Stop Payment on a Check - Theft?

[aw6196]

What is the name of your state? NJ

Not sure what information is relavant, so here goes.

We hired someone to take down a tree (i will refer to him as person X). He brought along another "helper" (person Y). The tree was on a wooded lot behind our main property.

They successfully took down the tree, but, their truck (or whatever you call the thing) got stuck. They (against my permission) used a larger truck to get the other truck out. In the process, they totally tore up about 1/2 of my property, leaving huge tracks, some over a foot deep.

At the end of the job, they agreed that they would come back to fix the damage they had done. Strangely, person X (the one we hired) requested that we write out the check to person Y (the helper). We did (mistake???). Check amount: $800

The next day, I called person X and asked him to NOT deposit the check until they came back to finish the job (fixing the damage). He said he would "try to get a hold of person Y". Of course, we had no way to contact person Y. I wasn't satisfied with his response, so, to protect myself, I put a stop payment on the check just in case.

We waited 10 weeks for them to come back and complete the job -- they never did. So, we got quotes - 7 of them. 6 out of 7 were for more than they charged us to take down the tree (averaging about $1200 - $400 more than the charge to take down the tree), so, we went with the cheapest one ($400) in order to try to get SOME MONEY to the guys that took down the tree.

In the meantime, person Y came to the house (about 11 weeks after he took down the tree -- after he figured out we put a stop payment) yelling and screaming. Note he never came back to fix the damage, but was there immediately once he knew he didn't have his money. My wife tried to explain to him that he did not fulfil his contract and fix the damage, and we had to get someone else to do it (actually, the workers were there starting to fix the damage as he was there), but he did not want to hear it. He wanted ALL of his money, and assumed no responsibility for the enormous damage he had done.

In the meantime, the people we have hired to fix the damage have not yet completed the work (not sure if they ever will). We went with the cheapest, and - well, got what we paid for I guess. Are all contractors this way?

Today, we received a call from the police department -- person Y is filing a compaint, saying we STOLE his money. I presume he knows if he sues us in court, he will lose, so he is trying to frame it as a criminal action that we did by putting the stop payment.

I can certainly pay him, and then sue him, but, I suspect I will never see my money again even when I win. What I will be left with is payment for him, plus, payment to fix the damage he did.

To add to the confusion, we hired person X, and person Y is the one filing the compaint because the check was written to him. Who do we sue if we have to? There was no written contract (another mistake?), only a verbal agreement.

My question -- what the heck do I do? I don't want to break any laws, but do I not have a right to protect my money with the stop payment, or, can this in fact be viewed as me stealing his money?

Thanks -

[Veronica1228]

Originally Posted by aw6196

What is the name of your state? NJ

Not sure what information is relavant, so here goes.

We hired someone to take down a tree (i will refer to him as person X). He brought along another "helper" (person Y). The tree was on a wooded lot behind our main property.

They successfully took down the tree, but, their truck (or whatever you call the thing) got stuck. They (against my permission) used a larger truck to get the other truck out. In the process, they totally tore up about 1/2 of my property, leaving huge tracks, some over a foot deep.

At the end of the job, they agreed that they would come back to fix the damage they had done. Strangely, person X (the one we hired) requested that we write out the check to person Y (the helper). We did (mistake???). Check amount: $800

The next day, I called person X and asked him to NOT deposit the check until they came back to finish the job (fixing the damage). He said he would "try to get a hold of person Y". Of course, we had no way to contact person Y. I wasn't satisfied with his response, so, to protect myself, I put a stop payment on the check just in case.

We waited 10 weeks for them to come back and complete the job -- they never did. So, we got quotes - 7 of them. 6 out of 7 were for more than they charged us to take down the tree (averaging about $1200 - $400 more than the charge to take down the tree), so, we went with the cheapest one ($400) in order to try to get SOME MONEY to the guys that took down the tree.

In the meantime, person Y came to the house (about 11 weeks after he took down the tree -- after he figured out we put a stop payment) yelling and screaming. Note he never came back to fix the damage, but was there immediately once he knew he didn't have his money. My wife tried to explain to him that he did not fulfil his contract and fix the damage, and we had to get someone else to do it (actually, the workers were there starting to fix the damage as he was there), but he did not want to hear it. He wanted ALL of his money, and assumed no responsibility for the enormous damage he had done.

In the meantime, the people we have hired to fix the damage have not yet completed the work (not sure if they ever will). We went with the cheapest, and - well, got what we paid for I guess. Are all contractors this way?

Today, we received a call from the police department -- person Y is filing a compaint, saying we STOLE his money. I presume he knows if he sues us in court, he will lose, so he is trying to frame it as a criminal action that we did by putting the stop payment.

I can certainly pay him, and then sue him, but, I suspect I will never see my money again even when I win. What I will be left with is payment for him, plus, payment to fix the damage he did.

To add to the confusion, we hired person X, and person Y is the one filing the compaint because the check was written to him. Who do we sue if we have to? There was no written contract (another mistake?), only a verbal agreement.

My question -- what the heck do I do? I don't want to break any laws, but do I not have a right to protect my money with the stop payment, or, can this in fact be viewed as me stealing his money?

Thanks -

First of all, you have every right to place a stop payment on a check, but usually banks prefer that you only stop a check if it is lost or stolen. It would have been more correct to take the tree guys to court to collect your damages since they did in fact perform the service they were hired to do.

Having said that, however, placing a stop payment on a check is not a criminal matter. What did the police officer say to you? What exactly is the nature of the complaint? I don't get how the police department would even accept a bogus complaint like that unless the person lied about the circumstances.

[aw6196]

Well, the complaint is that we "stole" his money.

I have no doubt that "person Y" lied -- he first told the police that i 'bounced' the check. The police called me, I said no - that I legally put a 'stop payment' on the check becuase he did severe damage to my property. They )the police) subpoena'd (spelling??) my bank account. Of course, they found that I did in fact place a stop payment.

Next, the police department called for my wife. She was not in, so they asked ME for some information for her so they could finish the paperwork for the complaint. I asked various questions (like - how can it be a criminal offense to put a stop payment on a check). Genreally, their answers were something like "we can't stop 'person Y' from filing a complaint". I suppose I can understand that -- that the police are just doing their job. So, I told them that my wife (who unfortunately signed the check) would call them back. She did -- left a message - 3 days ago, and have not heard back. Do they not have to send something via certified mail??? Are these officers doing person Y a personal favor, or, are they just doing their job?

I presume once we see the complaint, and put our side of it into the mix, it will no longer be a criminal complaint. However, my concern is that we are going to be forced to make good on the check (if they find that is was 'criminal??'), and then we will have to sue him -- and I have no doubt we will never see our money, and then have to put out another $1200 to fix the damage he did, not to mention the lost summer (our property is a mess), and time and effort for all of this.

I was trying to think if there was anything he did that could be criminal - like, tearing up our property. Also, not sure what the consumer fraud parameters are, but if he falls into that category, then we can sue for triple damages and attorney fees -- then I would get an attorney in a second.

Nonetheless, I find myself in shock that we are being charged with a criminal offense for protecting ourselves against a contractor that didn't complete his work. Any ideas are greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[Veronica1228]

Originally Posted by aw6196

Well, the complaint is that we "stole" his money.

I have no doubt that "person Y" lied -- he first told the police that i 'bounced' the check. The police called me, I said no - that I legally put a 'stop payment' on the check becuase he did severe damage to my property. They )the police) subpoena'd (spelling??) my bank account. Of course, they found that I did in fact place a stop payment.

Next, the police department called for my wife. She was not in, so they asked ME for some information for her so they could finish the paperwork for the complaint. I asked various questions (like - how can it be a criminal offense to put a stop payment on a check). Genreally, their answers were something like "we can't stop 'person Y' from filing a complaint". I suppose I can understand that -- that the police are just doing their job. So, I told them that my wife (who unfortunately signed the check) would call them back. She did -- left a message - 3 days ago, and have not heard back. Do they not have to send something via certified mail??? Are these officers doing person Y a personal favor, or, are they just doing their job?

I presume once we see the complaint, and put our side of it into the mix, it will no longer be a criminal complaint. However, my concern is that we are going to be forced to make good on the check (if they find that is was 'criminal??'), and then we will have to sue him -- and I have no doubt we will never see our money, and then have to put out another $1200 to fix the damage he did, not to mention the lost summer (our property is a mess), and time and effort for all of this.

I was trying to think if there was anything he did that could be criminal - like, tearing up our property. Also, not sure what the consumer fraud parameters are, but if he falls into that category, then we can sue for triple damages and attorney fees -- then I would get an attorney in a second.

Nonetheless, I find myself in shock that we are being charged with a criminal offense for protecting ourselves against a contractor that didn't complete his work. Any ideas are greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

The bottom line here is that, based on everything you have said, you have done nothing illegal. While it may be true that the police cannot stop the Y guy from filing a complaint, it is up to the D.A. to actually file any charges. I don't see anyway this would ever happen. You basically have to just wait and see for now.

[tranquility]

This is what is known as a SNAFU. I'd argue what happened is that:

1. You made a contract to remove the tree with X. X completed the contract and assigned his right to collect to Y, which you agreed to.

2. X damaged your property. He may be responsible if he were negligent, or if he trespassed by exceeding his permission.

3. You discussed this with X who made a contract to repair the damage. He gave consideration of fixing things, you gave consideration of not suing on #2.

4. You breached the contract stated in #1. Y can sue on the contract because of the valid assignment. X is no longer involved.

5. X breached contract stated in #3. You can sue for that breach.

I don't see any criminal actions here--other than the possible filing of a false police report by Y.

[aw6196]

Well, it appears that the 'complaint' or 'technicalitiy' this person is using is a 'theft of service'. In other words, he is claiming that we tried to defraud him out of his money.

I am wondering if 'destruction of property' can be a criminal complaint, too so I can file a complaint against him (anyone know)?

I still believe this should be a civil case, and not a criminal one. The complaint has been reduced to a misdemeanor, and kicked back from the state level to the city level. Only problem -- he has filed it where HE lives, even though WE live somewhere else, the BANK the check is from is somewhere else, and he did the WORK somewhere else -- how can they accept the complaint where HE lives? Can't we just say 'wrong jurastiction' and walk out?

My tentative plans are to file a small claim against him (and the 'other guy') for the quote amount it will take to fix the damage (more that he charged us so he will actually owe us money), in hopes that the small claim case may come before the criminal one (perhaps offsetting the so-called theft of service).

In any event, I am out of my element here. I know I am right in what we did, but seems this contractor may be on to something with this technicality? Still, I believe this will wind up just being a big waste of my time (which is what he probably has intended).

Does anyone have any experience with any of this that can provide some insight?

[debtcollector`]

Originally Posted by aw6196

In any event, I am out of my element here......Does anyone have any experience with any of this that can provide some insight?

Hire an attorney.

[LSCAP]

I'm a retired cop from NY ( a long time ago-so maybe something changed)

If you came into my Station house in Brooklyn and wanted to file a complaint of theft that happened in Manhattan, ( but definitely somewhere in NY) I would take the information, and forward it to the Precinct concerned. And that is where you would go to court.

I admit I never had it happen, but if you came to me in Brooklyn NY and had a complaint of theft in Georgia, all I could do would be write it up and forward it to Ga. In a special case I believe they would take it ( possibly time sensative - Car stolen in Georgia) but would want to see you in person.

For a civil court action, I can't imagine them taking it from me.

I think you should call your state Attorney General's office.