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Very unusual situation - could use some advice/perspective

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R.W.

Junior Member
This could probably go in multiple different sections of the forum - but I think this section is as good as any.

I was working for someone for nearly two years as a freelancer. We never had an official contract, but he agreed to pay me $20 an hour to work for him. I primarily designed and created animation for e-learning courses he was wanted to make in Flash, but I also performed spent significant time on other things such as typing up documents, attending meetings with him, and just chauffeuring him around and giving him technical guidance. (He is very un-computer savvy and could hardly even type by himself.) He paid me regularly at first, but after only a couple months he ran out of money and I began working for him on a tab. I even lent him a significant amount of my own money out of pocket. (Nearly $4000) I did this because he deceived me into believing his prospects were much more secure than they really were with his clients. He also told me we would be a multi million dollar company and if I stuck with him I would be making significant money and perhaps up to $100,000 a year. I realize I am largely at fault for my own naivety in this situation. I am 24, and he is 54.

Towards the beginning of last year he made a fatal business mistake that caused him to lose one of his major clients and severely hurt our chances with another. Basically, he wasn't meeting any of his contractual obligations and was recording audio for the courses out of order of what should have been top priority. He also was still broke, had run out of people to borrow from, and couldn't pay the recording studio for the audio. At this point I told him that in order for me to keep working, that he would have to pay all the money he owed me so far, (about $10,000), or sign a legally binding agreement that involved profit sharing. At this he completely turned on me and threatened to sue me, saying I could be locked up for extortion. He demanded I send him the files and that he would pay me after the product was released, but refused to sign any of my invoices. (He said he would, but avoided actually doing it at all costs.) He even got an attorney and sent him after me with demand letters, but he has since stopped talking to me as I think he realized he doesn't have a case and the guy still has no money.

He sent me something recently saying he would pay me $6000 as soon as he was able, but this is less than he actually owes. I think he assumes I can't prove he owes me more than that. I don't think he even has any intention of paying this, and have seen no effort on his part to pay me even in small installments or contact me at all. He is unreachable and ignores all my emails and calls. Even if he intends to pay it, I am probably a very low priority. He owes money to countless other people... the guy's a mess.

Recently I found out through LinkedIn that he somehow got another graphic designer to work for him and finish the course. I assume that he was able to do this by getting the new designer to decompile my work so that it could be finished. (He had the exported files but not the raw, source files.) Either that or the new designer simply copied exactly what I had done and made it in Flash again. For perspective, I had created most of this course on Skype with this person dictating what information he wanted to convey and telling me text to type. It is very text and content heavy but the design part is pretty simple, like a glorified Powerpoint with only some complex animation. Someone else could easily recreate it in a month or two if they had an exact blueprint to copy from. According to this new graphic designer, it is now finished and going to launch soon. The good and bad thing about this is that after it launches, this guy should actually have some money soon.

So my question is what are my options in this situation and how can I get paid? I have the following evidence to show what he owes me:

• Written acknowledgment that I was working for $20 an hour
• Complete timesheets from June 2011 to April 2012 - I didn't keep track after this because of the promises he made for after we got off the ground. Promises which unfortunately were verbal only.
• Documentation of every time I lent money to him out of pocket, with specific dates, totaling nearly $4000. I also have bank statements and copies of checks.
• Complete Skype log documenting every time I skyped with him from the beginning - about 200 hours.
• A folder complete with every file I've ever created for him, with dates modified intact.
• All of our emails (Which don't have much use outside of the dates they were sent. Email was mostly just used to send files for us.)
• An affidavit acknowledging he owes me $10,000 - but I didn't sign it because it also demanded that I hand over all the files and continue for him at 20 an hour to finish. All this and he would only pay me IF, and AFTER he made any money.

I think that's all the most important stuff. I live in Chicago, Illinois.
 


quincy

Senior Member
. . . .We never had an official contract, but he agreed to pay me $20 an hour to work for him. . . . .He paid me regularly at first, but after only a couple months he ran out of money and I began working for him on a tab. I even lent him a significant amount of my own money out of pocket. (Nearly $4000). . . .I realize I am largely at fault for my own naivety in this situation. . . .

. . . .At this point I told him that in order for me to keep working, that he would have to pay all the money he owed me so far, (about $10,000), or sign a legally binding agreement that involved profit sharing. . . . .

He sent me something recently saying he would pay me $6000 as soon as he was able, but this is less than he actually owes. I think he assumes I can't prove he owes me more than that. I don't think he even has any intention of paying this, and have seen no effort on his part to pay me even in small installments or contact me at all. He is unreachable and ignores all my emails and calls. Even if he intends to pay it, I am probably a very low priority. He owes money to countless other people... the guy's a mess.

Recently I found out through LinkedIn that he somehow got another graphic designer to work for him and finish the course. I assume that he was able to do this by getting the new designer to decompile my work so that it could be finished. (He had the exported files but not the raw, source files.) Either that or the new designer simply copied exactly what I had done and made it in Flash again. For perspective, I had created most of this course on Skype with this person dictating what information he wanted to convey and telling me text to type. It is very text and content heavy but the design part is pretty simple, like a glorified Powerpoint with only some complex animation. Someone else could easily recreate it in a month or two if they had an exact blueprint to copy from. According to this new graphic designer, it is now finished and going to launch soon. The good and bad thing about this is that after it launches, this guy should actually have some money soon.

So my question is what are my options in this situation and how can I get paid? I have the following evidence to show what he owes me:

• Written acknowledgment that I was working for $20 an hour
• Complete timesheets from June 2011 to April 2012 - I didn't keep track after this because of the promises he made for after we got off the ground. Promises which unfortunately were verbal only.
• Documentation of every time I lent money to him out of pocket, with specific dates, totaling nearly $4000. I also have bank statements and copies of checks.
• Complete Skype log documenting every time I skyped with him from the beginning - about 200 hours.
• A folder complete with every file I've ever created for him, with dates modified intact.
• All of our emails (Which don't have much use outside of the dates they were sent. Email was mostly just used to send files for us.)
• An affidavit acknowledging he owes me $10,000 - but I didn't sign it because it also demanded that I hand over all the files and continue for him at 20 an hour to finish. All this and he would only pay me IF, and AFTER he made any money.

I think that's all the most important stuff. I live in Chicago, Illinois.
Your options include suing the man for the money owed.

Consult with an attorney in your area and go over with this attorney all of the documentation you have showing the agreement you had with the 54 year old, and all documentaion supporting the amount of money you believe he still owes you.

Whether you can collect anything from this man is anyone's guess.

You should from now on make sure all agreements are in writing and signed by all parties.

Good luck.
 
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LdiJ

Senior Member
Your options include suing the man for the money owed.

Consult with an attorney in your area and go over with this attorney all of the documentation you have showing the agreement you had with the 54 year old, and all documentaion supporting the amount of money you believe he still owes you.

Whether you can collect anything from this man is anyone's guess.

You should from now on make sure all agreements are in writing and signed by all parties.

Good luck.
And immediately stop working when you stop getting paid.
 

R.W.

Junior Member
No problem there. Even after I already quit he told me our relationship was terminated. (ha)

I've been trying to get stuff together for small claims court and consulting an attorney, but I don't have any extra cash to spend at the moment. That should change within the month. I can see serving him and collecting the money being a difficult process. He will resist as much as he can. I can definitely show he owes me more than $6000, but I don't want to waste any more money on this than I already have. Still though, it's probably worth it to try. What kind of attorney should I be searching for in this kind of case? I've never had to sue anyone before.
 

justalayman

Senior Member
just wanted to make sure you weren't dealing with an interstate situation. Suing a resident of a a state different than your own (which I am aware Indiana is very close to Chicago) changes a lot.
 

tinaseals

Junior Member
Quasi Contractual Agreements

It sounds like you may be able to assert, under business law, a few quasi contacts, pertaining to the verbal agreement for $20/hourly, back amounts due based on initial quasi arrangement, and future reimbursement for loans due upon revenue realization.

Second, clearly there are relationship issues going on, in conjunction with money, so keep it strictly business and you'll go farther in your pursuit of financial recovery.

Third, intellectual property design. Was it art work, music, or logos that you created separate or in a collaborative manner? If so, hopefully they were independently published by you before you exploited them before him. If you did, you can file your copyright, with your original files, and make claim against the new work, asserting infringement of original work.

If you collaborated, (yikes, hate to say this) you can claim the work, cite percents, and force him to argue creative percents.
 

quincy

Senior Member
(yikes, hate to say this)
Yikes, indeed.

R.W., I suggest you sit down with an attorney in Chicago and go over all of the facts with him/her. This review will be necessary to determine what legal path you can realistically hope to follow so you can collect from the man what is owed.

Good luck.
 
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tinaseals

Junior Member
Its Not My Objective To Counsel Counsellor

I'm simply giving "free advice" sir! You sound like my dad! Did you read my disclaimer counsellor!?
 

quincy

Senior Member
Ahh. I thought maybe she was planning on hawking something. Prolific little bugger, isn't she?



(I sort of liked the way she called me "sir," though :D)
 
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Proserpina

Senior Member
Ahh. I thought maybe she was planning on hawking something. Prolific little bugger, isn't she? :)

Quite the one, yes!

Must be time for crumpets and funsuckers! ;)

(And you've no idea how many times I had to backspace THAT word to avoid a ban! :eek: )
 

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