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damages found after sale of home

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M

madalyne2003

Guest
pennsylvania
we recently sold our home prior to closing on the sale we talked with the buyers regarding items we knew needed repaired etc we have a witness to this we both signed agreement not to do any repairs the buyers looked at the house had the inspections that are required after moving in were replacing carpeting, we had two dogs for many years they occasionaly had an accident,
carpeting always cleaned no pet smell in house, under the carpeting the floor was ruined with pet urine, which they found throughout the house, we have to go to a mediation conference the list of items they want paid is a mile long replacing all the carpeting, carpeting that they had already bought, can we possibly be liable, they claim every room in the house had this urine damage, cost of repairs could be over $10,000 - could we be responsible for this unknown to us damage? my house was always clean and there was no pet odor in the home.
 


It also sounds as if they had replaced the carpet before contacting you and then just presented a bill, is that correct? I would point that out in a certified letter before mediation. I would not think you can just present a bill w/o a chance for bids, damage inspection, etc., can you Home Guru? In inspection suits, the new owners are required to not remove/replace/destroy the item until you have been given ample opportunity for defense or re-inspection or to hire a 3rd party expert to give opinion or it nulls the contract and they cannot sue/mediate. Just wondered. Best of Luck.
 

Souix

Senior Member
madalyne2003 said:
pennsylvania
we recently sold our home prior to closing on the sale we talked with the buyers regarding items we knew needed repaired etc we have a witness to this we both signed agreement not to do any repairs the buyers looked at the house had the inspections that are required after moving in were replacing carpeting, we had two dogs for many years they occasionaly had an accident,
carpeting always cleaned no pet smell in house, under the carpeting the floor was ruined with pet urine, which they found throughout the house, we have to go to a mediation conference the list of items they want paid is a mile long replacing all the carpeting, carpeting that they had already bought, can we possibly be liable, they claim every room in the house had this urine damage, cost of repairs could be over $10,000 - could we be responsible for this unknown to us damage? my house was always clean and there was no pet odor in the home.


***This seems odd to me, why did they lay their new carpet if the floor was damaged? Unless the carpet they installed has to be pulled out now so the damage can be inspected. Proof has to be furnished that there is damage, and you must insist on this***
 

annefan

Member
The OP did not indicate that the new carpet was already installed, only that they purchased it. The new owners could have a substantial claim if the seller did not indicate on the Seller's Disclosure that they had pets in the home.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
madalyne2003 said:
pennsylvania
we recently sold our home prior to closing on the sale we talked with the buyers regarding items we knew needed repaired etc we have a witness to this we both signed agreement not to do any repairs the buyers looked at the house had the inspections that are required after moving in were replacing carpeting, we had two dogs for many years they occasionaly had an accident,
carpeting always cleaned no pet smell in house, under the carpeting the floor was ruined with pet urine, which they found throughout the house, we have to go to a mediation conference the list of items they want paid is a mile long replacing all the carpeting, carpeting that they had already bought, can we possibly be liable, they claim every room in the house had this urine damage, cost of repairs could be over $10,000 - could we be responsible for this unknown to us damage? my house was always clean and there was no pet odor in the home.
**A: yes, you are liable since you failed to disclose the fact that you had pets, they had accidents and the carpet, padding and flooring under the carpet could be damaged. If you disclosed these facts and used an "as-is" addendum confirming that Seller will not pay to replace/repair any of these items, you would have been more protected.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
faithandhope said:
It also sounds as if they had replaced the carpet before contacting you and then just presented a bill, is that correct? I would point that out in a certified letter before mediation. I would not think you can just present a bill w/o a chance for bids, damage inspection, etc., can you Home Guru?

**A: yes you can, but of course the more documentation the better.
*********

In inspection suits, the new owners are required to not remove/replace/destroy the item until you have been given ample opportunity for defense or re-inspection or to hire a 3rd party expert to give opinion or it nulls the contract and they cannot sue/mediate. Just wondered. Best of Luck.

**A: generally that is the best case but there are times when the work must be completed right away to mitigate damages.
 
M

madalyne2003

Guest
Disclosure Statement

on the seller's property disclosure statement we checked the yes box to if there were pets in the house during our ownership, and then hand wrote in 2 dogs and 2 cats. the dogs are small, a yorkshire terrior and cocker spaniel, and at the time of the sale there was only one cat that had never been outside, and always used the liter box. when my husband spoke to the buyers on the phone just prior to the closing he was telling them about small things that he knew that we would have in the near future fixed but had not such as a cap on the chimney, we did not use the chimney but they planned to. the buyer at that time said don't have the carpetings throughout the house professionally cleaned because they had already purchased the carpeting. when they removed the carpeting the day after closing that is when they saw that the floors under the carpeting were "ruined" due to pet urine. i cleaned the carpeting with a home carpet machine. the pets had few accidents, only if we were out of the house for a little too long, but not every day. they claim that in my sons room the carpeting in the closet underneath was so saturated with pet urine that it had soaked through the wall and was up the insulation. my dogs never went in a closet, mainly because my sons usually had so much stuff at the bottom of their closets no one dared to venture inside. it was their stuff. the buyers made out a list of items to be repaired or were repaired by them, and the list has the heading - items were not in this condition when we saw the house originally before negotiating any sales price. from the time that they looked at the house, and that was only once, it was almost a month until closing. we moved out quick for them. examples of items on this list: damaged carpet/hardwood floors $800.00. animal urine damage paneling and insulation $400.00 - supplies for odor removal cleaning $200.00 - cleaning labor $350.00. garbage removal (old carpeting) $360.00 for a dumpster- animal damage under removed carpeting in basement floor had to be sealed $500.00 - house could not be lived in until odor was gone , rent one month $700.00 and it goes on. the buyers originally when they were negotiating the sale price of the house wanted a special clause added that we would do any necessary repairs with no cap on the price, and we would not agree to this, because they had come down so far on the selling price. they went in for a final inspection just prior to the closing when the hosue was empty and the buyers said at the closing that they had done the inspection, now they are claiming that they could not get into the house to inspect it because the doors were locked, my son who had just been in the house was at the neighbors and saw them go in. this is a mess, i hate people like this. if i was really dishonest i would feel terrible, but how would anyone know what is under the carpeting. also just to assure you that i am a very clean housekeeper, we entertained quite frequently in the family room in the basement of the house and no one ever mentioned about pet smell, and they would have. others that had looked at the house never once said about pet smell, also one last thing, my husband has asthma so bad that at 48 years old he is on a disability, and i wonder how he could have been in the family room everyday for years, and not have some kind of asthma reaction if there was pet urine under the carpeting, it would have had mildew, and there would have been a lot of dampness. help!


** also this might not mean anything but the listing contract - exclusive right to sell real property that we signed with the real estate place ended on 10/22/02, they sold the house on 5/1/03, and the real estate people made more money off the selling commision than we made on the sale of the house.
 
Last edited:

HomeGuru

Senior Member
Re: Disclosure Statement

madalyne2003 said:
on the seller's property disclosure statement we checked the yes box to if there were pets in the house during our ownership, and then hand wrote in 2 dogs and 2 cats. the dogs are small, a yorkshire terrior and cocker spaniel, and at the time of the sale there was only one cat that had never been outside, and always used the liter box. when my husband spoke to the buyers on the phone just prior to the closing he was telling them about small things that he knew that we would have in the near future fixed but had not such as a cap on the chimney, we did not use the chimney but they planned to. the buyer at that time said don't have the carpetings throughout the house professionally cleaned because they had already purchased the carpeting. when they removed the carpeting the day after closing that is when they saw that the floors under the carpeting were "ruined" due to pet urine. i cleaned the carpeting with a home carpet machine. the pets had few accidents, only if we were out of the house for a little too long, but not every day. they claim that in my sons room the carpeting in the closet underneath was so saturated with pet urine that it had soaked through the wall and was up the insulation. my dogs never went in a closet, mainly because my sons usually had so much stuff at the bottom of their closets no one dared to venture inside. it was their stuff. the buyers made out a list of items to be repaired or were repaired by them, and the list has the heading - items were not in this condition when we saw the house originally before negotiating any sales price. from the time that they looked at the house, and that was only once, it was almost a month until closing. we moved out quick for them. examples of items on this list: damaged carpet/hardwood floors $800.00. animal urine damage paneling and insulation $400.00 - supplies for odor removal cleaning $200.00 - cleaning labor $350.00. garbage removal (old carpeting) $360.00 for a dumpster- animal damage under removed carpeting in basement floor had to be sealed $500.00 - house could not be lived in until odor was gone , rent one month $700.00 and it goes on. the buyers originally when they were negotiating the sale price of the house wanted a special clause added that we would do any necessary repairs with no cap on the price, and we would not agree to this, because they had come down so far on the selling price. they went in for a final inspection just prior to the closing when the hosue was empty and the buyers said at the closing that they had done the inspection, now they are claiming that they could not get into the house to inspect it because the doors were locked, my son who had just been in the house was at the neighbors and saw them go in. this is a mess, i hate people like this. if i was really dishonest i would feel terrible, but how would anyone know what is under the carpeting. also just to assure you that i am a very clean housekeeper, we entertained quite frequently in the family room in the basement of the house and no one ever mentioned about pet smell, and they would have. others that had looked at the house never once said about pet smell, also one last thing, my husband has asthma so bad that at 48 years old he is on a disability, and i wonder how he could have been in the family room everyday for years, and not have some kind of asthma reaction if there was pet urine under the carpeting, it would have had mildew, and there would have been a lot of dampness. help!

**A: your post above does not change my response.
*******
also this might not mean anything but the listing contract - exclusive right to sell real property that we signed with the real estate place ended on 10/22/02, they sold the house on 5/1/03, and the real estate people made more money off the selling commision than we made on the sale of the house.
**A: not relevant since you signed the contract agreeing to pay the broker at closing anyway.

signed
Don Ho
 

annefan

Member
Your only protection might be that the buyer signed a Pre-Settlement Walk-Through Inspection and agreed that the property condition was acceptable to them. The walk-through should have been performed immediately before closing and when you were completely vacated from the premises.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
annefan said:
Your only protection might be that the buyer signed a Pre-Settlement Walk-Through Inspection and agreed that the property condition was acceptable to them. The walk-through should have been performed immediately before closing and when you were completely vacated from the premises.
**A: incorrect as this inspection would not waive the Buyer's right to sue for misrepresentation with respect to the non disclosure of material facts.
 

Souix

Senior Member
Re: Disclosure Statement

madalyne2003 said:
on the seller's property disclosure statement we checked the yes box to if there were pets in the house during our ownership, and then hand wrote in 2 dogs and 2 cats. the dogs are small, a yorkshire terrior and cocker spaniel, and at the time of the sale there was only one cat that had never been outside, and always used the liter box. when my husband spoke to the buyers on the phone just prior to the closing he was telling them about small things that he knew that we would have in the near future fixed but had not such as a cap on the chimney, we did not use the chimney but they planned to. the buyer at that time said don't have the carpetings throughout the house professionally cleaned because they had already purchased the carpeting. when they removed the carpeting the day after closing that is when they saw that the floors under the carpeting were "ruined" due to pet urine. i cleaned the carpeting with a home carpet machine. the pets had few accidents, only if we were out of the house for a little too long, but not every day. they claim that in my sons room the carpeting in the closet underneath was so saturated with pet urine that it had soaked through the wall and was up the insulation. my dogs never went in a closet, mainly because my sons usually had so much stuff at the bottom of their closets no one dared to venture inside. it was their stuff. the buyers made out a list of items to be repaired or were repaired by them, and the list has the heading - items were not in this condition when we saw the house originally before negotiating any sales price. from the time that they looked at the house, and that was only once, it was almost a month until closing. we moved out quick for them. examples of items on this list: damaged carpet/hardwood floors $800.00. animal urine damage paneling and insulation $400.00 - supplies for odor removal cleaning $200.00 - cleaning labor $350.00. garbage removal (old carpeting) $360.00 for a dumpster- animal damage under removed carpeting in basement floor had to be sealed $500.00 - house could not be lived in until odor was gone , rent one month $700.00 and it goes on. the buyers originally when they were negotiating the sale price of the house wanted a special clause added that we would do any necessary repairs with no cap on the price, and we would not agree to this, because they had come down so far on the selling price. they went in for a final inspection just prior to the closing when the hosue was empty and the buyers said at the closing that they had done the inspection, now they are claiming that they could not get into the house to inspect it because the doors were locked, my son who had just been in the house was at the neighbors and saw them go in. this is a mess, i hate people like this. if i was really dishonest i would feel terrible, but how would anyone know what is under the carpeting. also just to assure you that i am a very clean housekeeper, we entertained quite frequently in the family room in the basement of the house and no one ever mentioned about pet smell, and they would have. others that had looked at the house never once said about pet smell, also one last thing, my husband has asthma so bad that at 48 years old he is on a disability, and i wonder how he could have been in the family room everyday for years, and not have some kind of asthma reaction if there was pet urine under the carpeting, it would have had mildew, and there would have been a lot of dampness. help!

***I agree, pet odor is obnoxious. If there was that much damage someone with asthma would not be able to live there. I have asthma and I cannot even go into some houses because of the pet urine smell. It hits you when you walk in the door. I think if that were the case, the buyers should have been obligated to do their due diligence by pulling up the carpet during their inspection, just to see how bad it really was. It sounds like they are trying to pull a fast one. Get all the documentation and photos you can and also ask to see the damage if its not too late. I mean the smell alone should have inidicated that the buyer perform his due diligence and could have written into the contract that the buyer is entitled to pull up the carpet to see if there is any damage to the floor due to the pet odor. I would have advised this if this were my buyer and the pet odor was overpowering.***


** also this might not mean anything but the listing contract - exclusive right to sell real property that we signed with the real estate place ended on 10/22/02, they sold the house on 5/1/03, and the real estate people made more money off the selling commision than we made on the sale of the house.

***This is irrelevant***
 
Last edited:

annefan

Member
Which is why I used the word "might".

I had a similar transaction in my office, and it went to court (beyond PA RE mediation). The seller maintained that he acknowledged having pets (in the property disclosure) but denied having any knowledge that substantial damage occured to the subflooring beneath the coverings. In fact, he indicated 'no knowledge' when inquired on the disclosure of any problems with the floors, subfloors. The buyers had signed an addendum on closing day (we call it a Pre-Settlement Walk-Through Inspection) which contains very precise language and allows the buyers to either accept the property in it's condition -or- allow additional contingencies regarding the problem to be corrected. The fact that this inspection was performed and accepted by the buyer let the seller off in regards to any liability. This was my experience with the issue. I'm in PA.
 

HomeGuru

Senior Member
annefan said:
Which is why I used the word "might".

I had a similar transaction in my office, and it went to court (beyond PA RE mediation). The seller maintained that he acknowledged having pets (in the property disclosure) but denied having any knowledge that substantial damage occured to the subflooring beneath the coverings. In fact, he indicated 'no knowledge' when inquired on the disclosure of any problems with the floors, subfloors. The buyers had signed an addendum on closing day (we call it a Pre-Settlement Walk-Through Inspection) which contains very precise language and allows the buyers to either accept the property in it's condition -or- allow additional contingencies regarding the problem to be corrected. The fact that this inspection was performed and accepted by the buyer let the seller off in regards to any liability. This was my experience with the issue. I'm in PA.
**A: ok, good story. And in your case, the Seller followed the proper procedure by disclosing the pets and bringing up the unknown subfloor condition. The thread writer did not do these things.
 

annefan

Member
HomeGuru said:
**A: ok, good story. And in your case, the Seller followed the proper procedure by disclosing the pets and bringing up the unknown subfloor condition. The thread writer did not do these things.

I didn't think so.
 

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