Custody After Death of Custodial Parent

[jenniferbockey]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan
I have Stage IV Breast Cancer and life expectancy isn't great. I have two daughters 13 and 9 who I have physical custody. Our visitation order from the court was "visitation as agreeable by both parties". He sees the children maybe once or twice a month which usually consists of him stopping by briefly. He occassionally pays support but is more than $8,000 in arrears. Father lives in a Winnebago in Ohio with no heat or running water and is not legally employed. The girls do not ask for him or want to leave with him. He is a recovering alcoholic and is in counseling for depression. He has had several DUIs although I believe right now he is sober. He has turned into a very miserable man. Grew his hair all long and has tatoos with the devil praying and another of a naked woman. I have a will on file with my desires for custody to be given to my sister and her husband. They are also trustees for the kids. Is there anything further I can do to protect my kids after I am gone. I am so afraid of what happens to my daughters. They currently are well adjusted, emotionally stable girls They get all As in school and are happy and content.What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

 

[ErinGoBragh]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan
I have Stage IV Breast Cancer and life expectancy isn't great. I have two daughters 13 and 9 who I have physical custody. Our visitation order from the court was "visitation as agreeable by both parties". He sees the children maybe once or twice a month which usually consists of him stopping by briefly. He occassionally pays support but is more than $8,000 in arrears. Father lives in a Winnebago in Ohio with no heat or running water and is not legally employed. The girls do not ask for him or want to leave with him. He is a recovering alcoholic and is in counseling for depression. He has had several DUIs although I believe right now he is sober. He has turned into a very miserable man. Grew his hair all long and has tatoos with the devil praying and another of a naked woman. I have a will on file with my desires for custody to be given to my sister and her husband. They are also trustees for the kids. Is there anything further I can do to protect my kids after I am gone. I am so afraid of what happens to my daughters. They currently are well adjusted, emotionally stable girls They get all As in school and are happy and content.What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

What do you mean, protect your children? Are you talking about who primary custody would go to? Please clarify.

Also, you cannot just "will" away your children. The courts WILL look to dad first for primary custody.

Also, his tattoos and the length of his hair are completely irrelevant.

 

[ErinGoBragh]

I'm also curious as to whether or not dad knows about your health circumstances. Have you told him about the cancer, and the severity?

 

[momofrose]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan
I have Stage IV Breast Cancer and life expectancy isn't great.

I am sorry.

I have two daughters 13 and 9 who I have physical custody. Our visitation order from the court was "visitation as agreeable by both parties". He sees the children maybe once or twice a month which usually consists of him stopping by briefly.

But he DOES see them, so he DOES have a relationship with them.

He occassionally pays support but is more than $8,000 in arrears.

ok

Father lives in a Winnebago in Ohio with no heat or running water and is not legally employed.

How do you know?

The girls do not ask for him or want to leave with him. He is a recovering alcoholic and is in counseling for depression.

Then he is doing something about his state of mind and in life - good for him

He has had several DUIs although I believe right now he is sober.

Again - good for him

He has turned into a very miserable man.

Sounds like he had a tough life even if he brought it on himsellf, BUT he is in counselling and is sober.

Grew his hair all long and has tatoos with the devil praying and another of a naked woman.

Who cares? What does this have to do with anything?

I have a will on file with my desires for custody to be given to my sister and her husband. They are also trustees for the kids. Is there anything further I can do to protect my kids after I am gone. I am so afraid of what happens to my daughters.

You can NOT will your children away - Their father will get Custody of HIS kids.

They currently are well adjusted, emotionally stable girls They get all As in school and are happy and content.What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

I am sure they willhave a difficult time after you are gone and will need support from family - but their world wil be turned upside down - maybe you should take the first step in trying to help build the relationship between them and their father.

Good luck to you

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan
I have Stage IV Breast Cancer and life expectancy isn't great. I have two daughters 13 and 9 who I have physical custody. Our visitation order from the court was "visitation as agreeable by both parties". He sees the children maybe once or twice a month which usually consists of him stopping by briefly. He occassionally pays support but is more than $8,000 in arrears. Father lives in a Winnebago in Ohio with no heat or running water and is not legally employed. The girls do not ask for him or want to leave with him. He is a recovering alcoholic and is in counseling for depression. He has had several DUIs although I believe right now he is sober. He has turned into a very miserable man. Grew his hair all long and has tatoos with the devil praying and another of a naked woman. I have a will on file with my desires for custody to be given to my sister and her husband. They are also trustees for the kids. Is there anything further I can do to protect my kids after I am gone. I am so afraid of what happens to my daughters. They currently are well adjusted, emotionally stable girls They get all As in school and are happy and content.What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

I am truly sorry that you have to deal with all of this.

I would strongly recommend that you contact their father and have a separate, sit down discussion with him about your health and about the children. No matter what kind of hostility there may be between the two of you he deserves to know what is going on, and deserves to either have some time to get his life in order so that he is prepared to be a full time father, or deserves to have the opportunity to agree that he isn't prepared to raise them himself.

No matter what your will says, he will be first in line for custody of the children and its better if he knows now what he needs to do and has the time to consider whether or not he really can do it. If he has the time to consider, he may agree that he is not in a position to raise them, and may agree that your sister should have guardianship. If that is the case, you may be able to put something more solid in place, in advance, than just your will.

If he agrees, and your sister is prepared to promote a relationship between your children and their father, your children may deal with far less traumna than otherwise might be the case.

Seriously, I strongly recommend that you contact dad and make and appointment to talk to him...maybe over lunch. People often truly rise to the occasion when they realize that the stakes are truly high.

 

[jenniferbockey]

Yes, my ex knows about my cancer and the stage, etc. He has known since February 2008. I have talked to him several times about the future of the girls. He has made no changes to his lifestyle or engagment with the girls. I have pleaded with him to lead his life as a man who puts being a father as a priority. He tells me I do not understand how difficult his life is and it is all he can do to stay sober and alive. Nearly three years ago, he "snapped" and two days before Christmas he kicked in the doors at our house and got his gun and held it to his head running around outside saying he was going to kill himself (he was drunk). I had to call the police and from that point out I said I would never live in a household like that. The girls saw it all and refer to it as the "scary night". He never talked to the girls about it and has never even talked to them about our divorce. I know full well I cannot will my children; however, it is the means suggested to me by my lawyer to record my wishes. Seeing your kids 2 hours or so a month does not constitute much of a relationship let alone a parental relationship. He does not go to the events at school or sports. He doesn't know really anything about them. They are afraid to go with him. His tatoos are only relevant as they directly associate with his outright display of hatred of God and conforming to society ... as I said.. there is a devil laughing as he is praying and a huge naked woman on the other arm. I don't anticipate he will stay sober as he says he hates AA and only goes there for court (he had two DUIs in 6 months). I know he doesn't work legally as he does not file a tax return or have any reportable income on his SS #. I really want my girls to have a father. My 13 year old wants nothing to do with him and the 9 year old still asks... I tell him this often. I know my sister would try very hard to foster a relationship with him. She and her husband are wonderful people. I want to protect my girls from just being transfered over to him and living in a campground with a Winnebago with no heat or water with a mean, miserable man who can barely take care of his own basic needs let alone two daughters. How would he support them? He made the deliberate choice to live in a camper 45 minutes away. He may be on the surface trying to get better but only under the terms that suite him. He pays no child support but goes out and buys a brand new Kawaski Ninja Crotch Rocket. My daughters are emotionally healthy right now. They do great in school. This is only because I have sacrificed everything to be there for them. They are afraid to be with their dad on a one on one basis so I think my reasons for trying to "protect" them are very valid.

 

[Ohiogal]

And if dad wants to be dad, the court will make sure he has custody and not your sister. that is fact.

 

[profmum]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan
I have Stage IV Breast Cancer and life expectancy isn't great. I have two daughters 13 and 9 who I have physical custody. Our visitation order from the court was "visitation as agreeable by both parties". He sees the children maybe once or twice a month which usually consists of him stopping by briefly. He occassionally pays support but is more than $8,000 in arrears. Father lives in a Winnebago in Ohio with no heat or running water and is not legally employed. The girls do not ask for him or want to leave with him. He is a recovering alcoholic and is in counseling for depression. He has had several DUIs although I believe right now he is sober. He has turned into a very miserable man. Grew his hair all long and has tatoos with the devil praying and another of a naked woman. I have a will on file with my desires for custody to be given to my sister and her husband. They are also trustees for the kids. Is there anything further I can do to protect my kids after I am gone. I am so afraid of what happens to my daughters. They currently are well adjusted, emotionally stable girls They get all As in school and are happy and content.What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

If his involvement in the kids lives has been as limited as you say and you have a will expressing your preference, it is possible that Dad will have to contest it and probably has a great likelihood of winning custody. I think getting dad to agree to your sister being their primary caretaker is the best advice, sounds like he may not be willing to take on that responsibility. Another option may be to get a GAL involved to see what is in the children's best interest. OG can probably tell if that is even possible given you are thankfully still around.

 

[Ohiogal]

If his involvement in the kids lives has been as limited as you say and you have a will expressing your preference, it is possible that Dad will have to contest it and probably has a great likelihood of winning custody. I think getting dad to agree to your sister being their primary caretaker is the best advice, sounds like he may not be willing to take on that responsibility. Another option may be to get a GAL involved to see what is in the children's best interest. OG can probably tell if that is even possible given you are thankfully still around.

She can do nothing about a GAL. That would be deciding custody in the future. A GAL would be brought on board if dad and the relatives ended up in a custody battle. But once more -- with FEELING -- you CANNOT will children.

 

[jenniferbockey]

Yes, we all understand the point that you cannot will children. I have already said I am not willing my children along with my possessions. Just stating my wishes so there is no misunderstanding about what I would have wanted. And in the event their father is either deemed unfit or unwilling or even deseased, you know who I want to be the guardian of my children.

I understand biological parents having the first right to their children and I have truly pushed and tried with their dad. I taken out books from the library for him to read but I cannot fix him. He needs to fix himself and he seems only to be spinning in a fast circle into a dark hole. So, unless he has murdered someone or convicted of molesting the children, it seems he will be granted custody no matter how distburbed he otherwise is. This is the most troubling thought I can have over any other right now because there is nothing I apparently can do either by trying to help restore him to a remotely capable father or give my children an option for a secure home when I am gone. Sometimes parents shouldn't be parents and unfortuantely it doesn't get the courts until some extreme damage is done to the children. I can already see the writing on the wall.

He hasn't stepped up at all in three years. I went through six months of horrendous times with chemo this spring/summer and I can count on one hand how many times he saw the girls. I don't exactly have faith when I am gone he is going to be there for them.

Thanks for your replies.

 

[CourtClerk]

Sounds to me like you're trying to make him into the man and father you want him to be. He is under no obligation to do that. He's free to do what he wants. If/when you pass away, if the children are still minors, dad gets the kids.

His tatoos are only relevant as they directly associate with his outright display of hatred of God and conforming to society

His tattoos are NEVER relevant as he has the absolute right to hate God (that whole freedom of religion thing in the Constitution) and not to conform to society. There are a ton of nonconformists in this world. So what.

The simple fact of the matter is this. If/when you pass away, dad gets the kids. He has a constitutional right to be a parent, even if it's not the parent YOU want him to be.

 

[jenniferbockey]

You think I am trying to make him into the man I want him to be? Would you want someone raising your kids who will not get a job, pay taxes, lives in a house on wheels without heat or water? Do you want a man who hates God, government and life in general raising your children. You want a man who as terrified his children by breaking down doors and holding a gun to his head raising your kids alone????? You find that acceptabe? I DONT!!!!! I am not trying to make him anything except some form a father who has some kind of a relationship with his kids. I was married to him for 10 years and dated him for 10 years prior to that. Please don't insult me by classifying me as someone with no self control who just mindlessly slept with someone without care for the consequences. He was a good person for a very long time but he is nowhere close to a sound individual. We went to counseling before the divorce and the psychologist said he is clinically depressed and there is nothing I can do about it. He needs medication and counseling and he will not get better until he gets treatment. I have gone to the hospital psych ward with him two years ago when he was suicidal and they referred him to the county unit because of no insurance. He goes when it gets awful to counselilng but will not medicate. This just isn't because he is not who I want him to be.

You people criticize for somone not trying to help him build a relationship and then you take my trying as me trying to make him into something I want.

Sorry I asked and it is not because I don't like your answers. I am sure you get alot of less than intelligent people here for "free" advise. I am not one of them. I love my children more than life itself and you can be certain of one thing... my family will go to the ends of the earth to make sure they do not live with him under current type circumstances.

 

[Ohiogal]

You think I am trying to make him into the man I want him to be? Would you want someone raising your kids who will not get a job, pay taxes, lives in a house on wheels without heat or water? Do you want a man who hates God, government and life in general raising your children. You want a man who as terrified his children by breaking down doors and holding a gun to his head raising your kids alone????? You find that acceptabe? I DONT!!!!!

Then you had choices. You should NOT have had sex with him once let alone more than once. When you found out you were pregnant you could have had an abortion each time. YOU made him a daddy. YOU made the choices that made him a parent. He didn't become a parent until the children were born. Until then YOU had the choice to not make him a daddy.

I am not trying to make him anything except some form a father who has some kind of a relationship with his kids. I was married to him for 10 years and dated him for 10 years prior to that. Please don't insult me by classifying me as someone with no self control who just mindlessly slept with someone without care for the consequences. He was a good person for a very long time but he is nowhere close to a sound individual.

So what made the change? Apparently he didn't hate GOD, life or the government when you were with him.

We went to counseling before the divorce and the psychologist said he is clinically depressed and there is nothing I can do about it. He needs medication and counseling and he will not get better until he gets treatment.

really? And you are in a position to diagnose him?

I have gone to the hospital psych ward with him two years ago when he was suicidal and they referred him to the county unit because of no insurance. He goes when it gets awful to counselilng but will not medicate. This just isn't because he is not who I want him to be.

He is not the father you want him to be and yet you want to make sure he knows that you do not want him to have HIS children.

You people criticize for somone not trying to help him build a relationship and then you take my trying as me trying to make him into something I want.

What do you think a lawyer will do in court? You are trying to make him what YOU want him to be. The law finds him an appropriate parent -- there is a presumption that he is appropriate because YOU presumed he was appropriate when you made him a parent. What you have stated doesn't make him legally unfitted.

Sorry I asked and it is not because I don't like your answers. I am sure you get alot of less than intelligent people here for "free" advise. I am not one of them. I love my children more than life itself and you can be certain of one thing... my family will go to the ends of the earth to make sure they do not live with him under current type circumstances.

Your family may have NO CHOICE. Understand that much. The fact that your family will do that can get them in a heck of a lot trouble.

 

[CourtClerk]

You think I am trying to make him into the man I want him to be?

Yes I do. I thought that was quite evident in my previous post.

Would you want someone raising your kids who will not get a job, pay taxes, lives in a house on wheels without heat or water?

I don't, but we aren't talking about my children. However, there are people on welfare that won't get a job, pay taxes and live in a house on wheels. What's your point?

Do you want a man who hates God, government and life in general raising your children.

No, but again, we aren't talking about my children. This is the man YOU chose to be the father of YOUR children. If you wanted a Christian man as the father of your children, then there were many choices.

You want a man who as terrified his children by breaking down doors and holding a gun to his head raising your kids alone?????

No, but one more time, we aren't talking about MY children and I'm not the one asking the questions on this forum.... this is about YOUR children.

You find that acceptabe? I DONT!!!!!

Me either, but it is what it is

I am not trying to make him anything except some form a father who has some kind of a relationship with his kids.

And what you seem not to understand is that you can't MAKE anyone anything they don't WANT to be on their own.

I was married to him for 10 years and dated him for 10 years prior to that.

And for 20 years you probably ran around trying to MAKE him someone he's not. Now, he's just the person he's always been...and happy about it. And in this great ole' country of ours that gives people many, many freedoms that you have partaken in... he has that right.

Please don't insult me by classifying me as someone with no self control who just mindlessly slept with someone without care for the consequences.

I'm sorry. Where did you hear me say that? Please don't get overly dramatic with me. Women who do that irritate me to no end.

He was a good person for a very long time but he is nowhere close to a sound individual.

And probably never was....

We went to counseling before the divorce and the psychologist said he is clinically depressed and there is nothing I can do about it.

That's right... there's nothing you can do to change him. That's what the psychologist said. One more time... there is nothing YOU can do to change HIM.

He needs medication and counseling and he will not get better until he gets treatment. I have gone to the hospital psych ward with him two years ago when he was suicidal and they referred him to the county unit because of no insurance. He goes when it gets awful to counselilng but will not medicate. This just isn't because he is not who I want him to be.

Your whole post is about how he is not who you want him to be....

He has made no changes to his lifestyle or engagment with the girls.

What you want him to do....

I have pleaded with him to lead his life as a man who puts being a father as a priority.

What you want him to be....

He tells me I do not understand how difficult his life is and it is all he can do to stay sober and alive.

WHAT HIS FOCUS IS AND WHAT HE WANTS TO DO.... and he's probably right. You don't understand how difficult it is.

He does not go to the events at school or sports.

What you want him to do....

I understand biological parents having the first right to their children and I have truly pushed and tried with their dad.

Pushing for????? What you want him to be.....

I taken out books from the library for him to read but I cannot fix him.

Of course, he didn't ask for those books.... again, trying to get him to do what you want him to....

I am sorry for your illness, but as I said before, he has a right, as an adult and (presumably) as an American to lead his life the way he chooses to. He also has a right to be a parent, even if he chooses not to be a great one. However, maybe you can ask him to make sure your children have a relationship with your sister and her husband if he can.

 

[CourtClerk]

Apparently he didn't hate GOD, life or the government when you were with him.

See, I think I disagree with that. I think he always did. He was able to (excuse the pun) let his hair down and be who he wanted to be after they got divorced. This is probably who he's always been....