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Friendly visit from CPS

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Proserpina

Senior Member
Hush your muffin. Your village is calling. Your anti-government sentiment will only make things harder on this OP, who is clearly trying to do the right thing. Go away, Troll. :rolleyes:


Y'know, I got a question here.

How is what he said any different from the advice and sentiment about CPS frequently shared by OG on these forums?


(The bit about "I will arrest you.." notwithstanding)
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
Y'know, I got a question here.

How is what he said any different from the advice and sentiment about CPS frequently shared by OG on these forums?


(The bit about "I will arrest you.." notwithstanding)
I don't know. I have told people they do NOT have to cooperate with CPS. I don't and never will. Sorry but if they come on my property they will be asked to leave, and then TOLD to leave. And no, I am not distrustful of the government but believe that CPS IN MY COUNTY is not to be trusted. They have violated the law many times in this area.
 

CSO286

Senior Member
Y'know, I got a question here.

How is what he said any different from the advice and sentiment shared by OG on these forums (not infrequently!)?


(The bit about "I will arrest you.." notwithstanding)
I would say there isn't, however, OG has earned her chops and this noob doesn't appear to have any actual legal advice to back up his rant.
 

Proserpina

Senior Member
I don't know. I have told people they do NOT have to cooperate with CPS. I don't and never will. Sorry but if they come on my property they will be asked to leave, and then TOLD to leave. And no, I am not distrustful of the government but believe that CPS IN MY COUNTY is not to be trusted. They have violated the law many times in this area.

That's exactly my point!

Sometimes I think we tend to "jump" simply for the sake of jumping.

But I'll go hush my muffin and start pouring ;) :D
 

dmcc10880

Member
While "muffins are hushing" I would like to chime in and say the OP needs to know her rights. She has the right to deny access without a warrant. She needs to know that she can have an attorney present. No one here knows what the objective of the CPS visit is. The best is to be open, but guarded and know when to say "this is over, please leave".
 

Moe248

Junior Member
The government in your home

Well I am occasionally inclined to agree... I was actually asking thinking that a senior here may tell me not to let them in with out my atty being present. This is something that has crossed my mind, that not much good may result from letting them in but a lot of bad could in fact come of it. What if they are a neat freak, what if my sassy pants cat hisses at them, what if she has a melt down, wets her pants etc etc etc... BUT I see it on the flip also, that regular families live in homes far messier then my own (outside of my sewing room and the laundry area on the unfinished side of my basement there is nothing like laying out on the floor) WE love his daughter and she loves us, we do fun things with her, and we keep a fairly safe healthy home. But again the what if's are running through my brain...

This is why im here asking, if a senior sends me a PM I will literally take my camera phone and take photos of every room of my home... While my mom would say it was a wreck the avg american would probably think it's just fine.... Again... I don't really know what CPS is looking for, for all I know she made allegations during her home visit OR they could be planning to recommend to the court given there is an open custody case that his daughter be placed here.

The CPS worker that i spoke to used words like "informal visit" "just to check in to talk" and other similar verbiage, they did not ask to come the day of the call and ask when would be a good time for us. All of this could be a trap, OR it could be someone who wants to help us and most importantly help his daughter. Who knows WHAT they found on her home visit, it could have been pretty not-so-good.... With in 30 minutes of their call to me Mom called Dad in HYSTERICS going on about her "results" and that they were trying to "take her away from BOTH of them" while it could be an over-reaction for a worried mom she could be unsure on the results of her visit, she could be worried she had a dirty drug screen, the child could have told CPS something bad, who the heck knows... Thats why I signed up to ask questions I figured someone here would be able to steer us in the right direction.

I can say that out of all of this ever since CPS's first call to mom (two days after the rock incident) Mom has been leaving work earlier, child has been cleaner when we see her, and they have actually been doing things together. So in the event that she passed her CPS visit but this event scared her into better parenting well... that's a win for the child who even though she is not my own I love very much. As a woman i would never wish for child to not have a healthy relationship with mom, while I do think dad has more time for her and is overall a more attentive parent I am a firm believer that kids need two parents.

I live in a county that has really bad problems with poverty, along with that comes serious issues with children living in unsafe unsuitable situations. Pretty sure CPS walks into many many far worse places than my home. Or mom's home for that matter.

So again open to advice and suggestions on how best to handle this, I am taking the afternoon/evening off to get a little wild with the cleaning, figure the sewing room with 10,000,000 projects all over every surface including the floor probably needs attention. As well as the laundry situation....

No worries on the tone, unless you put angry faces all over it or say you think im an idiot or an overinvolved girlfriend I will assume you are just busy typing quickly and being informative :)

OHIOGAL you seem to have legal expertise as well as experience with CPS while I realize you are not acting as my attorney given the scenario that i have laid out here would you have CPS come as scheduled tomorrow or refuse them? HONESTLY the WORST of my home will be a Michigan basement that occasionally gets wet, some laundry on the floor near the washer (in the basement) and some dust bunnies. We don't use drugs, are not heavy drinkers, ETC ETC ETC. Tomorrow at 1130 we drive an hour to pick up the child from her new "school" that she started at a month ago and bring her here, CPS will be here within 1 hour from our arrival home. There are no other kids, 3 cats, a great big fish tank, she has her own room with her own furniture toys, there is kid art up all over the place etc etc... Oh and my lawn will be a bit bushy due to my dead lawn mower (not like super bushy, not the bushiest on the block but will look like it needs trimmed). Oh and I smoke cigarettes outside, her mother smokes as well and does so indoors. I guess thats probably less than desirable but Im not a CPS person. We do have an atty on retainer for the divorce/custody situation who we have left messages for all day today but she was at court and didn't make it back before the end of the day. She may or may not call us back before the apt.
 
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KmanStuck

Member
Hush your muffin. Your village is calling. Your anti-government sentiment will only make things harder on this OP, who is clearly trying to do the right thing. Go away, Troll. :rolleyes:
OK Subject Artemis. My post was not anti-government; it was pro-freedom.

I guess you let in any government employee into your house.. RIGHT. When the time comes... you'll follow my sound advice or cower like a subject???

I've kicked out politicians going door to door, local police, federal agents, assessors, etc.. and I am still a free person & nothing ever happened due to my booting them off my land.

You point would be to allow searches w/o warrants .. this will result in arrests for laws that the folks did not even know existed. They'll learn the hard way from you advice of allowing the government employees free access to their dwelling & property.

How may people on this board REGRET "cooperating" with government employees. Too many to count.
 

Artemis_ofthe_Hunt

Senior Member
My opinion is that if you a are a free citizen, letting a government employee into your dwelling or property can only result in you not being free anymore. There are 27,000+ laws we are supposed to know & obey. I don't know them all, nobody does ...
I answer all inquires of government employees asking for entry onto my property by the same question: do you have a warrant? When they say no, I ask them to leave my property NOW. If they keep on jabbering on about how it helps me, I then say "You are now trespassing, leave my property NOW or I will arrest you".

The government is not going to make your free-er ; only less free.
The bolded is what I was referring to. ;)

Hush your muffin. Your village is calling. Your anti-government sentiment will only make things harder on this OP, who is clearly trying to do the right thing. Go away, Troll. :rolleyes:
Y'know, I got a question here.

How is what he said any different from the advice and sentiment about CPS frequently shared by OG on these forums?


(The bit about "I will arrest you.." notwithstanding)
The difference is that OG has reason to not want these people in her house, doesn't make the Trolls point clear or correct... it makes him, well... I am not going to voice the word I'm thinking. I don't want to get banned.

I don't know. I have told people they do NOT have to cooperate with CPS. I don't and never will. Sorry but if they come on my property they will be asked to leave, and then TOLD to leave. And no, I am not distrustful of the government but believe that CPS IN MY COUNTY is not to be trusted. They have violated the law many times in this area.
Yes, you have ALWAYS made sure that we know we have a RIGHT to say "NO!" or "You're not coming in without a warrant".... HOWEVER... IN THIS CASE, since she was directly questioned about the occasion, CPS wants to talk to her, I DO NOT SEE the benefit from reacting this way. She COULD have someone there as a witness, if it would make her feel better, but I don't see how avoiding having CPS come in and give the all clear, being a bad thing!
 

Artemis_ofthe_Hunt

Senior Member
OK Subject Artemis. My post was not anti-government; it was pro-freedom.

I guess you let in any government employee into your house.. RIGHT. When the time comes... you'll follow my sound advice or cower like a subject???

I've kicked out politicians going door to door, local police, federal agents, assessors, etc.. and I am still a free person & nothing ever happened due to my booting them off my land.

You point would be to allow searches w/o warrants .. this will result in arrests for laws that the folks did not even know existed. They'll learn the hard way from you advice of allowing the government employees free access to their dwelling & property.

How may people on this board REGRET "cooperating" with government employees. Too many to count.

NOT my point AT. ALL. My point is that you would tell CPS to get off your land and tell them that YOU ARE ARRESTING THEM????? (seriously?), who has requested WITH RESPECT to speak with OP and to see her home... IN THE COURSE OF AN INVESTIGATION. Not to put a fine point on it, but should she just clam up and NOT cooperate at this point, would surely make her seem suspicious and guilty.
 

Moe248

Junior Member
NOT my point AT. ALL. My point is that you would tell CPS to get off your land and tell them that YOU ARE ARRESTING THEM????? (seriously?), who has requested WITH RESPECT to speak with OP and to see her home... IN THE COURSE OF AN INVESTIGATION. Not to put a fine point on it, but should she just clam up and NOT cooperate at this point, would surely make her seem suspicious and guilty.
This is exactly how we feel about this. If the investigation surrounded around US and was open against US I absolutely would tell them that we needed an atty present or that we wanted to speak at their offices, or to come back with a warrant or all 3... Given that he and i have been compliant to this point it seems like by saying that they don't have the right to come inside etc makes us look like we have something to hide, which we don't. Unless there is some bad aspect about my life that I don't know is bad...

But the not knowing WHY they want to come here makes me nervous. The not knowing what happened when they went to mom's makes me even more nervous...
 

CdwJava

Senior Member
I have seen refusals of voluntary cooperation blossom quickly into court orders.

If all that CPS has to go on is an apparently credible allegation (or actual observation) of abuse or serious neglect, and the suspect party refuses to cooperate and thus provide an alternative viewpoint, they might very well have enough to seek an order from the court to seize the child(ren) pending the conclusion of an investigation. We just had this done here where the parents were loud and obstinate, and CPS' attorney convinced a court to seize the children. After the seizure, the investigation took less than a day, and the children were home the next afternoon.

The point is that when confronted with one version of events, if the allegations are serious enough courts will tend to err on the side of the child's safety. I have no way to know whether this is the case here, but, thought it worth mentioning.
 

Artemis_ofthe_Hunt

Senior Member
This is exactly how we feel about this. If the investigation surrounded around US and was open against US I absolutely would tell them that we needed an atty present or that we wanted to speak at their offices, or to come back with a warrant or all 3... Given that he and i have been compliant to this point it seems like by saying that they don't have the right to come inside etc makes us look like we have something to hide, which we don't. Unless there is some bad aspect about my life that I don't know is bad...

But the not knowing WHY they want to come here makes me nervous. The not knowing what happened when they went to mom's makes me even more nervous...
I had a visit with a LLEA officer not too long ago, that I initiated after being told by my ex that he had (well his now wife) had called CPS on me. I called CPS, trying to get information, was told that they didn't have a case open and with the information that he had shared that they reported, there wouldn't be an investigation (as he threatened... BRING IT, DUDE!!!!). Just to cover my behind, I invited the LLEA officer to come do a spot health and welfare check, so that there was something on the record as to the condition of the house, the food in the fridge, etc.

You'll be fine. Cooperate, but don't forget that you DO have a right to stop the interview in your own home, should you feel like its becoming and inquisition.


The Fourth Amendment (Amendment IV) to the United States Constitution is the part of the Bill of Rights which guards against unreasonable searches and seizures, along with requiring any warrant to be judicially sanctioned and supported by probable cause. It was adopted as a response to the abuse of the writ of assistance, which is a type of general search warrant, in the American Revolution. Search and arrest should be limited in scope according to specific information supplied to the issuing court, usually by a law enforcement officer, who has sworn by it.
 
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