"Standard" Interstate Visitation Schedule - Preschool aged children

[BobJoeJim]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Washington

I'm posting this on behalf of my girlfriend, who I'm currently attempting to assist with her divorce proceedings. She is trying to develop a counter-proposal to the Parenting Plan proposed by the children's father, but neither she nor I have any idea what would be considered reasonable and what would be considered an excessive request on either side. We are wondering if there is a "standard" structure for her general circumstances that she could use as a starting point.

Here are the pertinent details of the situation:
The children are 2 and 4 years old.
The mother lives in Oregon, the father lives in Washington, approximately 300 miles apart.
The mother has custody.

We are wondering what would be normal both now, and after the children are old enough that they begin school. How many days/weeks/months would the father normally be able to expect visitation rights each year? How frequent would visitations normally be (numerous short visitations versus longer less frequent ones?)

I can and will post additional details on the specific situation, since I realize details are critical, but I'd really like to wait for a couple of responses first, to get a sense of what would generally be considered reasonable in this type of situation.

Thank you!

 

[Ohiogal]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Washington

I'm posting this on behalf of my girlfriend, who I'm currently attempting to assist with her divorce proceedings.

Are you an attorney? Naw strike that question. You aren't. because that would be unethical and get your disbarred. Anyway, your girlfriend is committing adultery.

She is trying to develop a counter-proposal to the Parenting Plan proposed by the children's father, but neither she nor I have any idea what would be considered reasonable and what would be considered an excessive request on either side. We are wondering if there is a "standard" structure for her general circumstances that she could use as a starting point.

I take it the case is in Washington. Standard? Dad has the same rights to parent as mom in this case as the parents are married.

Here are the pertinent details of the situation:
The children are 2 and 4 years old.
The mother lives in Oregon, the father lives in Washington, approximately 300 miles apart.
The mother has custody.

Mom has a court order for custody or just has the children with her? I take it mom moved from dad? Where do you live?

We are wondering what would be normal both now, and after the children are old enough that they begin school. How many days/weeks/months would the father normally be able to expect visitation rights each year? How frequent would visitations normally be (numerous short visitations versus longer less frequent ones?)

Numerous visits for mom with dad having custody. How does that work? What would mom expect if her children were 300 miles from her because the other parent decided to move with her adulterous lover?

I can and will post additional details on the specific situation, since I realize details are critical, but I'd really like to wait for a couple of responses first, to get a sense of what would generally be considered reasonable in this type of situation.

Post details. Actually have mom post as you are NOT a party to this situation.

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Washington

I'm posting this on behalf of my girlfriend, who I'm currently attempting to assist with her divorce proceedings. She is trying to develop a counter-proposal to the Parenting Plan proposed by the children's father, but neither she nor I have any idea what would be considered reasonable and what would be considered an excessive request on either side. We are wondering if there is a "standard" structure for her general circumstances that she could use as a starting point.

Here are the pertinent details of the situation:
The children are 2 and 4 years old.
The mother lives in Oregon, the father lives in Washington, approximately 300 miles apart.
The mother has custody.

We are wondering what would be normal both now, and after the children are old enough that they begin school. How many days/weeks/months would the father normally be able to expect visitation rights each year? How frequent would visitations normally be (numerous short visitations versus longer less frequent ones?)

I can and will post additional details on the specific situation, since I realize details are critical, but I'd really like to wait for a couple of responses first, to get a sense of what would generally be considered reasonable in this type of situation.

Thank you!

A typical long distance schedule would be every other Thanksgiving, 1/2 of Christmas Break, every or every other Spring Break, and 1/2 to 3/4th of the summer. If its manageable, one weekend a month is often included.

If mom created the distance, mom should pay for the transportation. If dad created the distance, dad should pay for the transportation.

Until the oldest starts school, other schedules are possible, but for most kids, school itself is a huge change, and if it includes a major change regarding their contact with the other parent at the same time, it can be too much for many children.

 

[BobJoeJim]

Are you an attorney? Naw strike that question. You aren't. because that would be unethical and get your disbarred. Anyway, your girlfriend is committing adultery.

I am not an attorney, I'm just trying to give her some advice on how she should handle the case. Adultery is noted, and I apologize if I offended your morals by dating her for the past seven months, but we're looking for legal advice, thanks.

I take it the case is in Washington. Standard? Dad has the same rights to parent as mom in this case as the parents are married.

As I said, this Parenting Plan is part of divorce proceedings, so once it is finalized, mom and dad will no longer be married, so rights due to marriage are not a factor. The question is what rights does he have as a father.

Mom has a court order for custody or just has the children with her? I take it mom moved from dad? Where do you live?

Court order. Mom moved when the separation occurred in June 2007. Mom now lives in Oregon, dad still lives in Washington, with about 300 miles of separation.

Numerous visits for mom with dad having custody. How does that work? What would mom expect if her children were 300 miles from her because the other parent decided to move with her adulterous lover?

Numerous visits for dad, with mom having custody. Mom lives alone (well, with the children of course. Not with any adulterous lovers however.)

Post details. Actually have mom post as you are NOT a party to this situation.

There is currently a Temporary Parenting Plan in place, that consists of one 7-day visitation each month for the father. What is currently being negotiated is a Final Parenting Plan which is the last hurdle before the divorce can be finalized. The temporary plan contains no provisions for once the children reach school age, but the final plan will have to. Dad's proposed plan included two weekends a month and three two-week periods each summer, which seemed to mom like it would incur exorbitant transportation costs for a single mother supporting two kids on just over minimum wage and an unemployed father with no driver's license. The primary reason for posting here was to see if his proposed schedule was a relatively common one, or whether a court would be likely to agree with mom that the number of proposed visitations is excessive.

You are correct that I am not a party to this situation. I will continue posting on mom's behalf, however, since she does not currently have internet access or a computer.

 

[nextwife]

I am not an attorney, I'm just trying to give her some advice on how she should handle the case. Adultery is noted, and I apologize if I offended your morals by dating her for the past seven months, but we're looking for legal advice, thanks.



As I said, this Parenting Plan is part of divorce proceedings, so once it is finalized, mom and dad will no longer be married, so rights due to marriage are not a factor. The question is what rights does he have as a father.



Court order. Mom moved when the separation occurred in June 2007. Mom now lives in Oregon, dad still lives in Washington, with about 300 miles of separation.



Numerous visits for dad, with mom having custody. Mom lives alone (well, with the children of course. Not with any adulterous lovers however.)



There is currently a Temporary Parenting Plan in place, that consists of one 7-day visitation each month for the father. What is currently being negotiated is a Final Parenting Plan which is the last hurdle before the divorce can be finalized. The temporary plan contains no provisions for once the children reach school age, but the final plan will have to. Dad's proposed plan included two weekends a month and three two-week periods each summer, which seemed to mom like it would incur exorbitant transportation costs for a single mother supporting two kids on just over minimum wage and an unemployed father with no driver's license. The primary reason for posting here was to see if his proposed schedule was a relatively common one, or whether a court would be likely to agree with mom that the number of proposed visitations is excessive.

You are correct that I am not a party to this situation. I will continue posting on mom's behalf, however, since she does not currently have internet access or a computer.

He's their FATHER, why is that very LIMITED time that he is asking for "excessive"? Parents DO have the right to parent their own children, even unemployed parents have that right. Mom CHOSE to move 300 miles away, and therefore created the problem in the first place. Plenty of people simply break up and live in seperate households in the same city. Many I know stayed in the same zip code , so as to provide continuity and NOT disrupt their children.

 

[BobJoeJim]

He's their FATHER, why is that very LIMITED time that he is asking for "excessive"? Parents DO have the right to parent their own children, even unemployed parents have that right. Mom CHOSE to move 300 miles away, and therefore created the problem in the first place. Plenty of people simply break up and live in seperate households in the same city. Many I know stayed in the same zip code , so as to provide continuity and NOT disrupt their children.

Mom does not consider the amount of time that dad is requesting to be excessive; she is concerned about the way it is structured. The structure that dad proposed would include a total of 23 separate visits per year (2 weekends a month for 9 months, one visitation over winter break, one visitation over spring break, and three longer visits over the course of the summer). In the temporary plan, the court ordered that the children be transferred at a midpoint between the two parent's location, which means each visitation requires each parent to make two 300-mile round trips, one to pick the children up and one to drop them off. The proposed schedule would therefore require 27,600 miles of combined driving annually, which works out to an average of approximately $250 in combined gas expenses each month. Obviously the father's employment status does not in any way preclude him from the right to see his children, but in my (admittedly irrelevant) view it does seem excessive to schedule that visitation in such a manner as to require that more than 10% of the parent's combined imputed net income (and more than 20% of their actual combined net income, since his income is imputed based on minimum wage) be dedicated to transportation costs.

Since my view on what is or isn't excessive is irrelevant, however, I was hoping to get input on whether a court would likely agree or not. Mom would prefer a smaller number of visits with longer individual durations, but wants to get some idea of how a court would likely react to that request. Your response suggests to me that court would probably be more likely to side with dad on this issue, which is useful information and is precisely what I was looking for, so thank you.

 

[LdiJ]

I am not an attorney, I'm just trying to give her some advice on how she should handle the case. Adultery is noted, and I apologize if I offended your morals by dating her for the past seven months, but we're looking for legal advice, thanks.



As I said, this Parenting Plan is part of divorce proceedings, so once it is finalized, mom and dad will no longer be married, so rights due to marriage are not a factor. The question is what rights does he have as a father.



Court order. Mom moved when the separation occurred in June 2007. Mom now lives in Oregon, dad still lives in Washington, with about 300 miles of separation.



Numerous visits for dad, with mom having custody. Mom lives alone (well, with the children of course. Not with any adulterous lovers however.)



There is currently a Temporary Parenting Plan in place, that consists of one 7-day visitation each month for the father. What is currently being negotiated is a Final Parenting Plan which is the last hurdle before the divorce can be finalized. The temporary plan contains no provisions for once the children reach school age, but the final plan will have to. Dad's proposed plan included two weekends a month and three two-week periods each summer, which seemed to mom like it would incur exorbitant transportation costs for a single mother supporting two kids on just over minimum wage and an unemployed father with no driver's license. The primary reason for posting here was to see if his proposed schedule was a relatively common one, or whether a court would be likely to agree with mom that the number of proposed visitations is excessive.

You are correct that I am not a party to this situation. I will continue posting on mom's behalf, however, since she does not currently have internet access or a computer.

300 miles is roughly 5-6 hours by car. That's generally a bit too far to really try every other weekend. One weekend a month would be more normal with that distance, and trying to plan that weekend for a long weekend whenever possible, is best.

The summer schedule is maybe even a bit light, depending on how long the summer break is in her school district. A total of 7 or 8 weeks might be better if summer is 12 weeks long. If its only 10 weeks long, then 6 weeks might make sense.