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  1. #1
    mixedin82 is offline Member
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    Unhappy How does a job change affect my child support?

    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Virginia

    I went to court for a child support review in July 2010 with my ex, which is done every 3 years. My pay rate went from $10.00 to $13.76 an hour so I figured my payments would go up, and they almost doubled which wasn't too bad because I could afford it with my pay increase. In January I changed jobs for the benefits and commute to work but my hourly rate dropped to $11.06 an hour. My wife and I had a child in March so now with the wage decrease and another child its making things a little tough. My ex also has started working since then. I used the online child support calculator and got a pretty good estimate on what it will be. With my 2 older children, ages 11 and soon to be 10, I have parenting time 3 days a week overnight. I get them every Sunday overnight and my 2 days off during the week overnight. Her mother has court ordered visitation 1 day a week which leaves her the other 3. Is there a way I can ask for a review and somehow expedite it because if I can't get that reduced quick I may lose my home? Would I be able to backdate the child support paid based on the dates of the "life changes" that happened since the last review? I don't want any money back, I just want a break on what I already paid. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!! My main concern is the child support but I'm also curious about the custody, are we suppose to have joint physical and/or why did the judge give her primary physical when we have the same amount of parenting time?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?
  2. #2
    2Mistakes is offline Senior Member
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    You can maybe file for a downward modification, but your reduction in income may be seen as voluntary.

    Don't expect anything to be retroactive to January.
  3. #3
    TheGeekess is offline Senior Member
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    Any changes will be to the date of filing, not before.
  4. #4
    2Mistakes is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGeekess View Post
    Any changes will be to the date of filing, not before.
    That's what I meant. You said it better.

    Must get some high octane fuel in my system, stat!
  5. #5
    CSO286 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Virginia

    I went to court for a child support review in July 2010 with my ex, which is done every 3 years. My pay rate went from $10.00 to $13.76 an hour so I figured my payments would go up, and they almost doubled which wasn't too bad because I could afford it with my pay increase. In January I changed jobs for the benefits and commute to work but my hourly rate dropped to $11.06 an hour. My wife and I had a child in March so now with the wage decrease and another child its making things a little tough. My ex also has started working since then. I used the online child support calculator and got a pretty good estimate on what it will be. With my 2 older children, ages 11 and soon to be 10, I have parenting time 3 days a week overnight. I get them every Sunday overnight and my 2 days off during the week overnight. Her mother has court ordered visitation 1 day a week which leaves her the other 3.
    Ok.

    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    Is there a way I can ask for a review and somehow expedite it because if I can't get that reduced quick I may lose my home?
    You don't have a reason to request an emergency mod of your child support. (Nothing in CS is ever really considered an emergency, sorry.)
    You may be able to request a modification based on the various changes--Your voluntary job change and subsequent reduction in income--not often considered a valid reason to requet a mod.
    It appears that VA does use an income shares model to calculate the support, so an increase in Mom's wages might be considered.

    You can ask for them to do one, you might be turned down, but you still would have to the right to file pro se/pro per and do this on you own. You can get the forms needed here:
    [url=http://www.courts.state.va.us/forms/district/jdrcourt.html#dr]Juvenile and Domestic Relations District Court Forms[/url]


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    Would I be able to backdate the child support paid based on the dates of the "life changes" that happened since the last review?
    No, child support usually goes forward only, though in some cases may go back to the date of filing, not any further.

    Now, as to these life changes, *CSO286 puts on her CSO hat*---You knew you had a pre-existing child support obligation when you chose to take on a new spouse and have an additional child and when you chose to take a lower-paying job (regardless of the bennies).

    Why should your other child have to do with less because of the choices you made since the order was established?
    You should not be adding additonal obligations (wife/future children) unless you can still meet the legal obligations you have to the first family/children.

    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    I don't want any money back, I just want a break on what I already paid. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!
    If the support were adjusted, it would only be a "from here on out" thing.


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    My main concern is the child support but I'm also curious about the custody, are we suppose to have joint physical and/or why did the judge give her primary physical when we have the same amount of parenting time?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?
    Because in almost every location, somone needs to be designated primary.
    Last edited by CSO286; 07-21-2011 at 09:30 AM. Reason: typo demon
  6. #6
    TheGeekess is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2Mistakes View Post
    That's what I meant. You said it better.

    Must get some high octane fuel in my system, stat!
    I'm on my second cup.
  7. #7
    CSO286 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGeekess View Post
    I'm on my second cup.
    And I'm caffiene-free...must explain the typos.

    ('Cept for that fact that they happen all the time, too.....)


  8. #8
    mixedin82 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by CSO286 View Post


    Now, as to these life changes, *CSO286 puts on her CSO hat*---You knew you had a pre-existing child support obligation when you chose to take on a new spouse and have an additional child and when you chose to take a lower-paying job (regardless of the bennies).

    Why should your other child have to do with less because of the choices you made since the order was established?
    You should not be adding additonal obligations (wife/future children) unless you can still meet the legal obligations you have to the first family/children.

    My wife was already pregnant before the order was done. She got pregnant in May and the order wasn't effective until August 1st 2010. The amount I was paying then was affordable and even the adjusted amount for August 1st was okay but with the job/pay rate change I can't afford that now. I didn't choose to take a lower paying job necessarily, it was a union company and they negotiated to lower our pay rate and change our benefits so with or without the job change I would have loss pay because my pay rate would have decreased from $13.72 to $11.50 with annual instead of semi-annual raises and my monthly benefit payments would have increased January 1st 2011 anyway. I made the job change based on those benefits. Sorry if I didn't explain that enough.


    Quote Originally Posted by CSO286 View Post

    Why should your other child have to do with less because of the choices you made since the order was established?
    You should not be adding additonal obligations (wife/future children) unless you can still meet the legal obligations you have to the first family/children.
    This part doesn't make since to me. Is this your personal opinion or is this what a judge would say? I am a man of God and I believe in being fruitful, I have seen some careless decisions made from people so I understand your point but I don't believe that I can't have any more children because my ex can't put up her half to help support the 2 children we made. I DON'T and will NEVER look at my wife and youngest child as obligations despite what you, the courts or anybody thinks/says. They are blessings from God just as my 2 older children are. Could you please clarify whether or not this is your personal opinion because I am a little confused?
  9. #9
    Antigone* is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    My wife was already pregnant before the order was done. She got pregnant in May and the order wasn't effective until August 1st 2010. The amount I was paying then was affordable and even the adjusted amount for August 1st was okay but with the job/pay rate change I can't afford that now. I didn't choose to take a lower paying job necessarily, it was a union company and they negotiated to lower our pay rate and change our benefits so with or without the job change I would have loss pay because my pay rate would have decreased from $13.72 to $11.50 with annual instead of semi-annual raises and my monthly benefit payments would have increased January 1st 2011 anyway. I made the job change based on those benefits. Sorry if I didn't explain that enough.




    This part doesn't make since to me. Is this your personal opinion or is this what a judge would say? I am a man of God and I believe in being fruitful, I have seen some careless decisions made from people so I understand your point but I don't believe that I can't have any more children because my ex can't put up her half to help support the 2 children we made. I DON'T and will NEVER look at my wife and youngest child as obligations despite what you, the courts or anybody thinks/says. They are blessings from God just as my 2 older children are. Could you please clarify whether or not this is your personal opinion because I am a little confused?
    It makes perfect sense. Don't be fruitful and multiply if you cannot afford to take care of the fruit that has already been harvested.

    Have all the children you want, just do not expect the ones you already have to expect any less of you because of that.

    A judge will tell you exactly that. I have seen it happen.
  10. #10
    CSO286 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    My wife was already pregnant before the order was done. She got pregnant in May and the order wasn't effective until August 1st 2010. The amount I was paying then was affordable and even the adjusted amount for August 1st was okay but with the job/pay rate change I can't afford that now. I didn't choose to take a lower paying job necessarily, it was a union company and they negotiated to lower our pay rate and change our benefits so with or without the job change I would have loss pay because my pay rate would have decreased from $13.72 to $11.50 with annual instead of semi-annual raises and my monthly benefit payments would have increased January 1st 2011 anyway. I made the job change based on those benefits. Sorry if I didn't explain that enough.
    An INVOLUNTARY reduction in pay may be considered a reason to modify support.

    And you knew you were going to be expected to continue to provide for your older children when you began creating a new one, yes?


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    This part doesn't make since to me. Is this your personal opinion or is this what a judge would say? I am a man of God and I believe in being fruitful,
    Both, actually. If you cannot continue providing for your older children at the same level ,regardless of how many subsequent children you have, then you really should not be having additonal children.

    (And that, my friend, is a Biblical precept--existing wives/children were not to be deprived of thier standard of living if the father/husband took on add'l wives and bore children.)


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    I have seen some careless decisions made from people so I understand your point but I don't believe that I can't have any more children because my ex can't put up her half to help support the 2 children we made.
    Are you telling me that you provide 100% of all the older children's needs?Housing, utilities, food, school fees, clothes, everything??

    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    Because, in most cases, child support doesn't come close to that.
    I DON'T and will NEVER look at my wife and youngest child as obligations despite what you, the courts or anybody thinks/says. They are blessings from God just as my 2 older children are. Could you please clarify whether or not this is your personal opinion because I am a little confused?
    Obilgation is an appropriate word. You have an obligation as a father and husband to provide for your wife and you children. The word in itself is not intended to be derogatory. I have an obligation to provide for my child, she is an "obligation." She is not a burdensome one, but still, an obligation.
    Last edited by CSO286; 07-21-2011 at 11:02 AM.
  11. #11
    mixedin82 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by CSO286 View Post
    Ok.



    You don't have a reason to request an emergency mod of your child support. (Nothing in CS is ever really considered an emergency, sorry.)
    You may be able to request a modification based on the various changes--Your voluntary job change and subsequent reduction in income--not often considered a valid reason to requet a mod.
    It appears that VA does use an income shares model to calculate the support, so an increase in Mom's wages might be considered.

    You can ask for them to do one, you might be turned down, but you still would have to the right to file pro se/pro per and do this on you own. You can get the forms needed here:
    [url=http://www.courts.state.va.us/forms/district/jdrcourt.html#dr]Juvenile and Domestic Relations District Court Forms[/url]




    No, child support usually goes forward only, though in some cases may go back to the date of filing, not any further.

    Now, as to these life changes, *CSO286 puts on her CSO hat*---You knew you had a pre-existing child support obligation when you chose to take on a new spouse and have an additional child and when you chose to take a lower-paying job (regardless of the bennies).

    Why should your other child have to do with less because of the choices you made since the order was established?
    You should not be adding additonal obligations (wife/future children) unless you can still meet the legal obligations you have to the first family/children.



    If the support were adjusted, it would only be a "from here on out" thing.




    Because in almost every location, somone needs to be designated primary.
    Quote Originally Posted by CSO286 View Post
    An INVOLUNTARY reduction in pay may be considered a reason to modify support.

    And you knew you were going to be expected to continue to provide for your older children when you began creating a new one, yes?




    Both, actually. If you cannot continue providing for your older children at the same level ,regardless of how many subsequent children you have, then you really should not be having additonal children.

    (And that, my friend, is a Biblical precept--existing wives/children were not to be deprived of thier standard of living if the father/husband took on add'l wives and bore children.)




    Are you telling me that you provide 100% of all the older children's needs?Housing, utilities, food, school fees, clothes, everything??



    Obilgation is an appropriate word. You have an obligation as a father and husband to provide for your wife and you children. The word in itself is not intended to be derogatory. I have an obligation to provide for my child, she is an "obligation." She is not a burdensome one, but still, an obligation.
    I looked back and she filed for a motion to amend the child support based on my increase in wages, the regular review day was scheduled for September.

    So I can call what happened to me an involuntary reduction because it was going to happen either way?


    Yes I knew I would have to provide for my two older children along with the new baby but I did not expect my wages to decrease and my medical benefits payments to increase within 6 months of the order change.

    I had been paying $304 per month from September of 2007 until she filed for the motion to amend in March of 2010 and the adjustment began in August of 2010 for $567 per month. In that time (9/2007-3/2010)she got married and had a 3rd child (not her husbands child) and from December 2009 until September 2010 her nor her husband was not working (she never worked)so due to her inability to provide for the children she filed for an motion to amend. The things that are affecting me all happened in a 3 month period. So yes, prior to her getting married in 2009 and during her husbands period of unemployment, I did provide for 100% of their living expenses.

    If I am still in the wrong then I will just deal with it but I don't see how she can get married and have a 3rd child and I do the same and all in a short period of time have things affect my life and the courts not show any mercy. Again, any advice will be greatly appreciated.
  12. #12
    CSO286 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    I looked back and she filed for a motion to amend the child support based on my increase in wages, the regular review day was scheduled for September.

    So I can call what happened to me an involuntary reduction because it was going to happen either way?
    You can try. Be prepared to prove it.


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    Yes I knew I would have to provide for my two older children along with the new baby but I did not expect my wages to decrease and my medical benefits payments to increase within 6 months of the order change.
    Then you can try to explain this.


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    I had been paying $304 per month from September of 2007 until she filed for the motion to amend in March of 2010 and the adjustment began in August of 2010 for $567 per month.
    Ok.


    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    In that time (9/2007-3/2010)she got married and had a 3rd child (not her husbands child) and from December 2009 until September 2010 her nor her husband was not working (she never worked)so due to her inability to provide for the children she filed for an motion to amend.

    And what were they living on? Becasue I can garuntee that a family of five cannot survive on $567/mth, let alone $304.

    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    The things that are affecting me all happened in a 3 month period. So yes, prior to her getting married in 2009 and during her husbands period of unemployment, I did provide for 100% of their living expenses.
    See above.

    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    If I am still in the wrong then I will just deal with it but I don't see how she can get married and have a 3rd child and I do the same and all in a short period of time have things affect my life and the courts not show any mercy. Again, any advice will be greatly appreciated.
    Look, you can ask for a downward mod. And Mom is equally within her right to request that it not be changed.

    I just ran the numbers, playing with fictitious incomes. It would appears that both parties receive a dedcution for non joint children in the home.

    If mom is not working, you can ask the court to impute min wage to her. So, for the purposes of the exercise, I assigned mom an income of $1243/mth based on VA min wage.

    OP...Run the numbers and all you can do is ask.

    VA Child support Calculator is here: [url=http://www.dss.virginia.gov/family/dcse_calc.cgi]Child Support Obligation Calculator - Virginia Department of Social Services[/url]


    ETA: It doesn't appear that you receive any type of credit for the amount of parenting time you state you have.
    Last edited by CSO286; 07-21-2011 at 11:40 AM.
  13. #13
    ecmst12 is online now Senior Member
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    Honey, I promise you neither the $300/month that you used to pay nor the less than $600 you are paying now covers 100% of their living expenses. Not even close.
  14. #14
    mixedin82 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecmst12 View Post
    Honey, I promise you neither the $300/month that you used to pay nor the less than $600 you are paying now covers 100% of their living expenses. Not even close.
    I know the rent for where she was living before she was married was income adjusted based her my support payments and the new place after she got married (the one bedroom townhouse/3 kids 2 adults) is only $425 a month and with food stamps, they went by "if it yellow let it mellow, if its brown flush it down," dirty clothes from washing less, the kids only taking baths at my house and grandmas, one tv and the church helping them out however they are/can both amounts easily paid for their living expenses 100%. I paid out of pocket for clothes, shoes, school supplies, field trips, birthdays, you name it and she didn't have the money for it. You can try to justify it however you like but the bottom line is everything I told you is fact and she is only looking to live off of me and I just want what's fair.
  15. #15
    CSO286 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mixedin82 View Post
    I know the rent for where she was living before she was married was income adjusted based her my support payments and the new place after she got married (the one bedroom townhouse/3 kids 2 adults) is only $425 a month and with food stamps, they went by "if it yellow let it mellow, if its brown flush it down," dirty clothes from washing less, the kids only taking baths at my house and grandmas, one tv and the church helping them out however they are/can both amounts easily paid for their living expenses 100%. I paid out of pocket for clothes, shoes, school supplies, field trips, birthdays, you name it and she didn't have the money for it. You can try to justify it however you like but the bottom line is everything I told you is fact and she is only looking to live off of me and I just want what's fair.

    I bet.

    I gave you all the info you need.

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