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  1. #1
    learningfromit is offline Junior Member
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    Harassment and custody issues

    I'm sorry I deleted the other thread to start this one, the title of it to me was too specific should my son's dad come by this site. I'd rather avoid his harassing me over finding this thread online, though he still may. I probably seem paranoid, I know. I'm still a little concerned to post here, but more curious to any input I can get on this at this point. Thank you!

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? WI

    My ex is threatening to run me through the court system for custody of our 3 year old son. He already has joint custody and legal visitation which he has not exercised of his own free will for a year now. He's seen our son only three times in the last year, the last time being in July, and each visit was only for a few hours. That being said, I'm really not concerned that he can get full custody at this point.

    He sends me emails to harass me regarding various things though. He is now into this 'free man on the land' movement. He is representing himself in a criminal case for marijuana possession (he doesn't know I know this, I found it online in the circuit courts system). I noticed in the case details he submitted to the court a "Grant of Exclusive Power of Atty to conduct all tax, business and legal affairs of principal person, Detailed List of assets and chancery, Declaration of Sovereignty, Deed of Evidence, etc.". He is also representing himself in his custody case for his daughter from a previous relationship. The GAL in that case did not rule in his favor, and now in a few months he has been granted a four hour trial in which he will attempt to throw everyone involved in his case under the bus. He confidently expects to win full custody of his daughter, who has resided with her mother and family for the 10 years of her life now.

    So, in his latest hate filled, insulting email to me he 'formally requested' that I hand our son over to him. Very out of the blue, considering I've not stood in the way of his relationship with his son at all. He says that "it's the right thing to do", accuses me of being evil, uses way too many capital letters to express his hatred for me, and proceeds to tell me that he'll tear me apart in court and win custody of our son even it if is just by means of rendering me completely broke doing so should I not do as he requests.

    He calls himself a free man of the land now, and has changed the use of his name. So from what I've studied on this, it seems he believes that statute law is maritime law, and common law is what we should follow. He also states that blacks law states that we are not persons, but corporations, and that we all have a "straw man" represented by liens (birth certificates and such) placed on us as children rendering us as assets, pretty much slaves, to this country, which according to this thinking is actually a corporation.

    This is what I may be up against in court soon enough. I personally feel he's losing his mind. Not that all this free man of the land stuff isn't interesting, because it seems that some people who study it are quite interesting and harmless folks. But that he feels the need to harass me and send me these crazy emails and then thinks he'll win full custody inevitably through this practice of common law, and by "owning his strawman" eventually in a court of law.

    He runs an online business devoted to taking over the mainstream media and taking on the new world order, and he says that now he runs the law department for it. I don't know how legal this is considering he has no license to do so. But anyway, I digress...

    Does he have a leg to stand on here? And do you know anything about this free man on the land thinking? I know I don't have any deep legal questions here, but I'm very interested on what your opinions are on this subject. I get that he's just trying to scare me right now, and using our son as a means to do so. I'm prepared to take him on in court, I just am curious if there really is anything here I should be concerned/prepared for. Thank you.
  2. #2
    LdiJ is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by learningfromit View Post
    I'm sorry I deleted the other thread to start this one, the title of it to me was too specific should my son's dad come by this site. I'd rather avoid his harassing me over finding this thread online, though he still may. I probably seem paranoid, I know. I'm still a little concerned to post here, but more curious to any input I can get on this at this point. Thank you!

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? WI

    My ex is threatening to run me through the court system for custody of our 3 year old son. He already has joint custody and legal visitation which he has not exercised of his own free will for a year now. He's seen our son only three times in the last year, the last time being in July, and each visit was only for a few hours. That being said, I'm really not concerned that he can get full custody at this point.

    He sends me emails to harass me regarding various things though. He is now into this 'free man on the land' movement. He is representing himself in a criminal case for marijuana possession (he doesn't know I know this, I found it online in the circuit courts system). I noticed in the case details he submitted to the court a "Grant of Exclusive Power of Atty to conduct all tax, business and legal affairs of principal person, Detailed List of assets and chancery, Declaration of Sovereignty, Deed of Evidence, etc.". He is also representing himself in his custody case for his daughter from a previous relationship. The GAL in that case did not rule in his favor, and now in a few months he has been granted a four hour trial in which he will attempt to throw everyone involved in his case under the bus. He confidently expects to win full custody of his daughter, who has resided with her mother and family for the 10 years of her life now.

    So, in his latest hate filled, insulting email to me he 'formally requested' that I hand our son over to him. Very out of the blue, considering I've not stood in the way of his relationship with his son at all. He says that "it's the right thing to do", accuses me of being evil, uses way too many capital letters to express his hatred for me, and proceeds to tell me that he'll tear me apart in court and win custody of our son even it if is just by means of rendering me completely broke doing so should I not do as he requests.

    He calls himself a free man of the land now, and has changed the use of his name. So from what I've studied on this, it seems he believes that statute law is maritime law, and common law is what we should follow. He also states that blacks law states that we are not persons, but corporations, and that we all have a "straw man" represented by liens (birth certificates and such) placed on us as children rendering us as assets, pretty much slaves, to this country, which according to this thinking is actually a corporation.

    This is what I may be up against in court soon enough. I personally feel he's losing his mind. Not that all this free man of the land stuff isn't interesting, because it seems that some people who study it are quite interesting and harmless folks. But that he feels the need to harass me and send me these crazy emails and then thinks he'll win full custody inevitably through this practice of common law, and by "owning his strawman" eventually in a court of law.

    He runs an online business devoted to taking over the mainstream media and taking on the new world order, and he says that now he runs the law department for it. I don't know how legal this is considering he has no license to do so. But anyway, I digress...

    Does he have a leg to stand on here? And do you know anything about this free man on the land thinking? I know I don't have any deep legal questions here, but I'm very interested on what your opinions are on this subject. I get that he's just trying to scare me right now, and using our son as a means to do so. I'm prepared to take him on in court, I just am curious if there really is anything here I should be concerned/prepared for. Thank you.
    No, there is nothing that you should be concerned/prepared for in terms of this "free man of the land" concept in regards to custody.

    You might want to be a little concerned/prepared by the fact that he threatens to render you completely broke if you do not do what he demands.

    Personally, I think that he is going to make a total fool out of himself in court, but he could make things quite expensive for you if you use an attorney.
  3. #3
    Ronin is offline Member
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    As LdiJ suggested, a fool like this can make things very expensive for you if you have an attorney. Especially since he already appears to be getting some experience as a pro se.

    Depending upon your financial situation and your own tolerance for risk, you will have to make the call on what extent, if any, you wish to retain an attorney to respond to such nonsense in court.

    In the highly unlikely event he ever should become a real legal problem in court, you can always retain an attorney at that time. Or, once it gets to the point where he is filing too many frivolous motions, you can hire an attorney to get him sanctioned by the court for doing so.
  4. #4
    Artemis_ofthe_Hunt is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by learningfromit View Post
    I'm sorry I deleted the other thread to start this one, the title of it to me was too specific should my son's dad come by this site. I'd rather avoid his harassing me over finding this thread online, though he still may. I probably seem paranoid, I know. I'm still a little concerned to post here, but more curious to any input I can get on this at this point. Thank you!

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? WI

    My ex is threatening to run me through the court system for custody of our 3 year old son. He already has joint custody and legal visitation which he has not exercised of his own free will for a year now. He's seen our son only three times in the last year, the last time being in July, and each visit was only for a few hours. That being said, I'm really not concerned that he can get full custody at this point.

    He sends me emails to harass me regarding various things though. He is now into this 'free man on the land' movement. He is representing himself in a criminal case for marijuana possession (he doesn't know I know this, I found it online in the circuit courts system). I noticed in the case details he submitted to the court a "Grant of Exclusive Power of Atty to conduct all tax, business and legal affairs of principal person, Detailed List of assets and chancery, Declaration of Sovereignty, Deed of Evidence, etc.". He is also representing himself in his custody case for his daughter from a previous relationship. The GAL in that case did not rule in his favor, and now in a few months he has been granted a four hour trial in which he will attempt to throw everyone involved in his case under the bus. He confidently expects to win full custody of his daughter, who has resided with her mother and family for the 10 years of her life now.

    So, in his latest hate filled, insulting email to me he 'formally requested' that I hand our son over to him. Very out of the blue, considering I've not stood in the way of his relationship with his son at all. He says that "it's the right thing to do", accuses me of being evil, uses way too many capital letters to express his hatred for me, and proceeds to tell me that he'll tear me apart in court and win custody of our son even it if is just by means of rendering me completely broke doing so should I not do as he requests.

    He calls himself a free man of the land now, and has changed the use of his name. So from what I've studied on this, it seems he believes that statute law is maritime law, and common law is what we should follow. He also states that blacks law states that we are not persons, but corporations, and that we all have a "straw man" represented by liens (birth certificates and such) placed on us as children rendering us as assets, pretty much slaves, to this country, which according to this thinking is actually a corporation.

    This is what I may be up against in court soon enough. I personally feel he's losing his mind. Not that all this free man of the land stuff isn't interesting, because it seems that some people who study it are quite interesting and harmless folks. But that he feels the need to harass me and send me these crazy emails and then thinks he'll win full custody inevitably through this practice of common law, and by "owning his strawman" eventually in a court of law.

    He runs an online business devoted to taking over the mainstream media and taking on the new world order, and he says that now he runs the law department for it. I don't know how legal this is considering he has no license to do so. But anyway, I digress...

    Does he have a leg to stand on here? And do you know anything about this free man on the land thinking? I know I don't have any deep legal questions here, but I'm very interested on what your opinions are on this subject. I get that he's just trying to scare me right now, and using our son as a means to do so. I'm prepared to take him on in court, I just am curious if there really is anything here I should be concerned/prepared for. Thank you.
    When I worked for law firm in WY, we had a respondent who always filed cases against our attorneys in Superior Court citing some pretty strange interpretations of law as well. After a while, the court and the clerks got tired of her rampages, petty suits for several million in damages etc. The courts aren't stupid. While your ex might have a slight point, law presumably still stands that there would have to be a substancial change in circumstances in order for him to take custody at this point.

    What are the visitation particulars? If he isn't utilizing his specified visitation, you could file for a modification for the time he does actually use.

    Bottom line is this; answer whatever documents you recieve for court (no matter how redunkulous), appear as ordered and for the LOVE OF ALL THINGS DO NOT LOSE YOUR MIND!

    Good luck to you!
  5. #5
    LdiJ is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by should_I_ask View Post
    When I worked for law firm in WY, we had a respondent who always filed cases against our attorneys in Superior Court citing some pretty strange interpretations of law as well. After a while, the court and the clerks got tired of her rampages, petty suits for several million in damages etc. The courts aren't stupid. While your ex might have a slight point, law presumably still stands that there would have to be a substancial change in circumstances in order for him to take custody at this point.

    What are the visitation particulars? If he isn't utilizing his specified visitation, you could file for a modification for the time he does actually use.

    Bottom line is this; answer whatever documents you recieve for court (no matter how redunkulous), appear as ordered and for the LOVE OF ALL THINGS DO NOT LOSE YOUR MIND!

    Good luck to you!
    Just to make it clear, her ex doesn't even have a slight point.
  6. #6
    Artemis_ofthe_Hunt is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by LdiJ View Post
    Just to make it clear, her ex doesn't even have a slight point.
    One of the attorneys I worked for (I was relating to that instance, not this one, should have clarified, sorry) read the documents from our crazy respondent, and while LEGALLY there was no point, there were points that did actually make sense. At least to him. It was pretty much mumbo jumbo to me at the time. I was not inferring the the OP's ex had or has or might have had a point in the way that he is tying up the court system. Sorry for the confusion on my response.
  7. #7
    learningfromit is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you for the responses.

    If there is anything I feel any concern over it is the financial aspects...however I am prepared to do what I have to. I definitely don't have much in the way of money...I'm a single mother of 2 living with my mother. I work 30 hours a week and go to school part time (mostly online). My family and friends will definitely help, but none of them are wealthy either. I won't spill all my beans here should he actually check this out (I'm pretty sure he's read things on this site before), but I'm just leaving the situation alone now. I don't respond to any of his crazy emails anymore. I'm just hoping he'll take enough rope to hang himself with. As he is in these other two court situations, he is weighing out the results in these cases as to how he'll handle me. They won't finalize until January.

    He hasn't even seen our Son since July, nor has he exercised his visitation times since we broke up a year ago. He's had basically no contact with our son of his own free will for longer than I can understand now. I've done nothing to hinder his involvement of his son. I don't see how he is going to get full custody that way. I'm keeping an eye on the circuit courts to make sure he doesn't try to file something without me knowing.

    I'm sure he is learning a lot, at least he tells me he is, he supposedly is spending his days studying statutes and laws...but he does have this idea that he can make himself above the law by claiming his "strawman", and becoming a sovereign being, or whatever. Seems he thinks he's found the magical way out of any legal situation.

    I would hope that should he continuously drag me into the courts, eventually I could charge him my legal fees and/or make it so he can no longer represent himself. I must admit though, I look into these legal issues and it blurs my mind. I'm going for counseling to aid in my dealing with his emotional abuse, hoping that will strengthen me for the oh so fun filled games he will be playing with me for as long as he can. He lives to upset me and his daughters mother, and pretty much anyone who doesn't agree with him about life. Which is every living, breathing person he interacts with outside of his world online, where he is treated like a Saint by a group of people who don't even know what he's really like.

    It should be interesting to see how his criminal case and custody case with his daughter pans out.
  8. #8
    learningfromit is offline Junior Member
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    I do wonder if, if (or when), we end up in a courtroom, I can prove through his very incriminating emails that he is indeed mentally instable, would that affect his ability to represent himself? I have a folder full of long, sometimes very strange, emails from him over this last year. He displays his major anger issues, suicidal thoughts, paranoia, and is narcissistic quite openly in these emails, IMO at least, for what it is worth.
  9. #9
    learningfromit is offline Junior Member
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    If I were to decide to take this on pro se as well, and later in my case decided I would prefer representation, would that be a problem?
  10. #10
    Ohiogal is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by learningfromit View Post
    If I were to decide to take this on pro se as well, and later in my case decided I would prefer representation, would that be a problem?
    Not necessarily. Be sure however that you know the local rules, the rules of civil procedure and the rules of evidence. And that you are able to leave the emotion out of everything if you go pro se.
    Parents should remember 3 things: Love your kids more than you hate your ex; when you have children the relationship with the other parent is until death; your children determine what type of nursing home you end up in.
    Nothing stated by me should be taken as giving you legal advice or forming an attorney/client relationship.

    Attorney-GAL in Ohio.

    I've removed the knife from my back, polished it, and will one day return it -- long after you think I have forgotten.
  11. #11
    learningfromit is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you all for your advice. I'll be preparing myself the best I can. If it gets interesting I'm sure you'll hear from me again!
  12. #12
    LdiJ is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by learningfromit View Post
    Thank you for the responses.

    If there is anything I feel any concern over it is the financial aspects...however I am prepared to do what I have to. I definitely don't have much in the way of money...I'm a single mother of 2 living with my mother. I work 30 hours a week and go to school part time (mostly online). My family and friends will definitely help, but none of them are wealthy either. I won't spill all my beans here should he actually check this out (I'm pretty sure he's read things on this site before), but I'm just leaving the situation alone now. I don't respond to any of his crazy emails anymore. I'm just hoping he'll take enough rope to hang himself with. As he is in these other two court situations, he is weighing out the results in these cases as to how he'll handle me. They won't finalize until January.

    He hasn't even seen our Son since July, nor has he exercised his visitation times since we broke up a year ago. He's had basically no contact with our son of his own free will for longer than I can understand now. I've done nothing to hinder his involvement of his son. I don't see how he is going to get full custody that way. I'm keeping an eye on the circuit courts to make sure he doesn't try to file something without me knowing.

    I'm sure he is learning a lot, at least he tells me he is, he supposedly is spending his days studying statutes and laws...but he does have this idea that he can make himself above the law by claiming his "strawman", and becoming a sovereign being, or whatever. Seems he thinks he's found the magical way out of any legal situation.

    I would hope that should he continuously drag me into the courts, eventually I could charge him my legal fees and/or make it so he can no longer represent himself. I must admit though, I look into these legal issues and it blurs my mind. I'm going for counseling to aid in my dealing with his emotional abuse, hoping that will strengthen me for the oh so fun filled games he will be playing with me for as long as he can. He lives to upset me and his daughters mother, and pretty much anyone who doesn't agree with him about life. Which is every living, breathing person he interacts with outside of his world online, where he is treated like a Saint by a group of people who don't even know what he's really like.

    It should be interesting to see how his criminal case and custody case with his daughter pans out.
    You caused me to read up a little bit more on this whole free man of the land movement and I have to tell you that particularly the "strawman" part of it is as ridiculous as it gets.

    They claim that for each and every person in the US with a birth certificate, that the US government has set up a secret bank account somewhere that has 630,000 in it (yes, they are that specific). "Claiming your strawman" means somehow getting your hands on that 630,000 that is alledgedly out there somewhere, in your name.

    They also claim that statutes are based on Admiralty law, rather than common law (which according to them is the only appropriate law), and that therefore all statutes are null and void and don't apply to anybody.

    As much as I appreciate the internet, this is one prime example of why its problematic. Prior to the internet, crazy movements like these couldn't go anywhere, because the mainstream media would never give them any press, so ordinary people wouldn't get caught up in them. However, with the internet allowing anybody to say virtually anything they want, ordinary people get caught up in these ridiculous movements, and find themselves in a world of hurt.

    I suspect that dad is going to end up spending some time in prison on the Marijuana bust, for no reason other than lack of adequate representation in court. I also can almost guarantee that he will flat out lose his bid for custody of his daughter.

    Do make sure that you print out and keep every email that he sends you (with headers) and put them in a file to use for court, if needed.
  13. #13
    learningfromit is offline Junior Member
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    LdiJ,

    I looked into this 'movement' too and found that info. Wow? He sure is at least bluffing some serious confidence that he can win whatever he pursues in the court system from here on. And he believes all attorneys are either in on it (the conspiracy which is our slave based system) or ignorant of it themselves. I'm sure he'll have some colorful words for me should I hire myself an attorney.

    You would probably crack up if you read some of the things he sends me. I received an entire email regarding our sons "strawman" and what I "need" to be doing about it, and a couple similar emails. But, it's not really funny when I think about my little guy, poor kid.

    I've looked back at my calendar, where I've marked each visit he had with his dad over the last year. Only 2! Once in June and once in July. I thought it was more because I forgot how he canceled his first 3 attempts at visits last minute. The visits were not long either. He hadn't seen our son in 6 months already, so I requested he ease back into his visitation for our sons sake rather than taking him for a whole weekend right off the bat. And he did not argue with that.

    I just don't get him...he blames me for his not seeing our son. I never prevented him from seeing our son, he just never asks. Now out of nowhere he's demanding that I "hand over your son and let the healing begin". That is me quoting his last email. I've received in two months time emails ranging from "I still love you, and I'm a terrible father, I wish I were dead" to "I HATE YOU, our son will someday hate you too, I have so much to offer a family". UGH.

    I have saved and printed every email I've received. I have dated accounts of his 2 visits and one dated account of a phone call I got where he stated to me he was done being our son's father if we wouldn't come home to him. I probably haven't documented them that well, but it's something. I have to wonder if the emails alone could show good cause for his mental instability.

    I see on his pending criminal case he 'stood mute'. It looked like they said he was not guilty, but they have reopened it. I guess that standing mute enters a plea of not guilty then sends him to trial? I'm keeping tabs on it. But, should he win that case, suddenly become hundreds of thousands of dollars richer, and move his daughter into his home, I'll let you know!
    Last edited by learningfromit; 11-08-2009 at 07:52 PM. Reason: grammar

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