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  1. #1
    mammyelizabeth Guest

    13 year old son doesn't want to visit Dad

    What is the name of your state? Tennessee
    My son is 13 and has never wanted to visit his father. I have unsuccessfully been back to court to try to address many issues - his father's emotional abuse, father has narcissistic (sp?) personality disorder and doesn't give any weight to son's feelings or needs. Can a child this age have input in the visitation schedule? He visits 1 night a week overnight, every other weekend, 2 non-consecutive weeks in the summer, a few extra days in the summer, and alternating holidays, is forced by dad to live a completely separate life across town - different friends, etc. Dad is not supportive of extracurricular activities, and hates me so much he cannot be in the same room with me. Several attempts at professional help for son (&dad) have been thwarted by threats from dad (son is fearful of retribution, physically and emotionally). Any suggestions from experienced parent?
  2. #2
    VeronicaGia is offline Senior Member
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    You actually already gave your answer since you said you have unsucsessfully tried to limit visitation in court. If you do not send the child to visitation, the childs father could file contempt of court action against you. Since you have already tried to stop visitation via court, he would have those court records to prove you are trying to alienate him from the childs life. You need to be careful here, because sometimes a judge will change custody if the judge believes you are not fostering the childs relationship with the other parent.

    At 13, you may want to see if a judge will listen to the child, and see if it will hold any weight. However, once again, since the child is under the jurisdiction of the court, the judge may listen but it may or may not change anything. You may also want to ask for supervised visitation, but it's a crapshoot.

    No one here can tell you what a judge will decide.
  3. #3
    SalinaG Guest
    I agree with VeronicaGia. However, the location of the father's residence is not an issue. Just because his father lives in a different location and the child will have different friends...it's unavoidable until the father lives with you or on the same block. It's okay to have different friends as many of us do at work...co-workers...acquaintences (sp?)...friends. Also, just like the child has two different set of families...the mother's side and the father's side. Not an issue.

    Good luck!!
  4. #4
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    So, your son has "never wanted to visit his father."

    It doesn't take a psychology degree to determine why that might be.

    It is clear from your post that you have a great amount of animosity towards him, claiming:
    "father's emotional abuse
    "father has narcissistic (sp?) personality disorder and
    "doesn't give any weight to son's feelings or needs."

    Those are all clearly undiagnosed opinions of an adult and not a childs (even a 13 year old one). As such, it is doubtful that they are his opinions, but are clearly yours. And depending how long you have been 'poisoning' your sons emotions, you might very likely have damaged him emotionally for life.
  5. #5
    VeronicaGia is offline Senior Member
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    I absolutely agree with you Jetx

    Originally posted by JETX
    So, your son has "never wanted to visit his father."

    It doesn't take a psychology degree to determine why that might be.

    It is clear from your post that you have a great amount of animosity towards him, claiming:
    "father's emotional abuse
    "father has narcissistic (sp?) personality disorder and
    "doesn't give any weight to son's feelings or needs."

    Those are all clearly undiagnosed opinions of an adult and not a childs (even a 13 year old one). As such, it is doubtful that they are his opinions, but are clearly yours. And depending how long you have been 'poisoning' your sons emotions, you might very likely have damaged him emotionally for life.
    But now our poster will likely come back with all sorts of instances of abuse; I'm sure he's a child molester or physically assaulted her or some other mind boggling information she didn't put in her first post.
  6. #6
    Tercr6 Guest
    In NY the law states anamosity is-not grounds for for the denial of visitations. I wish Parents would allow the child to love both Parents,even though they can't stand each other.
    Unless you can get a proffesional or court ordered evaluation and determination visitations should cease ( wich so far you have failed to do ) ( and it's difficult,unless there is clear evidence the visitations a greatly harming the child ),these visitations will continue.
    take a step back. If you quit degrading the childs father,and stayed mute of the situation ( if you can),would your child eventually like the visits ? give it a try !!
  7. #7
    mammyelizabeth Guest

    My animosity

    It is not clear that my animosity toward my ex has affected my son's attitude, since it is the ex is the one harboring hate and ill will. I have attempted many times to reconcile this issue through counseling, etc., and he has refused to meet me even 1% of the way. To you junior psychologists out there, a person with narcisisstic personality disorder cares only about himself, and therein lies the root of the problem with my son and his father - he also knows that his father hates me, since the man speaks of it often.
    Anyway, thanks only to the person who suggested that I probably have no recourse except through a court listening to my son.
  8. #8
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    Further proof of the lack of logic ....
    "No matter how many disagree with you, THEY are still wrong."
    Last edited by JETX; 06-04-2003 at 09:15 AM.
  9. #9
    stealth2 is offline Senior Member
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    Re: My animosity

    Originally posted by mammyelizabeth
    To you junior psychologists out there, a person with narcisisstic personality disorder cares only about himself, and therein lies the root of the problem with my son and his father - he also knows that his father hates me, since the man speaks of it often.
    Do you have a diagnosis of this from a medical professional?
  10. #10
    mammyelizabeth Guest
    To JETX - Not wrong, just ignorant, but I'm sure that that is not your fault. Your snide remarks are really not very helpful, even though you may think you mean well. To Momma Tiger, yes, this diagnosis was made by a court-appointed psychologist after significant evaluation, and was also noted by another psychologist that met with the father only once bfore that. My son has also reported to me(through the past 12 years) incidents of physical and verbal abuse, among other things, but refuses to tell anyone else because he fears his father's retribution. Unfortunately, I think he is justified in feeling this way, as I have been the recipient of his anger when we were married and since. As stated before, I have attempted to seek therapy and/or counseling for all three of us, but the father undermines those attempts, and they have all been unsuccessful. The last therapist we visited concluded that the stress my son was experiencing due to his fear would probably only be worsened by forcing him to talk about it, and thought that letting "sleeping dogs lie" might be the best way for him to handle it. That was over two years ago, and my son continues to be miserable and suffer physical and emotional ills when visitation time comes around. Is there anyone who has successfully approached the court at 13 and feel that they received a fair audience? My goal is for my son to have a good and peaceful life, and is not motivated by anything to do with his father outside of his treatment of my son. Thanks to anyone who can truly relate.
  11. #11
    Tercr6 Guest
    Ok,I'm the one who suggested you to try to be "mute" (if you can),and see if evenually things ease up.
    You state the psycoligist would rather not "involve "your son to dicuss the issue as it may damage him more Emotionally.
    Is your Son diagnosed with a disorder also,such as Emotionally Disturbed?
    Is your child in therapy now? has he expressed "physical & Emotional Abuse " to the thearapist ? ( a poster said you would come back w/ this !!).
    Now,What does the Court Order Specify ? Has there been any Violations,that you could bring a modification for ?
    I helped My girlfreind,eventually get a modification,of his grandmothers visits to specify she have contact with the childs thearapist only ( part of therapy until otherwise recommended),after numourous modification petitions of Specified Violation.We also had the Incarcerated Fathers' visits stopped. ( of course the therapist would not devulge info w/o moms consent),so we won !!
    What i am saying is their has to be clear and convincing evidence the Order(s) are being Violated,And the Child is being ABUSED,and it is NO LONGER in the best interest for the child to visit w/ dad unsepervised.
    Is there Marks on the child from physical abuse.If so,why haven't you protected the child by call CPS(child protective servises),taking pictures ??
    What evidence do you have that could prove,the Visits are not in the CHILDS BEST INTEREST ??
  12. #12
    mammyelizabeth Guest
    No evidence, really. There were cigarette burns when he was a baby, with DCS dismissing it, and his dad left him alone in a locked house two different times that I know about when he was 3 - things like that the court was not interested in. It is all very subtle and hard to prove - only the word of my son, whom I believe because I have no reason not to do so. He has no emotional disorder, he's pretty healthy, and only is in distress when he faces extended visits (more than a day) with his dad. He's a good student, and his school guidance counselor is aware of what he is going through. I guess that there is no legal recourse to make a parent put their child first - his dad says no birthday parties, no sleepovers, no friends visit - things like that that are just not reasonable for a 13-year old that needs to have his own life. Thanks for your reply.
  13. #13
    hmmbrdzz Guest
    Hi Mammyelizabath. With all due respect to Jetty, he has made some statements here without knowing the facts of narcissism. A person with NPD (narc. personality disorder) makes an awful parent. They are abusive. They demand to be recognized as superior -- even if they’ve done absolutely nothing to deserve it. They have an unreasonable sense of entitlement always; they want favorable treatment; they demand instant submission and compliance (especially from partner and children); they lack feelings of remorse, sympathy, or empathy for anyone in any situation, and they will exploit people to meet their warped needs and will do it until they die. They’re quite despicable. He is concerned only with "appearances" as far as visitation with him is concerned and truly has no feelings for his child (and never will). Your feelings, therefore, are appropriate, and any demeaning comments you have made about him here (or anywhere) are well-deserved.

    The most responsible thing you can do is to attempt to severe any and all ties to him and gain full custody of your child with no visitation whatsoever to him. With the history of abuse in the past and his current behavior and diagnosis, you should be able to get full custody with a good attorney. Go for it, and don't even consider him or what you might be doing to your child in this fight. You will be doing your child a favor.

    Good luck to you.

    hmmbrdzz
  14. #14
    JETX is offline Senior Member
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    Don't you worry your pretty little head about my understanding.... I understand just fine.

    However, one thing I have learned in all my years of listening to issues like this.... is to temper a response because we are only hearing ONE side of the story.... and a biased one at that. For example, we have NO idea if this person (dad) is suffering from NCD or not. We ony have an obviously biased statement. As such, it would be simply wrong to make any statements of facts************** without knowing the FACTS.
  15. #15
    stealth2 is offline Senior Member
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    Originally posted by hmmbrdzz
    The most responsible thing you can do is to attempt to severe any and all ties to him and gain full custody of your child with no visitation whatsoever to him. With the history of abuse in the past and his current behavior and diagnosis, you should be able to get full custody with a good attorney. Go for it, and don't even consider him or what you might be doing to your child in this fight. You will be doing your child a favor.

    Good luck to you.

    hmmbrdzz
    Much easier said than done, as evidenced from OP's inability to even get visitation reduced. Since all of the above has already been presented in court, it can't be rehashed over and over and over.

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