What to do about ex not giving meds?

[kik1999]

Hello CJane,

I wanted to clarify what you say you don't understand about my post this summer, and now. Back in the summer, my son was excited about taking the medication, and it was the first thing he would do upon getting up for breakfast. The change of routine with going to school, and the fact that his father continuously tells him that he does not need the medication, has gotten him out of the habit of taking the medication while at his fathers house. I thought my son was ready this summer to be responsible to take his own medication (although I expected him to need frequent reminders at first, until he developed a routine). Unfortunately, he has not been responsible enough. He will even go so far as to lie to me and tell me he has taken his med, and when I check (count the pills), I find that he hasn't. I guess I was overly optimistic when stating he would/could be responsible for taking his own meds. So yes, that has changed. The sarcasm on this board is unbelievable.

Hi Nurse,

Does your son have side effects that he complains about as a result of the medicine? I'm trying to comprehend why he would lie about taking the meds. My stepdaughter has also been diagnosed with ADD. She was 'hiding' the pills in her jewelry box every once in awhile, and when she was confronted, she stated that the side effects were unbareable to her and she didn't like how the meds made her feel. She also used to try to use the meds as an excuse...when she took them, she attributed it to 'good' behavior and when she didn't take her pill, it was an excuse as to why she didn't do well on a test, or was more aggressive than normal, etc. We nipped that in the bud quickly. The medicine is to help them cope and focus, not an excuse of why they don't do well.

However, I couldn't agree with casa more, that consistency is KEY in success.

After years of trial and error, we found a medicine patch (daytrana) that has worked wonders. She is responsible for putting on the patch in the morning and taking it off in the afternoon. The downfall if she doesn't take the patch off at the correct time, is it keeps her stimulated to the point of not falling asleep with ease. One restless night was all it took for her. She has ALWAYS remembered to take it off at the right time in the afternoon, and it eliminates the arguement of having a child be responsible for administering meds themselves. Just a suggestion based on my previous 5 years of dealing with this diagnosis.

ETA: Ok, I just read where you said he doesn't have the side effects any longer, which is good. How does he feel about taking them? Does he notice a difference? I'm just helping to look for an incentive on how he can want to take these without the assistance of his dad. Unfortunately, based on my expereince, ignorance has a lot to do with why some (I said some, not all ~ please be nice!) parents don't want to use medication on children with ADD/ADHD. I know b/c I was one of those people. I tried and tried to talk to my hubby about other alternatives for my sd. Until I did research. With her, I fully support it now that I see the difference. If this is just simply a parent who has no interest in being an active participant, I would do as casa suggested, and take it to mediation...b/c it probably branches out to beyond the medication.

 

[Nurse at Heart]

Hi Kik,

He takes them at my house (though I sometimes have to remind him). He gives me the bottle he has at his father's house, because I am the one who takes him to get his Rx, and will split the med so that he has enough at his dad's house. However, he came to me with a bottle that was essentially full the last time. That was when I started questioning him more closely as to why it was full, and how could he be taking the pills as he is supposed to, when there are most of them left. That was when he admitted that he hadn't been taking them. Of course he states that he "just forgot", or that he didn't have time to get breakfast, so he didn't take his meds. Our rule in my house has been that he has to eat breakfast, then takes the med (not the other way around, other wise he eats less, as the pills upset his stomach when he takes them on an empty stomach).

My son actually brags about how much easier it is for him to read and do his homework when he has medication. What takes him an hour to do while medicated, would take him the entire evening after school to do while unmedicated. I think this is the reason he does not do all of his homework while at his dad's. I know he tries, but becomes frustrated (just like he did last year before he was medicated). He tells me, the psychiatrist, his teacher, and his therapist, that it is easier to focus and he feels better when taking the medication. What I fear is really happening, is that his father is so disapproving of him taking the med, that even though it is right in the cabinet, my son is afraid of disappointing his father, so will not take it in his presence. I am only guessing this, but it fits with what my daughter tells me (that my son takes his med when his dad leaves early for work).

Thanks for your response. I think my next step is to talk with the therapist, and perhaps start gathering any paperwork that will show that my son is having a harder time without the med, than while on it. I will also notify the psychiatrist that my son is not taking it every day (as he warned about him not going on and off it while we were trying to find the most therapeutic dose). I don't know if it is worth one more try to talk with my ex. If he hangs up on me, then perhaps it is time for a certified letter (or is that over the top?)

 

[kik1999]

I don't think it's over the top. I see it as attempting to co-parent. If he doesn't respond, it can only show his lack thereof, which in turn, would be a good time to consider mediation. Maybe if y'all go to mediation, it would at least bring out the reason WHY he is against the medication. Has dad expressed his concern with the diagnosis altogether, or has he just expressed his concern in the medication as a treatment? From what I gather, he doesn't seem to communicate on either, correct? Again, I was similarly against the medication for my sd when initially diagnosed. Of course, it doesn't matter what I think regarding my sd's ADD, as it is her parents' choice and decision, but when my hubby would ask my opinion, I expressed my discontent with medicating her because I was unaware of the condition itself. I would hope that if dad heard from the doctor's point of view, the explanation of the condition and methods of treating, he'd be open to SOMETHING. Or does he just not communicate with you on any issue?
I wish you the best b/c it is very hard for a child to succeed having ADD and not being addressed properly (whether the treatment be medication, therapy, IEP at school, tutoring, etc.). And unfortunately (in my case with my sd), the hardship in school causes a domino effect, which these kids do not need, including lowering self-esteem. The teachers have stated my sd tries harder than anyone in the class, but lacks the ability to focus, which causes the frustration and ultimately, giving up. Like any medical condition, proper treatment of the individual is key.

 

[Just Blue]

I don't think it's over the top. I see it as attempting to co-parent. If he doesn't respond, it can only show his lack thereof, which in turn, would be a good time to consider mediation. Maybe if y'all go to mediation, it would at least bring out the reason WHY he is against the medication. Has dad expressed his concern with the diagnosis altogether, or has he just expressed his concern in the medication as a treatment? From what I gather, he doesn't seem to communicate on either, correct? Again, I was similarly against the medication for my sd when initially diagnosed. Of course, it doesn't matter what I think regarding my sd's ADD, as it is her parents' choice and decision, but when my hubby would ask my opinion, I expressed my discontent with medicating her because I was unaware of the condition itself. I would hope that if dad heard from the doctor's point of view, the explanation of the condition and methods of treating, he'd be open to SOMETHING. Or does he just not communicate with you on any issue?
I wish you the best b/c it is very hard for a child to succeed having ADD and not being addressed properly (whether the treatment be medication, therapy, IEP at school, tutoring, etc.). And unfortunately (in my case with my sd), the hardship in school causes a domino effect, which these kids do not need, including lowering self-esteem. The teachers have stated my sd tries harder than anyone in the class, but lacks the ability to focus, which causes the frustration and ultimately, giving up. Like any medical condition, proper treatment of the individual is key.

The thing about ADHD is that your doctor SHOULD do a PET Scan of the child....ADHD is clearly shown in a scan. If the child has it...medicate...If not...investigate. There isn't a gray area for Dad to dispute.

 

[Nurse at Heart]

Hi Kik,

My ex doesn't communicate about much. When I attempt to communicate with him about something important, he becomes quiet on the phone, and doesn't respond to me, prompting me to ask "did you hear me" or something like that, and then he becomes defensive and tells me that he doesn't believe our son really has a problem, in which case he doesn't see the need to medicate him (his usuall line is "I am not convinced he has a problem"). I have responded to this statment by saying, then why don't you come and meet with the psychiatrist and therapist so they can explain to you why our son is diagnosed with ADHD? His response to that was "don't tell me what to do".

I don't believe that the fact that I am the mother, or a nurse makes my decisions any more important than my ex's. However, common sense tells me that if my son is happier, doing better in school, while on medication, that this is the direction that we should continue in.

As for a PET scan...my insurance will not pay for this unless warranted - which it is not in my son's case (according to the insurance company), so I can just see trying to get my ex to help split the cost of that. All for what, if my ex doesn't believe in ADHD, or that our son has a problem, just what will it do to help us out? Without an education about ADHD and how it is diagnosed and treated, my ex remains ignorant and uneducated, and that is not likely to change, even if I could get a copy of the PET scan results and wave them under his nose.

Thanks for the thought though.

 

[kik1999]

The thing about ADHD is that your doctor SHOULD do a PET Scan of the child....ADHD is clearly shown in a scan. If the child has it...medicate...If not...investigate. There isn't a gray area for Dad to dispute.

There might not BE a gray area, but sounds like Dad is disputing regardless - and not addressing the issue is setting the child up for failure from an educational perspective. It's almost like someone needing glasses, but not having them and asking them to function without. While a person might be able to see somewhat without them, they aren't going to function at their best ability until they have the glasses to read.

Nurse, I couldn't agree more that this sounds like a lack of education and knowledge issue on Dad's part and I serioulsy think it's worth going to mediation over IF all other avenues have been unsuccessful. Obviously you can't control what happens at Dad's, so until Dad recognizes the need for your son, there has to be an alternative for the meds to work effectively and consistently. I know it's difficult to rely on a child with ADHD to be responsible for remembering to take his/her medicine on a daily basis, but unless you can work out something with the school (and I would seriously sit down with the school teachers, counselors, etc. to TRY and see if they can assist by giving it to him in the am or maybe they have other ideas), you might have to rely on your son to take them himself. If he sees the benefits of taking the meds, it should be somewhat of an incentive for him to want to take them while at Dad's. I would even make him responsible for remembering at your house, so he gets in the routine of taking on his own.

As I stated before, I would make sure that you try all options available before going to mediation. It will definitely show that you're trying to be flexible and not just expecting Dad to do things "your" way. If none of these options work effectively,then I would entertain the mediation option. One last question, is your son in an IEP at school? If so, this is something that I would definitely bring up, as it most definitely does affect his success educationally.

 

[Nurse at Heart]

Hey JacobJoel,

If you can find any links or research to back up the math idea, I would love to see it. Perhaps my ex would be interested in it because our son is good in math, and he might see it as a way to help him that doesn't involve meds.

Thankyou.

 

[JacobJoel]

i'm probably going to get fried here...

but here goes...

It's called the Kraepelin test. if you research that you will find Kraepelin is some kind of psychologist. I never bothered with that.

i came to it via this article years ago:

http://mentalhealth.about.com/cs/familyresources/a/videojap.htm

I was researching the potential effects of auto-suggestion hypnosis and dissasociation.

specifically i was working with alpha/beta/theta brain waves and whether or not they could be influenced/controlled aside from something like bio-feedback. (this has NOTHING to do with legal, obviously)

Alpha waves = sleep
Beta waves = focus, concentration
Theta = hypnosis

When someone zones in on computer games they essentially go into theta, which is hypnosis. (yes, it is true)

anyway i was connected to a person who had successfully worked w/his step son bringing him out of severe ADD through intense behavior modification (a system was set wherebye if he followed all the steps he would earn a nintendo game. he got it).

I took what i learned from my brain research, applied it to myself and two children, one 8 and one 10, from different homes. myself and both kids improved remarkably.

flash forward to this past summer when i had my husband's children. i worked with his son using flash cards, having him write out additions and subtraction for extended amounts of time. his attention span improved as well.

however, he is back w/his mom now and she refuses to do anything i have any input on so he no longer does anything consistently. it reflects.

here are two other sites you can review;

from 2006: http://www.betanews.com/article/Study_Violent_Video_Games_Affect_the_Brain/1164746751

from 2007:

http://www.sciencenewsforkids.org/articles/20070124/Feature1.asp

i did the work i did independently, using the reference i found on the Kraepelin test along with the work i was doing on the brain. Because i have used the math technique on three kids (i don't consider myself as relevant) and seen marked improvement all three times i believe the approach for improving focus and concentration works.

i know these sites focus on video games and not ADHD. what i was looking for was the brain waves, what effects them and how to control them consciously, effectively.

ADHD is when your neurotransmitters and either firing to much to fast or insufficiently. i believe we have a lot more control over our being then what we want to believe or know.

Telling someone that they have a condition that they are powerless over doesn't work for me. (one can only imagine how my current life situation messes w/my brain!) Teaching someone 'this is what is going on' and then 'and this is how we are going to NOT let it kick our butts' works much better for me.

here is one last site that may be of interest to you:

http://www.causeof.org/brainwaves.htm

being that you are a nurse i figure any of these sites would interest you anyway.

i hope this helps and you see the same results i did.

 

[JacobJoel]

ok, so AFTER i posted the above i got the brain flash to google "math helps ADHD" and "math and ADHD".

both times i find that, evidently, matt is extremely difficult for ADHD. i never gave that any thought when i was working with the kids. and, evidently, they over came because they got it.

so. there you have it. the good and the bad. and the experts to tell me i was wrong.

good thing i didn't know that when i was doing the work.

 

[Nurse at Heart]

Hi JacobJoel,

Thankyou for the information (and your story). While math, is indeed hard for many ADHD kids, that is not so for all with ADHD. Typical ADHD'ers can have what is called "hyperfocus", particularly with something they like (such as video games, or even math if they like it). ADHD is not synonymous with "dumb". I do believe that we have much more control over our minds and bodies than we know also (I did biofeedback and hypnosis for years - and you are right, we are both probably likely to get flamed for these posts )

I am not sure ADHD can be simply described as neurotransmitters "firing too fast, or insufficiently", more along the lines of not enough or too many neurotransmitters. I am certainly no expert. I didn't come here to debate about ADHD, and treatment for it. So thankyou for sharing your experience.

I can say that my son's attitude, and confidence have improved greatly while on medication. It is sad that my ex see's him so little, that he really doesn't notice. Or perhaps, the fact that he doesn't give him the meds, means his behavior is not the same at my ex's house.

I came to this site looking for advice on how to best help my son. With the little bit of interaction that I have had in courts, I knew that I was in no way prepared to help my son. I hope my son grows up to be a happy, healthy, productive member of society. I also hope that my son's father will take a good look at what is going on with his son. His friends, and teachers have commented on how much happier he appears, yet my ex can't seem to notice. If he would simply take the time to learn about our son's diagnosis, and perhaps attend an appointment with our son, it may open his eyes.

Thanks again everyone for your time and attention.

 

[casa]

ok, so AFTER i posted the above i got the brain flash to google "math helps ADHD" and "math and ADHD".

both times i find that, evidently, matt is extremely difficult for ADHD. i never gave that any thought when i was working with the kids. and, evidently, they over came because they got it.

so. there you have it. the good and the bad. and the experts to tell me i was wrong.

good thing i didn't know that when i was doing the work.

I'll be sure to tell that to my ADHD, GATES (gifted & talented), tomboy, kid**************....

 

[peppier]

Thank you for posting this, I spent the day with my ADHD grandson and he exhausted me! He is actually good at math. I will do the research and give it to my DIL.