Health Insurance

[guideme777]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA
Hello, the noncustodial parent was ordered to pay child support and also provide Health insurance for the past 11 years. He never provided the insurance, so I did. He finally has a position that offers health insurance, and now wants to take me to court because he wants credit on Child support to provide Health Insurance. Hello, I have been providing insurance for the past 11 years without receiving credit. He was ordered to pay for both. Can I take him to court to pay me back for the insurance premiums I have paid out over the years? He has broken court order from the start.

 

[CSO286]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA
Hello, the noncustodial parent was ordered to pay child support and also provide Health insurance for the past 11 years. He never provided the insurance, so I did. He finally has a position that offers health insurance, and now wants to take me to court because he wants credit on Child support to provide Health Insurance. Hello, I have been providing insurance for the past 11 years without receiving credit. He was ordered to pay for both. Can I take him to court to pay me back for the insurance premiums I have paid out over the years? He has broken court order from the start.

No. The time to have sought reimbursement (or an increase in CS to offset the premium) would have been while you were providing the insurance, not after the fact.

Dad can ask for a credit, he may or may not get it.

Anyone can ask for anything.....

 

[branditx]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? VA
Hello, the noncustodial parent was ordered to pay child support and also provide Health insurance for the past 11 years. He never provided the insurance, so I did. He finally has a position that offers health insurance, and now wants to take me to court because he wants credit on Child support to provide Health Insurance. Hello, I have been providing insurance for the past 11 years without receiving credit. He was ordered to pay for both. Can I take him to court to pay me back for the insurance premiums I have paid out over the years? He has broken court order from the start.

I don't know about the laws in your state, but in Texas, when the non-custodial parent is ordered to provide coverage, they are charged an additional $25/month that they don't provide it, if the custodial parent has the child covered somehow (even by Medicaid - we discourage children becoming 'wards of the state', here.) They don't get a 'credit' for providing coverage - they just don't get the extra fee tacked on. If they don't amend the child support order to reflect the change once they do start providing coverage, then they lose the money, in most cases. I don't believe you can sue him for premiums, but he may be responsible for up to half of the health care costs you've incurred out-of-pocket during that time, if you can prove them (copays/deductibles/etc. - most doctors keep billing records for 5-10 years after your last visit, so it's not impossible to get at least some of the receipts reprinted). Check the details of what he's responsible for in your child support /custody order.
I know it's frustrating, but try not to lose sight of what's really important (and the basis for the requirement, in the first place) - your kid has health insurance, and can receive care when they need it. It would have probably cost you nearly as much, even if you hadn't been divorced, since you probably would have been covering your ex-husband during that time, too. It may be counter-intuitive to view it that way, but if you choose to allow your former spouse to drive you crazy over stuff like this, you'll only be hurting yourself and your child in the end. It just boils down to what you really hope to accomplish - Do you really need the money, or are you trying to teach him not to mess with you? Do you just want revenge for his weak attempt to do so? If it's more about spite than money, then only you can decide what it's really worth. I'm not saying don't try; just make sure you're doing it for the right reasons - lawyers cost more money, and the stress it will cause you could end up being projected onto your child inadvertently. Besides, he's not going to learn his lesson - they never do. Good luck!

 

[mistoffolees]

I don't know about the laws in your state, but in Texas, when the non-custodial parent is ordered to provide coverage, they are charged an additional $25/month that they don't provide it, if the custodial parent has the child covered somehow (even by Medicaid - we discourage children becoming 'wards of the state', here.) They don't get a 'credit' for providing coverage - they just don't get the extra fee tacked on. If they don't amend the child support order to reflect the change once they do start providing coverage, then they lose the money, in most cases. I don't believe you can sue him for premiums, but he may be responsible for up to half of the health care costs you've incurred out-of-pocket during that time, if you can prove them (copays/deductibles/etc. - most doctors keep billing records for 5-10 years after your last visit, so it's not impossible to get at least some of the receipts reprinted). Check the details of what he's responsible for in your child support /custody order.
I know it's frustrating, but try not to lose sight of what's really important (and the basis for the requirement, in the first place) - your kid has health insurance, and can receive care when they need it. It would have probably cost you nearly as much, even if you hadn't been divorced, since you probably would have been covering your ex-husband during that time, too. It may be counter-intuitive to view it that way, but if you choose to allow your former spouse to drive you crazy over stuff like this, you'll only be hurting yourself and your child in the end. It just boils down to what you really hope to accomplish - Do you really need the money, or are you trying to teach him not to mess with you? Do you just want revenge for his weak attempt to do so? If it's more about spite than money, then only you can decide what it's really worth. I'm not saying don't try; just make sure you're doing it for the right reasons - lawyers cost more money, and the stress it will cause you could end up being projected onto your child inadvertently. Besides, he's not going to learn his lesson - they never do. Good luck!

Maybe TX is different, but in most states, if you show up with 11 years of bills, you'd better expect that you're not going to be reimbursed. CP has an obligation to submit the bills in a timely manner. In this case, OP has an obligation to complain about the health insurance in a reasonable time frame. Waiting 11 years and then trying to get it all at once isn't going to fly. Maybe a year or two, but probably not more than that.

Similarly, the order says that NCP was supposed to provide health insurance. The fact that he's going to start to provide health insurance after 11 years isn't going to be justification to change the child support obligation. He's simply doing what he should have done for years. If they DO recalculate it, they're not going to simply give him a deduction for insurance. Rather, they'll calculate it from scratch as if it were an entirely new case.

This is likely to give him a nasty surprise. If he asks them to recalculate CS today, they're going to calculate it based on his current income - and he may find that it goes up significantly. Oh, and even if he can convince the court to consider his health insurance expense, it's not likely to change the numbers much. First, they'll count only the amount HE pays, not what his company pays. And they'll only count the amount he pays for that child - not his total payment. Second, from a quick glance at the calculator, it looks like the child support payment is reduced by something like 1/5 of the insurance expense.

So, as an example, let's say he earns $5,000 a month. Employee's contribution for health insurance for a single is $400 a month and $600 a month for the family. And let's say there's a new wife and another kid - so the 'family' $200 increase covers 3 people - or $66.67 a month per person. That would reduce his monthly CS payment by $13 a month. Chances are pretty good that his salary has increased by enough in 11 years to more than make up for the minor deduction for health insurance.

You can plug in your own numbers here:
Texas Child Support Calculator

 

[branditx]

Maybe TX is different, but in most states, if you show up with 11 years of bills, you'd better expect that you're not going to be reimbursed. CP has an obligation to submit the bills in a timely manner. In this case, OP has an obligation to complain about the health insurance in a reasonable time frame. Waiting 11 years and then trying to get it all at once isn't going to fly. Maybe a year or two, but probably not more than that.

Similarly, the order says that NCP was supposed to provide health insurance. The fact that he's going to start to provide health insurance after 11 years isn't going to be justification to change the child support obligation. He's simply doing what he should have done for years. If they DO recalculate it, they're not going to simply give him a deduction for insurance. Rather, they'll calculate it from scratch as if it were an entirely new case.

This is likely to give him a nasty surprise. If he asks them to recalculate CS today, they're going to calculate it based on his current income - and he may find that it goes up significantly. Oh, and even if he can convince the court to consider his health insurance expense, it's not likely to change the numbers much. First, they'll count only the amount HE pays, not what his company pays. And they'll only count the amount he pays for that child - not his total payment. Second, from a quick glance at the calculator, it looks like the child support payment is reduced by something like 1/5 of the insurance expense.

So, as an example, let's say he earns $5,000 a month. Employee's contribution for health insurance for a single is $400 a month and $600 a month for the family. And let's say there's a new wife and another kid - so the 'family' $200 increase covers 3 people - or $66.67 a month per person. That would reduce his monthly CS payment by $13 a month. Chances are pretty good that his salary has increased by enough in 11 years to more than make up for the minor deduction for health insurance.

You can plug in your own numbers here:
Texas Child Support Calculator

You'd be really surprised at how much leeway is given to the CP (90 % of the time, the mom), in TX, then. My husband was OP, in a fight with CP for 3 years over custody - it's extremely hard to get it changed, here, absent a serious case of abuse/neglect, when the kid's under 10. Anyways, during that time, he lost wages, got married (I started carrying his insurance), and we've had 2 more kids - child support hasn't budged. It's just gotten us back into court. We've finally been given custody - not becqause our $15,000 attorney won in court (albeit, he was handed a case on a silver platter), but because his ex ran out of money and gave up for the time being. In fact, all our atty has to do now is fill out the paperwork to seal the deal, and let the AG figure out the child support, but has he done it? No. We're still paying child support to that biatch, after overpaying for 4 years, and now we've got 3 kids to take care of. Will we ever see that money again? No. And I'm betting if I were costing our atty over $300/mo, he'd do something about it, but he doesn't seem to care when the shoe's on the other foot. Won't be recommending him to anyone anytime soon.

 

[mistoffolees]

You'd be really surprised at how much leeway is given to the CP (90 % of the time, the mom), in TX, then. My husband was OP, in a fight with CP for 3 years over custody - it's extremely hard to get it changed, here, absent a serious case of abuse/neglect, when the kid's under 10. Anyways, during that time, he lost wages, got married (I started carrying his insurance), and we've had 2 more kids - child support hasn't budged. It's just gotten us back into court. We've finally been given custody - not becqause our $15,000 attorney won in court (albeit, he was handed a case on a silver platter), but because his ex ran out of money and gave up for the time being. In fact, all our atty has to do now is fill out the paperwork to seal the deal, and let the AG figure out the child support, but has he done it? No. We're still paying child support to that biatch, after overpaying for 4 years, and now we've got 3 kids to take care of. Will we ever see that money again? No. And I'm betting if I were costing our atty over $300/mo, he'd do something about it, but he doesn't seem to care when the shoe's on the other foot. Won't be recommending him to anyone anytime soon.

Sorry, but the fact that YOU got a lazy attorney doesn't change the legal facts as I described them.

 

[TheGeekess]

You'd be really surprised at how much leeway is given to the CP (90 % of the time, the mom), in TX, then. My husband was OP, in a fight with CP for 3 years over custody - it's extremely hard to get it changed, here, absent a serious case of abuse/neglect, when the kid's under 10. Anyways, during that time, he lost wages, got married (I started carrying his insurance), and we've had 2 more kids - child support hasn't budged. It's just gotten us back into court. We've finally been given custody - not becqause our $15,000 attorney won in court (albeit, he was handed a case on a silver platter), but because his ex ran out of money and gave up for the time being. In fact, all our atty has to do now is fill out the paperwork to seal the deal, and let the AG figure out the child support, but has he done it? No. We're still paying child support to that biatch, after overpaying for 4 years, and now we've got 3 kids to take care of. Will we ever see that money again? No. And I'm betting if I were costing our atty over $300/mo, he'd do something about it, but he doesn't seem to care when the shoe's on the other foot. Won't be recommending him to anyone anytime soon.

Considering that TX is not VA, your advice is meaningless and misleads the OP.

 

[branditx]

Sorry, but the fact that YOU got a lazy attorney doesn't change the legal facts as I described them.

I'll take your 'facts' with a grain of salt - it's not like you have to prove you're an attorney to sign up for this forum. OP would be doing herself a favor to consult an actual attorney, instead of hoping she's not being misled by a wannabe-pre-law drop out. Not saying that's the case here, but I just don't see attorneys doling out their advice for free for kicks - I'm certainly not one. And...backlash - go!

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

I'll take your 'facts' with a grain of salt - it's not like you have to prove you're an attorney to sign up for this forum. OP would be doing herself a favor to consult an actual attorney, instead of hoping she's not being misled by a wannabe-pre-law drop out. Not saying that's the case here, but I just don't see attorneys doling out their advice for free for kicks - I'm certainly not one. And...backlash - go!

Actually, there ARE attorneys who do post. Why don't you go back to just reading please.

 

[stealth2]

brandi = 7 posts

misto = 16,000+ posts.

Geesh - WHO to listen to?!?!?! Soooooooooo difficult to know!!!

 

[CSO286]

Anyways, during that time, he lost wages, got married (I started carrying his insurance), and we've had 2 more kids - child support hasn't budged.

You do realize that only one of the items on your list even remotely justifies re-evaluating the child support obligation, don't you?

 

[Antigone*]

brandi = 7 posts

misto = 16,000+ posts.

Geesh - WHO to listen to?!?!?! Soooooooooo difficult to know!!!

Oooh Oooh PICK ME PICK ME

Never mind, I'll just answer. I'll take the gentleman with the proven track record of the texas princess any day of the week!

 

[CSO286]

I don't know about the laws in your state,

And this is the exact moment you should have stopped typing and walked away from your computer.

You see, when you post information about another state without knowing its applicability to the OP's situation, odds are good your infomation is at best merely irrelevant, and at worst--flat out wrong. If the OP then flies off to do what ever has been advised (based on said wrong info) they run the risk of--at best--looking foolish in court or at worst--losing custody.

So when we reply to posters, if we do not know the answer, we look up the states' laws and post based on a legal foundation that is relevant, correct and applicable.

 

[tuffbrk]

I'll take your 'facts' with a grain of salt - it's not like you have to prove you're an attorney to sign up for this forum. OP would be doing herself a favor to consult an actual attorney, instead of hoping she's not being misled by a wannabe-pre-law drop out. Not saying that's the case here, but I just don't see attorneys doling out their advice for free for kicks - I'm certainly not one. And...backlash - go!

You are incredibly arrogant. He took the time to explain the TX calculator, provided you with a link to it so you could run your numbers and this is your response? And you brag about outlasting Mom financially? No wonder your attorney is not returning your calls. Karma has a wonderful way about her.

Can't wait til you meet her.

 

[CSO286]

I'll take your 'facts' with a grain of salt - it's not like you have to prove you're an attorney to sign up for this forum. OP would be doing herself a favor to consult an actual attorney, instead of hoping she's not being misled by a wannabe-pre-law drop out. Not saying that's the case here, but I just don't see attorneys doling out their advice for free for kicks - I'm certainly not one. And...backlash - go!

Actually, if you put yourself out as an attorney, yes, you do have to provide enough information to the site admin to allow then to verify your credentials or you can expect to be banned.


We have several attorneys, at least one (possibly retired) judge, folks from the Law Enforcement community, Court Clerks, Court Admins, Child Support Officers and many others who by necessity have gotten themselves very educated in Family Law.


These people volunteer their time and energy to help folks understand their situations. Some have spent hours and days researching for an OP. Some have walked an OP through their entire legal process....


So before you spout off about the senior memebers being nothing more than a bunch of "wannabe pre-law drop outs," shut your mouth, still your fingers and read about a million pages here. If you wonder about the veracity of the advice given, then start researching statutes and case law yourself. Then you might find you owe a few seniors an apology.



But I won't hold my breath for one.