Changing holidays

[CJane]

And CJ? Look at the changes you have made in your childrens lives due to the "new man".

The changes in my children's lives are actually due to their father's abandonment of them. Had he not walked away from them almost 3 years ago, and made no effort at contact for the interim, I never would have moved them away. But since he did, we'd stopped seeing any reason to stay in the area. My husband could just as easily have retired in Kansas instead of Washington, had things been different.

And you don't see me in court complaining about not having time I didn't want anyway.

My husband's ex will be moving out here at the end of this summer. I'm certain she'll want more time than is currently granted to her in the cross country parenting plan that's in effect now. But it will be on her to be reasonable about it. The kids aren't going to have their lives completely upset just because she decided to make changes to her life and move here. The parenting plan will change, out of necessity. But it will be on her to ask for/file for the modifications, because she's the one that moved away and only had visits a few times a year for the past couple years.

Same deal with this poster. Dad agreed to the holiday schedule. He regrets that now. But that's not Mom's fault, or the child's fault. So Dad should bear the brunt of the consequences of the changes - including the costs of court and the very real possibility that he's not going to get what he's asking for.

 

[Silverplum]

Nope, I have an electric bedwarmer.

But you missed the point.

That's not nearly a clever-enough retort to compensate for your hypocrisy, Bedwarmer. Handy-dandy Babysitter for absent dad. Or whatever you like to call yourself lately.

 

[Ladyback1]

That's going way too far on the insults.

You're a 2nd wife...is that what you call yourself? I certainly don't.

Really?
Do you hang out here much???

I have seen far, far worse!

(FWIW---I'm my husband's 3rd wife! I am literally his bedwarmer---he's going through cancer treatment, and has issues getting and staying warm! I'm happy being his bedwarmer.)

 

[I'mTheFather]

Really?
Do you hang out here much???

I have seen far, far worse!

(FWIW---I'm my husband's 3rd wife! I am literally his bedwarmer---he's going through cancer treatment, and has issues getting and staying warm! I'm happy being his bedwarmer.)

Yep, there have been far, far worse insults on these forums. However, I can't recall the term 'bedwarmer' being used as anything but disparaging when responding to a post.

The use of the term on this thread has only served to derail the topic.

 

[LdiJ]

Yep, there have been far, far worse insults on these forums. However, I can't recall the term 'bedwarmer' being used as anything but disparaging when responding to a post.

The use of the term on this thread has only served to derail the topic.

I am pretty sure that some of the people complaining about CJane's use of "bedwarmer" have been the issuers of similar or worse, insults in their history on these forums.

Look, the bottom line here is that legally mom does not have to agree to any modification and the burden of proof is on dad to prove why the status quo, that was previously agreed to by him, should be changed, and how that change will be in the best interest of the child. The fact that he is JW and has never celebrated holidays should be brought up in court, and again, the judge is going to be interested in why he wants holidays now.

My objection, and I believe CJane's objection to some of the posts in this thread is the fact that mom has basically been told by a few posters that unless she automatically rolls over and gives dad what he wants that she is a POS. Those were not the exact words that were used, but that is the spirit that was clearly articulated. That is both unfair and legally wrong...and to be quite honest absolutely ridiculous if dad is not going to actually celebrate the holidays.

Some of the people who have posted in that light have been strong posters about the fact that this is a legal forum and advice given should be based on legal reality, and chastise people who give advice based on opinion, rather than legal reality.

I have no problem with someone stating the correct legal reality and then going beyond that and giving a person opinion that they identify as a personal or morality opinion. I try to be as careful as I can be to do that myself if I decide to wander in that direction. However, when personal opinion is not identified as such, I find it hypocritical from posters who often insist on responses being to the letter of the law.

 

[single317dad]

My objection, and I believe CJane's objection to some of the posts in this thread is the fact that mom has basically been told by a few posters that unless she automatically rolls over and gives dad what he wants that she is a POS. Those were not the exact words that were used, but that is the spirit that was clearly articulated.

Not only is that NOT the language that was used but it was NOT the spirit of the discussion, and you darn well know it. Saying someone is acting selfishly in no way equates to the sort of statement you're making here.

Whatever personal dog you have in this fight is clouding your judgment. I've seen some questionable remarks in this thread, and they weren't the ones being critical of the OP.

 

[I'mTheFather]

I am pretty sure that some of the people complaining about CJane's use of "bedwarmer" have been the issuers of similar or worse, insults in their history on these forums.

I have no argument there, but that's where the thread derailed. As I said.

Look, the bottom line here is that legally mom does not have to agree to any modification and the burden of proof is on dad to prove why the status quo, that was previously agreed to by him, should be changed, and how that change will be in the best interest of the child. The fact that he is JW and has never celebrated holidays should be brought up in court, and again, the judge is going to be interested in why he wants holidays now.

You continue to suggest the father isn't planning on celebrating holidays. In fact, the OP quite clearly stated that he DOES plan to celebrate.

My objection, and I believe CJane's objection to some of the posts in this thread is the fact that mom has basically been told by a few posters that unless she automatically rolls over and gives dad what he wants that she is a POS. Those were not the exact words that were used, but that is the spirit that was clearly articulated. That is both unfair and legally wrong...and to be quite honest absolutely ridiculous if dad is not going to actually celebrate the holidays.

NO ONE said anything like that in this thread. If you're referring to singledad, you ought to reread ALL of his posts in this thread. You are way off base. And again with the suggestion that dad may not celebrate despite OP's actual words.

Some of the people who have posted in that light have been strong posters about the fact that this is a legal forum and advice given should be based on legal reality, and chastise people who give advice based on opinion, rather than legal reality.

I think we all know that every single person who responds to threads on FreeAdvice has, at one time or another, or even very many times, posted personal opinion.

I have no problem with someone stating the correct legal reality and then going beyond that and giving a person opinion that they identify as a personal or morality opinion. I try to be as careful as I can be to do that myself if I decide to wander in that direction. However, when personal opinion is not identified as such, I find it hypocritical from posters who often insist on responses being to the letter of the law.

I have no words....

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

Mine may have been a bit inflammatory, but they got to the heart of the issue. It is ridiculous for someone who practices a religion that bans celebration of holidays and believes we are all going to Hell to want the child over a holiday that is the celebration of Christ and how we will go to heaven. It smells of a parent trying to force their religious beliefs on the child and not allow the child to make their own decision to choose a religion. At least in the celebration of Christmas the child has the option to believe God does not exist but these free presents are a great expression of commercialism and how my parent is suckered in to it.

Not only is that NOT the language that was used but it was NOT the spirit of the discussion, and you darn well know it. Saying someone is acting selfishly in no way equates to the sort of statement you're making here.

Whatever personal dog you have in this fight is clouding your judgment. I've seen some questionable remarks in this thread, and they weren't the ones being critical of the OP.

 

[Proserpina]

I'm almost starting to miss latigo.

Almost.

 

[I'mTheFather]

Mine may have been a bit inflammatory, but they got to the heart of the issue. It is ridiculous for someone who practices a religion that bans celebration of holidays and believes we are all going to Hell to want the child over a holiday that is the celebration of Christ and how we will go to heaven. It smells of a parent trying to force their religious beliefs on the child and not allow the child to make their own decision to choose a religion. At least in the celebration of Christmas the child has the option to believe God does not exist but these free presents are a great expression of commercialism and how my parent is suckered in to it.

I don't see anything inflammatory about your post unless I'm missing one of them. But it didn't get to the heart of the issue.

First, OP states that the father does plan to celebrate the holidays.

And, even if he was trying to 'force' his (former) religion on his 4 year old, he has that right with joint legal custody.

Finally, the child who only knows one religion's practices isn't given the opportunity to make a decision to choose a religion.

For the record, I'm not suggesting OP just give up the holidays, but she should have better reasons than the one she gave. I am a bit offended by some of the narrow-mindedness regarding religion in this thread.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

I was referring to my comment of the JW belief all of us are going to Hell. I believe everyone has their God and the right to worship him/her/it whatever, as long as they do not try to force their views on another. Apparently dad has resigned from the JW religion and converted, now he needs to go to court and get his conversion adapted into the visitation order.

QUOTE=I'mTheFather;3315002]I don't see anything inflammatory about your post unless I'm missing one of them. But it didn't get to the heart of the issue.

First, OP states that the father does plan to celebrate the holidays.

And, even if he was trying to 'force' his (former) religion on his 4 year old, he has that right with joint legal custody.

Finally, the child who only knows one religion's practices isn't given the opportunity to make a decision to choose a religion.

For the record, I'm not suggesting OP just give up the holidays, but she should have better reasons than the one she gave. I am a bit offended by some of the narrow-mindedness regarding religion in this thread.[/QUOTE]

 

[Pinkie39]

Mine may have been a bit inflammatory, but they got to the heart of the issue. It is ridiculous for someone who practices a religion that bans celebration of holidays and believes we are all going to Hell to want the child over a holiday that is the celebration of Christ and how we will go to heaven. It smells of a parent trying to force their religious beliefs on the child and not allow the child to make their own decision to choose a religion. At least in the celebration of Christmas the child has the option to believe God does not exist but these free presents are a great expression of commercialism and how my parent is suckered in to it.

Lots of people celebrate Christmas as a secular holiday. As does a Muslim relative of mine. I believe in Jesus, but I don't go to church on Christmas or Easter. I'm not a fan of organized religion.

Halloween is now a completely secular holiday, despite it's original connection to All Saints Day.

And what does drinking green beer have to do with St. Patrick's Day, a saint's day?

I don't see anything wrong myself with celebrating a traditonally religious holiday with one's kids, without the religious observance.

 

[I'mTheFather]

I was referring to my comment of the JW belief all of us are going to Hell. I believe everyone has their God and the right to worship him/her/it whatever, as long as they do not try to force their views on another. Apparently dad has resigned from the JW religion and converted, now he needs to go to court and get his conversion adapted into the visitation order.

My issue with so many comments is that dad is trying to force his beliefs on the child. Well, he has that right unless the court order specified in which faith the child would be raised. Though it's completely moot and (admittedly) not relevant to the thread, any JW parent who wants his child to experience his beliefs and practices SHOULD request holiday time. Those who feel the child will be missing out on Christmas should remember that the child has 2 parents who practice different religions. There is no reason that holiday time shouldn't be alternated if both parents want the child to experience that day in their own respective ways.

In my opinion, to think otherwise is biased.

 

[CJane]

Wow. Y'all are a little dim today, aren't you?

I used the term BedWarmer on purpose. To illustrate EXACTLY what people would be saying to HER if she were here posting about her husband wanting to have his child on the holidays now that they were married and kiddo had a new family.

Because that's what Dad is doing. He's gotten married and all of a sudden wants days that he happily gave up before.

And some of y'all are so invested in assuming that Moms all suffer from GUS (Golden Uterus Syndrome) that you refuse to see that perhaps Dad is being a tad unreasonable, and is being pushed by his new wife.

Of course, they could be REALLY grown up about it, and share holidays. As in, Dad and his wife could spend time at Mom's house on holidays. That's what my family did throughout my childhood, and since SoldierBoy and I have been together, I've spent a portion of every holiday with his ex and her wife, and often his former Mother In Law as well.

 

[CJane]

My issue with so many comments is that dad is trying to force his beliefs on the child. Well, he has that right unless the court order specified in which faith the child would be raised. Though it's completely moot and (admittedly) not relevant to the thread, any JW parent who wants his child to experience his beliefs and practices SHOULD request holiday time. Those who feel the child will be missing out on Christmas should remember that the child has 2 parents who practice different religions. There is no reason that holiday time shouldn't be alternated if both parents want the child to experience that day in their own respective ways.

In my opinion, to think otherwise is biased.

But Dad should have asked for that time in the beginning, not given it up voluntarily and then decided he needed something different to accommodate the changes in HIS life.

That's my issue. Not even that they're holidays, but that he seems to believe that his marriage is a good reason to change things up. And that doesn't show a lot of thought about the child, but rather about him and his wife.