How to negotiate with the other party's insurance company

seitzhall · #1 06-17-2009, 09:33 PM

I recently had a car accident. It was the other party's fault. My car (1999 Camry) was declared a total loss. I was very upset because it was a very good and reliable car. I can't imagine the pain and hassle to replace it. The more upsetting news was that the other party's insurance company sent me the valuation report generated by CCC. The value ($4500 according to CCC) was way lower than what I got (with average price of $6500) by researching online myself. I wrote a demand letter including over 60 same year and make car as my Camry within 200 miles from where I live. Today I received an email from the adjuster. They said they would not increase the settlement amount. They already took away the rental.
I was furious when I saw the email because they did not even give me a second offer. What options do I have other than accept this insulting low settlement amount? I do not have collision coverage on my car so filing with my own insurance company is out. What tools can I use to fight the other party's insurance company? Do I have to go through legal actions?
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
BTW, I live in Georgia.

dawnd470 · #2 06-17-2009, 10:08 PM

Hello.....I saw your post as I was browsing, and it caught my attention....I'm not sure where you've been researching, but from what I've found, the insurance company's offer sounds pretty fair. Without knowing the actual condition of the car (saying it's "reliable" doesn't say anything about the total condition), it would be hard to say if it's worth more. But for a 10 yr old car, which probably has a lot of miles on it, I doubt you'd get more for it if it hadn't been wrecked and you'd tried to sell it. My suggestion would be to take the offer and use it as a down payment on a low-cost new or certified used car.

No, I'm not a lawyer, but have been in a similar situation. Sadly, our belongings, including our vehicles, are rarely actually worth what we think they're worth. It won't do any good to keep fighting with the insurance company...their offer is a fair one, just not what you had hoped for.

Good luck to you!

seitzhall · #3 06-17-2009, 10:32 PM

Thank you for your suggestion, dawnd470!

I used the same source as CCC, autotrader dot com. I did not think it was a fair value simply because CCC only listed those vehicles with lowest listing price on autotraders.com while ignoring over 40 cars priced at $6000, $7000 even $8000. When I called a few of CCC reported dealership I found that those vehicles do not have a clean history. The blue book value of my car is $5900, NADA is $6250. That's why I think my car is worth more than $4500.

When I wrote the demand letter I was expecting at least a second offer from the insurance company. I have read a lot of articles online on how CCC has been providing unfair market value in favor of the insurance company.

ecmst12 · #4 06-17-2009, 11:06 PM

Thing is that CCC report will stand up in court over KBB or NADA. The methodology is MUCH stronger. Does your vehicle have the EXACT same mileage, options, and condition as the higher priced autotrader listings? CCC doesn't just find comparable listings, it adjusts them based on how they differ from your specific car (in average private owner condition as opposed to dealer ready, and any differences in mileage and options). They don't have to negotiate because they know their position is solid, legally speaking.

seitzhall · #5 06-18-2009, 02:27 PM

I think CCC's valuation methodology is very much flawed! I called those low priced vehicles listed in their report one by one, most of them were either sold long ago or had been involved in a car accident or had other bad histories. In CCC's own marketing material, they said they can help their customers, the insurance companies, to lower their claim cost by 30%.

I just want to know is there a way for me to dispute this value, such as file a complaint to GA Department of Insurance if I could not agree with their settlement amount. Do I have the right to hire an independent appraisal to value my car??

Thanks!

ecmst12 · #6 06-18-2009, 02:49 PM

Do you have any idea what CCC's methodology is?

Of COURSE the lower priced vehicles sold faster - but they sold. Proving that price is closer to the moving price then the listings you found.

You have the right to hire whoever you want, just be aware that expense would be completely out of your pocket and you would have no case to ask for reimbursement from them (any more then they can charge you for the cost of the CCC report).

If you feel you can prove the car is worth more then they are offering, then don't accept the offer and sue the driver for the amount you feel the car is worth.

seitzhall · #7 06-18-2009, 03:04 PM

Hi ecmst12,

I don't understand why you are so on the insurance company and CCC's side. I am just a victim of a car accident trying to protect my own right. I was dragged into this whole thing just because some teenage hit me on my way to work. I did my own research and I think I know the "methodology" of CCC more than you thought. Check out these articles,

[url=http://www.stephencryanpc.com/CM/Custom/TOCArticles.asp]Accident Articles | Scottsdale Total Loss Claim Attorney Arizona Insurane Company Settlement Lawyer AZ Injury Accident Crash Wreck Law[/url]

[url=http://ezinearticles.com/?CCC-Valuescope-and-USAA-Conspiring-to-Defraud,-Committing-RICO-Act-Violations?&id=1360684]CCC Valuescope & USAA Conspiring to Defraud, Committing RICO Act Violations?[/url]

Again I appreciate any suggestions anyone can provide.

ecmst12 · #8 06-18-2009, 03:10 PM

I was, at my last job, extensively trained on why we used CCC and why other value reports were inflated an inaccurate. The level of market research done by CCC just blows away any other valuation company out there right now. Having read them myself frequently, I think they are clear and well put together and it should be easy to see where and why they came up with the number they got. You also haven't given the mileage of your car or described the condition and the options. Finally, $4500 for a 10 year old car is a VERY good price! I've seen Mercedes and BMWs of that age that were worth less.

If you want to dispute their offer, your recourse (like I already told you) is a lawsuit. See what a judge thinks.

Stevef · #9 06-18-2009, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecmst12

If you want to dispute their offer, your recourse (like I already told you) is a lawsuit. See what a judge thinks.

ecmst12,

In your experience, in a case like this, is the first offer by the insurance company a take it or leave it offer?

I was going through the 'negotiation' help section of freeadvice.com, and it states that the first offer is always a low offer. It didn't specify if that was for injuries or property damage only.

Similarly to the OP, my vehicle was totaled on my way to work. KBB says it's worth $4600, NADA says $3200, but autotrader doesn't have anything in my state under $6000. I haven't gotten an offer yet.

Country Living · #10 06-18-2009, 03:57 PM

seitzhall, this is an emotional issue for you. You had a paid-for car that was in good shape and got you where you needed to go. You probably planned on keeping it for several more years. Then Junior hit you and your car was totaled.

You’ll probably have to take out a loan to get another one (a debt you had not planned on for quite some time) and it just doesn’t same fair. In your eyes you were not made whole.

Ecmst12 is correct in her statements. The truth is a ten year old car simply doesn’t have much value to anyone except you. My daughter just went through the same thing. Identical. Teenager hit her, her paid-for car was totaled, and she thought she should have enough money to buy another car. In reality - she did. She got more money that she would have had she traded in the car for another one. She got at least the amount of money she would have received had she sold the car outright. But, in her mind she didn’t have enough money to make her whole. She liked her car and had planned on keeping it for years.

She called me before she called the insurance company and I told her the same thing ecmst12 is telling you - this is just the way it is. I also told her if she was going to call the insurance company she had better drop the attitude. I had her make a list of questions - they had to be fact-based and not emotionally based. She dropped the attitude and she called the adjuster. She started off asking for help in understanding the process. Then she used her list to ask specific questions such as was sales tax included in the amount as well as some other things. I advised her to have only one emotional statement (She chose “I feel like I’m losing here because my paid-for car was totaled and I’m going to have to go into debt to get another one.”) and that’s all she got. The adjuster didn’t need to hear her whine. They had a very good conversation and she felt better. Not perfectly happy; but, better. Then she moved on with her life.

Good luck to you.

ecmst12 · #11 06-18-2009, 04:01 PM

There is generally not a lot of negotiation when it comes to property damage claims. In the 2 years that I handled claims, never ONCE did I have anyone submit any credible evidence that their vehicle was worth more then CCC said it was worth. Once they read the value report, they didn't even try.

Stevef · #12 06-18-2009, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecmst12

There is generally not a lot of negotiation when it comes to property damage claims. In the 2 years that I handled claims, never ONCE did I have anyone submit any credible evidence that their vehicle was worth more then CCC said it was worth. Once they read the value report, they didn't even try.

Thanks. I guess I'll have to wait and see.

seitzhall · #13 06-18-2009, 04:39 PM

Thank you country living. I admit that I probably AM a little too attached to the car. I bought the car five years ago and have never had any problem with it. I am in grad school now and did not plan to buy another one before graduation. I am totally relying on this car to go to school and get to my part-time job to support myself. I guess I lost my cool after the accident.

To ecmst12, my car was a Camry LE and had 117,000 miles on it. It had a few other options that can push the value up a little more. I got four new tires about 8 months ago, new brakes two days before the accident (I feel lucky that I changed the brake), and a new timing belt. But according to the insurance adjuster, it does not add value to my car. Anyway, I thank you for your advice. I will try to talk to their supervisor one more time and see if I can get something more.

Country Living · #14 06-18-2009, 05:02 PM

I'm afraid I have bad news for you. New tires, a brake job, and a timing belt won't add any additional value. A car is assumed to have good tires, brakes, and runs.

I have a theory that right after you put money into a car something happens to it. I'm getting ready to put a rebuilt engine into my 1996 Land Cruiser. There is no way I'm going to get additional money if the car is totaled because a car has to have an engine to be a car.

I figure if I can get through six months the jinx will be lifted.

ecmst12 · #15 06-18-2009, 06:06 PM

New tires might add a very small amount of value. The brakes and timing belt are maintenence items and also shouldn't add much....but since it was so recent, you can always send in your receipts and ask them to add it into the report; it might do something. If not, at least you checked.

CL, a rebuilt engine will ABSOLUTELY add value to your vehicle. A 15 year old car with a (basically) new engine is definitely worth more then one with a 15 year old engine. A 15 year old engine, even if it runs, could die at any moment; a newly rebuilt one is going to be much more reliable. Something like that which actually extends the life of the car will definitely affect the value. The other thing which will add value is a fresh paint job; makes an old car look new again!