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  1. #1
    ProSeMe is offline Member
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    Joint Legal Custody - Can CP move out of state without notifying NCP?

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Virginia

    I am a NCP. I currently have "joint legal custody" and "Reasonable and Liberal" visitation from my divorce. I just found that my child's mother has moved out of state, and refuse to tell me where. I am currently paying child support and all of that, but she has gone crazy and saying things like "I am not the father". I know I am, because I had gotten a personal DNA test a long time ago, but that is not the point. My name is not on the birth certificate, but I have to go back to Georgia to apply to the court to have it changed, because she is refusing to sign the papers to have it changed.

    I do not have any specific court orders that says that she can not move, which now, I wish I had, but is there anything that I can file in VA which can contest her move? I know that she did not move for a career, because she has no real marketable career. She has lived here in Virginia and I have been able to see my daughter, sometimes not on a "correct schedule" but enough to be every other week, sometimes 3 weeks.

    My question is, since I have "joint legal custody" as well as "reasonable and liberal visitation", is she allowed to just get up and move my child to a different school, in a different state when she feels like it or does she have to notify me first? I know I have nothing in writing, but is there anything that I can file with the court to contest her move or something? Am I screwed since she already moved?

    Note: I know that I should get a lawyer, which is always best, so please refrain from posting a non-helpful post as "get a lawyer". I would prefer helpfulpost such as "A lawyer will be able to file "X" paper and request "X" document from the court to contest "X" case.
  2. #2
    Ohiogal is offline Senior Member
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    Goody. You want to dictate how we can respond? Yeah, that so will not happen.

    So how long ago did she move and when was the last time you saw your child? Did you legitimize your child?
    Parents should remember 3 things: Love your kids more than you hate your ex; when you have children the relationship with the other parent is until death; your children determine what type of nursing home you end up in.
    Nothing stated by me should be taken as giving you legal advice or forming an attorney/client relationship.

    Attorney-GAL in Ohio.

    I've removed the knife from my back, polished it, and will one day return it -- long after you think I have forgotten.
  3. #3
    ProSeMe is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ohiogal View Post
    So how long ago did she move and when was the last time you saw your child? Did you legitimize your child?
    I think she moved this week. I saw my child weekend before this past weekend. I contacted her about seeing my child this coming week and she informed me that she has moved out of state.

    What do you mean by "did I legitimize my child"? My child is on our divorce decree and that is what state the conditions of the divorce as "joint legal custody with physical custody to mother" as well as "reasonable and liberal visitation" to me.
  4. #4
    mistoffolees is offline Senior Member
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    Check your state laws. I believe VA has a statute requiring notification 30 days in advance of moving.
  5. #5
    Ohiogal is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mistoffolees View Post
    Check your state laws. I believe VA has a statute requiring notification 30 days in advance of moving.
    Court order appears to be out of Georgia based on this:
    My name is not on the birth certificate, but I have to go back to Georgia to apply to the court to have it changed, because she is refusing to sign the papers to have it changed.
    Were you married to mom when the child was born?
    Parents should remember 3 things: Love your kids more than you hate your ex; when you have children the relationship with the other parent is until death; your children determine what type of nursing home you end up in.
    Nothing stated by me should be taken as giving you legal advice or forming an attorney/client relationship.

    Attorney-GAL in Ohio.

    I've removed the knife from my back, polished it, and will one day return it -- long after you think I have forgotten.
  6. #6
    BL
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    What State were the Orders made in?
    What State do you reside in ?
    Do you know their Address?

    FYI though most if not all States have parental kidnapping ( your State may use a different term ) with Joint Legal Custody .

    There are remedies depending on the answer to the questions I posted.
    Last edited by BL; 08-31-2010 at 08:19 PM.
  7. #7
    ProSeMe is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ohiogal View Post
    Court order appears to be out of Georgia


    Were you married to mom when the child was born?
    Court order is in Virginia. The court order was given in the divorce decree where it states"joint legal custody with physical custody to mother" as well as "reasonable and liberal visitation" to me. The judge in my divorce case as well as the clerk of court told me that was my court ordered visitation. It is just not a detailed specific one, but it is still one.

    I was married to mom when child was born, but I got divorced, later remarried mom, then divorce again, and staying that way now. Child was born in Georgia. My child's birth certificate is from that state, and I had been trying to change to be added to it as the father, but the mother is refusing to cooperate and sign the paper, so my only resort to doing it is to physically go to GA to file documents to get the court to order my name to be added to the birth certificate as father. I am paying child support from GA which was from divorce#1 from mom. Child support is still in GA, but I just filed to have it moved to VA.

    Child, mom, myself have been living in VA for over 5 years now.

    Quote Originally Posted by BL View Post
    What State were the Orders made in and What State do you reside in ?

    FYI though most if not all States have parental kidnapping ( your state may use a different term ) with Joint Legal Custody .

    There are remedies depending on the answer to the questions I posted.
    Got married and then divorce orders made in VA. Lived in VA for over 5 years, was well as mom and child.

    Would I be able to go after her with parental kidnapping (or whatever term my state calls it) since I only have Joint Legal Custody? I was worried that since I do not have a specific court order from the Juvenile and Domestic Relations Court, but simply a divorce decree from the circuit court, I might be out of luck. I was worried that because my order does not state specifically that she can not move more than 'X' amount of miles away, I might have been out of luck.

    Does "Joint legal custody" as well as "reasonable and liberal" visitation give me that much legal rights even though it did not state the terms of visitation and moving explicitly in writing?


    I think I am going in to the court house tomorrow to ask what solutions exist or what I can do, but all advice from here is good, so I appreciate the responses and the help so far.
  8. #8
    stealth2 is offline Senior Member
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    Get a lawyer.

    *snort* Couldn't resist.
  9. #9
    ProSeMe is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BL View Post
    Do you know their Address?
    I do not know mom and child's current address. Is there a way I could find out? I am paying child support, so my checks are going somewhere. She is refusing to tell me where. I started emailing mom so that I could keep a email trail of the conversation with her refusing me visitation.
  10. #10
    BL
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    [url]http://www.missingkids.com/en_US/documents/CriminalCustodialInterference.pdf[/url]

    VA. code Ann S 18.2-49.1

    No explicit mention of Joint Custody.

    [url]http://www.courts.state.va.us/opinions/opncavwp/1937954.pdf[/url]

    The appellate court's ruling with Joint Legal and physical.


    In the end you will probably need an attorney . The court might appoint you one if you qualify . Inquire into it .

    Contact the local DA. and see if they are willing to proceed with this .

    If not file a modification citing the contempt .

    If you do not know the whereabouts request the court to sign a FPLS form and initiate it . Others in authority can also sign and initiate such forms .

    Child Find of America was helpful in locating mine when a Judge laughed in my face .

    The missing children's link about child abductions has a wealth of info also .

    You might find the link about you State's child abduction laws through missing children.

    Added. Since you know her e-mail address send one out a demand she return the child to your State immediately ,or you will proceed both criminally class 6 felony and civilly.
    Last edited by BL; 08-31-2010 at 08:55 PM.
  11. #11
    gr8rn is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BL View Post
    [url][U]

    Child Find of America was helpful in locating mine when a Judge laughed in my face .
    I find this very unsettling and disturbing. I am so sorry that happened to you, BL. Just serves to remind us all what a crazy system we have to deal with sometimes.
  12. #12
    BL
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    Quote Originally Posted by gr8rn View Post
    I find this very unsettling and disturbing. I am so sorry that happened to you, BL. Just serves to remind us all what a crazy system we have to deal with sometimes.
    Well at the time of my first appearance I did not have representation ,nor was I aware of the Laws , especially the FPLS forms ,not that it would have made a difference with this Judge .He shot the case out the second go around and stated my State no longer had Jurisdiction when it did .

    It was sent back through appeals ,and in front of a different Judge .

    Appellate court stated ,that Judge abused his discretion.

    I learned a lot along the way . A lot during my own research ,contacting agencies , my Congress person ,etc.
    Last edited by BL; 08-31-2010 at 09:21 PM.
  13. #13
    ProSeMe is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by gr8rn View Post
    I find this very unsettling and disturbing. I am so sorry that happened to you, BL. Just serves to remind us all what a crazy system we have to deal with sometimes.
    Quote Originally Posted by BL View Post
    Well at the time of my first appearance I did not have representation ,nor was I aware of the Laws , especially the FPLS forms ,not that it would have made a difference with this Judge .He shot the case out the second go around and stated my State no longer had Jurisdiction when it did .

    It was sent back through appeals ,and in front of a different Judge .

    Appellate court stated ,that Judge abused his discretion.

    I learned a lot along the way . A lot during my own research ,contacting agencies , my Congress person ,etc.
    Thank you SOOO much for all the help. I am so sorry to hear about your case as well, but happy that it turned out well. This gives me hope for my case. I had already filed for a modification of my visitation last week and I got served by the sheriff for my modification court date today. I know she got hers last week, because she text me cursing me out. I think that is when she decided to move or something. She was still here when she got served by the Sheriff last week.


    I was about to ask if I could email her and tell her that I will pursue court actions if she does not return my daughter. Are you sure its a good idea to demand that she return and inform her of the felony charges if she doesn't comply? What can I do to prove that she moved out? Should I go to her address and take pictures showing that she moved without telling me then I go to court in the morning?
  14. #14
    BL
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    Quote Originally Posted by ProSeMe View Post
    Thank you SOOO much for all the help. I am so sorry to hear about your case as well, but happy that it turned out well. This gives me hope for my case. I had already filed for a modification of my visitation last week and I got served by the sheriff for my modification court date today. I know she got hers last week, because she text me cursing me out. I think that is when she decided to move or something. She was still here when she got served by the Sheriff last week.


    I was about to ask if I could email her and tell her that I will pursue court actions if she does not return my daughter. Are you sure its a good idea to demand that she return and inform her of the felony charges if she doesn't comply? What can I do to prove that she moved out? Should I go to her address and take pictures showing that she moved without telling me then I go to court in the morning?
    Is the child in public school ?

    Yes ,an e-mail would not hurt .
  15. #15
    Mr.X is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by BL View Post
    Is the child in public school ?

    Yes ,an e-mail would not hurt .
    My child is about to start public school. Mom is on Section 8 housing. I am not quite sure, but I know she gets money for housing on a program that sounds very much like Section 8.

    I knew her pre-school information last year (after mom mercifully granted me permission to visit school). I wish I knew my rights more before, but it is a learning process. I was thinking that kindergarten would be the same school, but mom is not very merciful now in giving me this information. That is why I went back last week to file a amendment to my visitation order so I can have a judge tell her that she can not keep these things from me. Now though, she has moved away, despite having a court date in November to amend the visitation and create a strict schedule. I included in the amendment that I want a no-move radius of 30 miles. I guess she saw that and figured she's better off moving before the court date.
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