these searches without probable cause?

Do I have the right to refuse and can I sue if they are wrong?

Am I responsible for the accuracy of the checkout procedure and any errors that could have been made by a cashier? How can I make Walmart solely responsible for my checkout if I am to share in the responsibility?

If they do have a right to search, where does their right end? In the parking lot? At my home?

If Walmart does have the right, then do I also have the right to search anyone on my property?

In my mind, theft prevention methods are not an excuse to violate my fellow citizen's rights.

Hire competent, honest employees.

Thanks for your advice.

HMMMMM Do I sense a change in tune here?

[kentulsa]

Shel:

I think that you will find that when you do a search it comes up bold.

The original message contains no bolding of any type.

This would lead me to believe that it is YOUR search criteria that lead you to this thread and not your curiosity about principles.

[justalayman]

Originally Posted by shellandty

Sounds to me like you are looking for a way to get some quick cash by suing?

Did you loose sleep trying to come up with this one?

If your an Honest person and didn't do anything wrong (like stealing)...what does it hurt to let them check your purchase? It takes what....a whole whopping 5 seconds? It's not like they are asking to go through your purse or wallet!

I have to take issue with this. I AM an honest person myself with no criminal record at all. This actually happened to me very recently. The rfid detecters went off as I walked through them. I had purchased a new dvd player and (I presume) the cashier either didn't do the thing they do to inactivate the rfid tag or it didn't work correctly. I refused to stop when asked and stated that if they actually thought I stole something that they should detain me and call the police (while I continued to walk to my car) but if they don't have any proof then leave me alone. Granted they have the right to not allow me into their store ever again but I feel this is just an intrusion that I was not going to allow. They have done nothing at this point although they did record my license plate number. (I feared the police would roll up any minute)

It isn't a matter of "a whole whopping 5 seconds" at all. It is the fact that I know I did not steal anything. I felt it as an attack on my integrity. Yes, I know they do not know me personally and therefor could not judge any personal traits. I just don't feel as if I should have to prove myself not a thief unless they have some proof that I am. Yes I understand they probably construe the rfid detectors to be justifiable cause that I "MAY" have stolen something. I believe that knowing the lack of dependability of the entire rfid security system has that they should not be able to use this as sole justification to search somebody.

And no, I did not do this so I could sue. It really was just the principle of the whole thing.

[gawm]

i felt it as an attack on my integrity

if you had any integrity you would not be shopping at walmart in the first place!

[CdwJava]

Originally Posted by gawm

if you had any integrity you would not be shopping at walmart in the first place!

I have to ask ... why not?

- Carl

[CdwJava]

Originally Posted by justalayman

It isn't a matter of "a whole whopping 5 seconds" at all. It is the fact that I know I did not steal anything. I felt it as an attack on my integrity. Yes, I know they do not know me personally and therefor could not judge any personal traits. I just don't feel as if I should have to prove myself not a thief unless they have some proof that I am. Yes I understand they probably construe the rfid detectors to be justifiable cause that I "MAY" have stolen something. I believe that knowing the lack of dependability of the entire rfid security system has that they should not be able to use this as sole justification to search somebody.

And no, I did not do this so I could sue. It really was just the principle of the whole thing.

And they coul dhave lawfully detained you and called the police. Or, detained you long enough to determine if you did indeed commit the theft. The law does not require them to be correct or perfect, only that there is sufficient probable cause to believe a crime had been committed and that you had committed the crime. Had they detained you, it would have been lawful and you would have had no cause of action.

- Carl