Hospital playing GOD

N.Y. My mother had been admitted thru the Emergency Room for complications due to Emphazema. We were told that the I.C.U. was full so they wanted to transfer her to an affiliated Hospital. Eventually the doctors had decided not to move her and kept her in the Emergency Room until a bed in I.C.U. would become available also stating that it would be better for her not to be moved. Conveinently a bed became available just hours later. This is where it gets tricky. My sisters informed me that my mother had refused to allow a procedure that involves inserting a tube through the mouth into the lungs which releaves the person from shortness of breath. After approximitly 3 days my mother went into a coma.For the next couple of days she stayed in I.C.U. in a coma. Her vital signs had been monitored 24hr. a day and her vitals seemed to improve somewhat. At this point my sisters said that since my mother refused this procedure that was offered her status becomes considered terminal in the hospitals eyes and deemed that there is nothing more the hospital can offer her and she was moved out of I.C.U. into a non-critical room until??????? Now the machines that monitored her vital signs were no more. The nurse would come by and check on the patients. Now at 2 am on the on the last day the nurse had called my sister to notify her of my mothers passing. Notice of this mortified my wife and I. We were the last to see her.This made us realize that when we were visiting my mother the reason her hands seemed so cold was that while we were visiting my mother had already passed on and we were holding the hand of a corpse! How can a hospital be so careless and thoughtless of their patients. My wife went through all kinds of emotional stress and to speak the least of it she scrubbed her hands a dozen times. Is it legal for a hospital to allow a person, obviously incoherent, to make life threatening decisions about services that are needed to keep the patient alive? Another question, why else would the hospital take a person in a coma with eratic vital signs and move them to an unsupervised room but for the lack of beds or is it conforming to the rules used by insurance companies pertaining to the payment of sevices such as the allowed time of stay in I.C.U. and the status of the patient to determine what the insurance covers. This puts the cash starved, greedy hospital board in a bind. So, I believe out of greed patients are moved prematurely out of I.C.U. in order to maximise cash intake. The hospital winds up playing God with patients lives. A few more questions: (1) Is this pratice legal? (2) Where can I find specifics on hospital proceedures involving I.C.U.care? (3) Who decides when a patient can safely be moved? I don't see the hospital board letting a staff doctor, that they've assigned to your case, decide how the hospitals economic welfare will be consructed. (4th and most important) Another problem long overlooked is the hospitals rules concerning outside Doctors. My mothers Doctor was unable to give her his help because he wasn't associated with her local Hospital. What I have trouble with is, wouldn't a cash starved hospital think: Hey, lets charge outside Doctors a fee to work with a patient!$!$! I take it someone somewhere for some reason some bhas a good answer, right? This rule needs immediate attention for it goes against the Doctors Code of Ethics! Why would an institute of such highly appraised standings enforce a rule that denies an outside Doctor, whose services would have an important role in the care of a patient and the potential to boost hospital revenue, from access to their patients and providing the best care for that patient?????? (5) Since the doctors themselves see no need to speak out, in the interest of their patients, about the unethical proceedures incorporated throughout the hospital system, it seems like the old rule never bite the hand that feeds you! When will someone put their foot down and address these beaurocrates who have convinced the government that in order to keep government expenses low and maintain the highest level of care for the patient they must be able to manipulate a patients welfare so it will maximize the hospitals ($$$$) resources! Thanks in advance for any insight or links to these questions!
Hoo Dood.

[racer72]

The hospital did nothing wrong. At the moment a treatment option is refused, the hospital no longer has any liability for the patients medical status. The only responsibility the hospital has at that time is making the patient comfortable. It sounds like the hospital did this.

I find your comment that your wife had to wash her hands many times after touching her mother after she passed away. Your wife needs to see the real world. I sat next to my mother for 48 hours watching her die, holding her hand the whole time. I wasn't till 2 hours after she died that I finally let go. There was a time not long ago when the dead were brought into the home for viewing before burial. It is a sad shame that your wife is going to think of the last time she touched her mother she might have gotten cooties or something. I cherish those moments holding my mother's hand when she died. Your wife reaction has brought tears to my eyes. Guess we all know what she thought of her.

While I'm not any kind of expert. I do know how difficult losing your Mother can be, especially if she suffers. I do however agree with Racer and know what he says is true, since my Mom also suffered a massive stroke in 1997 after having one other bad stroke. When the last stroke occured, the ambulance was called and my Mother was resusitated. Obviously, it's the EMT's job to try to save people's lives.

When I reached the hospital approx. 30 mins. later, and saw my Mother, she was brain dead. Her eyes were fixed, dillated and blank, a machine was breathing for her. This was something my Mom had always told me she did not ever want to happen to her. She had told me many, many times, and even showed me her living will.

However, my Mom was put in ICU. and I ended up having to fight the Cheif of Neurology in order to have her taken off life support after all their tests confirmed that she was indeed brain dead. The neurologist wouldn't talk to the family. He had his assistants do his bidding. Each day he'd say it would be tomorrow and when tomorrow came he'd say he wanted to try this or that. Always sending these messages through the other doctors. While my mother lay there on life support despite the living will which clearly stated her wishes. I finally threatened to call my lawyer, in order to have Mom taken off life support. Mom had made me her POA, after the first stroke.

I have never done anything so hard in my life than to stand there and watch as they removed the respirator tube from my Mom. The only comfort I had was in knowing I'd been able to help my Mom one last time, and keep my promise to her.

After removing her from the respirator, she was moved out of ICU within an hour and into a private room, where the family could spend her last few hours with her. That's all they could do, other than keep her as comfortable as possible, and even the doctors said she wasn't aware of anything or anyone. Twenty five hrs. later, my precious Mother took her last breath. All her sisters, my brother and I were there the entire time. She wasn't left alone from the time she got to the hospital until she died. But at least she was able to die without tubes and machines, she died the way SHE wanted to, with dignity, and surrounded by the family she loved.

I used to do my Mom's hair for her all the time. So when we went to the funeral home to make her arrangements, I told them I would like to do her hair and make-up for her one last time. So the following day, I went and did just that. I know it was just the shell of the person I loved so very much lieing there. But I also knew that no matter where she'd ever gone she always liked to look her best, I also knew she would want to look beautiful when she met my step Dad in heaven and when I was finished, she looked like she was just sleeping, calm and serene. It gave a lot of comfort to those who came to the visiting hours and funeral. But for me it was my special way of saying goodbye to a Mother who'd been my very best friend and given me so much love for so many years.

I understand that not everyone could do something like this. I used to be afraid of corpses myself, so I wouldn't ridicule the girl for washing her hands, if she and her own Mom never had the closeness that I was so fortunate to have with mine, or she didn't have a solid spirtitual backround, I just feel sorry for her. She may not have been very close to her Mother-in-law, and probably has alot of fear concerning death as well.

dieingforinfo

I understand the situation regarding the patients denial of services offered by a hospital. What I'd like more info on is the part where they transfered her to a semi=private room and didn't attach the numerous montoring devices. It is these devices that would notify the nurses station and give the nurses sufficient time to provide a patient with emergency help. Isn't it the obligation of a hospital to, at all expense, keep a patient, especially a patient in a coma whose vital signs were improving when released from I.C.U., alive? The nurses have no way of providing any type of an emergency services to a patient unless this patient is being monitored. By only checking on patients during their rounds are they not considering these patients NON-CRITICAL? I would seem to believe that a patient in a coma would be considered as a patient that, at any time, can require immediate medical attention, may I say, in the near or distant future? It appears that the hospital has denied this patient to the RIGHT TO LIFE, is this normal procedure or a violation of the patients legal rights? Also in reference to response, my wife has Asthma and when she was hospitalized, because of a fit they just, may I say, jammed this tube down her throat while she was physically resisting the people trying to provide emergency treatment to her. So does a doctor ask a patient that is turning blue with shortness of breath, in an emergency situation mind you, "Excuse me sir/mamm would you prefer this kind of treatment or this other kind"? Also consider a patients, blue in colored, head shaking yes or no as an answer? Isn't the hospitals job, at all expense, to maintain a patients life in an emergency situation? This may sound stupid but would a patient that has been kept alive trough emergency treatment file suit for keeping them alive by means not approved by this patient????? Thanx to all,Kevin.