collection agency default judgment, need advice please

[rastoma]

What is the name of your state? Tennessee

I'll try to keep this brief if possible

My wife hadn't viewed her own credit report in years. We recently decided to start looking into both of our credit files and see where we measure up. Upon viewing hers, we found that a default judgment had been granted in around July 2006 to a supposed lawyer who buys junk debt. This debt was for a very old credit card that was issued in my wife's maiden name. She apparently forgot to have the address forwarded after we got married and she moved, on the card so payments stopped and account closed. I haven't been able to find out the exact date of closure and/or last date of activity/payment but believe it's around 2001. This collection agency tried to serve her in 2002 using her maiden name with an "alias" written beside it that is not her married name but has a few letters that start the same as her married name. Supposedly there were several attempts to serve but the summons was marked as "address doesn't exist" (even though we're in viewing distance to the several of the city's offices and our street number is clearly marked and there are no similarly named streets around).

Fast foward to 2006 and there is a summons that claims was "served in person" but does not describe the person served or time. Yes, TRULY and HONESTLY she was not served. I know people say that a lot but we absolutely were not. She's a housewife and I work at home. One of us is ALWAYS reached by every person that ever comes to our house. The person that claims he served is a police officer. So a default judgment was awarded because we were not actually served so didn't show up.

So... all the advice I try to get from lawyers is we only have 10 days to appeal a judgment. It doesn't matter that we say we were not served. An officer says he did and that's all that matters. No judge will take our word over his. And I keep being told even if I can prove he didn't really serve us (her) that we only have 10 days to appeal. What kind of sense does that make? If you were not served how could you know that you needed to appeal?!?

This just doesn't seem possible that there is no other remedy that is afforded someone in this case. If a judgment can't be appealed or request to be vacated after 10 days, then why is there not a huge racket going on where process servers don't actually serve someone and say that did? Then after 10 days of a default judgment you get paid what ever you claimed in the suit? Why are people not getting rich at this scheme? And it would be next to impossible to find out if someone lied about serving unless they actually admitted it.

Another twist to this is the suit was brought in a neighboring county that is totally unrelated to anything regarding us or the debt owner or the original credit card issuer. We have never lived in the county they sued in. This so called attorney does not live there, the bank has no offices there or even in the state as far as I know.

The only advice I get told from local attorneys I've contacted is the wife is judgment proof apparently. This was not a joint app, it was in her name before we got married. She's not employed, she doesn't own any property. We rent. Our vehicle is in my name only (and currently financed). She doesn't have her own bank account. We have joint checking account but I'm in the process of closing it and opening a new one (not because of this action I had been wanting to do it for some time to go with a credit union) and I'll leave her off the the new one.

This debt should have been out of SOL to begin with if TN recognizes credit cards as open accounts and applies a 3 yr SOL. If it holds a 6 yr SOL it was within 2 months of being up I believe when the default judgment was granted.

It's very strange that many other attempts to serve failed, then this one officer claims it was but offers no information regarding the serve. Is it not generally required that a process server record a GENERAL description of who he served?

Back track to the beginning of all this.... I had contacted the person who obtained the default judgment to find out what this was all about and after he telling me the details he tells me that 3 recent attempts to serve her another summons for investigating her assets or whatever it's called have all failed, that they couldn't find our house. So previous people couldn't find us for the first suit, THREE people haven't been able to locate our house on the asset summons, but in the middle, one lone person writes "in person" and goes on about his business after not actually serving us.

Can a sham like this actually happen to a person with no avenue to get it corrected?

[debtcollector`]

So to sum up a long post:
Your wife ran up a credit card and moved to evade the debt. Now you are upset because there is a judgment.

Why fight the judgment? So you can refuse to pay again and be sued again and lose again?

Pay the debt and move on with your life.

DC

[rastoma]

Originally Posted by debtcollector`

So to sum up a long post:
Your wife ran up a credit card and moved to evade the debt. Now you are upset because there is a judgment.

Why fight the judgment? So you can refuse to pay again and be sued again and lose again?

Pay the debt and move on with your life.

DC

LOL I see why your occupation of choice is debt collection because you don't like rules and can't follow logic.

To sum up my post correctly and not to infer lies and prejudices that you have added:

She did not run up a credit card and move to evade the debt - that's really a moronic statement on your part. I clearly stated why she moved.

She has always been meticulous in paying her bills. She apparently forgot ONE bill out of many to update the address on and forgot it after getting married and moving to the other side of the country.... READ AGAIN, she moved because she got married not to evade the debt.

She is not fighting a legitimate debt. She is fighting a fraudulently obtained judgment that is for OVER TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS MORE than her bill. She made a mistake in forgetting a bill. The punishment for that should not be a 200% fine. She would have made arrangements to pay had she been served properly. We only bring up the issue of SOL now that she has been done wrong and need to find a remedy. Paying over $3000 for a $900 bill is not acceptable, is not right and not just remedy for forgetting a bill.

She has never refused to pay the bill.... she simply forgot about it. That doesn't mean she should get out of it and that would never have been her intention. The first action that reminded her about the bill is a default judgment obtained without her being informed of it.

No matter your profession there is no way any reasonable person would find that obtaining a default judgment for almost 3 times the original amount because of not being served properly is just.

[debtcollector`]

Originally Posted by rastoma

LOL I see why your occupation of choice is debt collection because you don't like rules and can't follow logic.

I can do ad hominem too.

Originally Posted by rastoma

She did not run up a credit card and move to evade the debt - that's really a moronic statement on your part. I clearly stated why she moved.

She moved and ceased paying her bill, including failing to update her address or respond to the mail forwarded by the post office -- or do you also contend that the post office forwarded all her mail except that one account?

Originally Posted by rastoma

She has always been meticulous in paying her bills.

Nonsense. She was sued for failing to pay her bills. You can't make that statement with a straight face.

Originally Posted by rastoma

She apparently forgot ONE bill out of many to update the address on and forgot it after getting married and moving to the other side of the country....

If she forgot one bill, then she wasn't that meticulous, was she?

Originally Posted by rastoma

READ AGAIN, she moved because she got married not to evade the debt.

Okay, she got married and used it as an opportunity to evade her debt -- that really doesn't make her sound any better, but as you wish.

Originally Posted by rastoma

She is not fighting a legitimate debt. She is fighting a fraudulently obtained judgment that is for OVER TWO THOUSAND DOLLARS MORE than her bill.

You have described it as a legitimate debt that she ceased paying. There is no force more powerful than compounding interest.

Originally Posted by rastoma

She made a mistake in forgetting a bill. The punishment for that should not be a 200% fine.

Actually here I agree with you. I fully support debtor's prisons. She wasn't fined, she lost a civil judgment. She should have been fined and imprisoned -- maybe then deadbeats would start making paying their debts a priority.

Originally Posted by rastoma

She would have made arrangements to pay had she been served properly.

Nonsense. She had months before this went to judgment. If she was inclined to pay, she would have.

Originally Posted by rastoma

We only bring up the issue of SOL now that she has been done wrong and need to find a remedy. Paying over $3000 for a $900 bill is not acceptable, is not right and not just remedy for forgetting a bill.

She hasn't been done wrong. She has done wrong. And she has to pay for the unauthorized use of someone else's money.

Originally Posted by rastoma

She has never refused to pay the bill.... she simply forgot about it. That doesn't mean she should get out of it and that would never have been her intention.

Then stop crying and man up and pay the debt. Prove her intention is to pay her debt and not evade it. Grab your checkbook and take some responsibility for your actions. (Or tell her, if you aren't man enough to take care of your family -- see there is that nasty ad hominem attack coming back on you.)

Originally Posted by rastoma

No matter your profession there is no way any reasonable person would find that obtaining a default judgment for almost 3 times the original amount because of not being served properly is just.

Deadbeats claim they aren't served all the time. You checked the service and found it be valid. You may not like it, but since you failed to fight it -- live with it.

DC

PS -- There is no SOL claim even if you did somehow overturn the suit because she fled the state where she incurred the debt. Therefore the debt tolls. And ironically I am willing to bet that the default interest rate is much higher than the statutory interest rate. So if you did overturn the judgment, they would recompute the interest , late fees and costs and refile for the much higher amount.

[rastoma]

I see this is not really a place for advice but for abuse when someone makes an honest mistake.

If anyone other than DC has any suggestions on how to handle this the proper way since we were not served properly (read the OP), it would be appreciated.

Thanks.

[debtcollector`]

Originally Posted by rastoma

I see this is not really a place for advice but for abuse when someone makes an honest mistake.

If anyone other than DC has any suggestions on how to handle this the proper way since we were not served properly (read the OP), it would be appreciated.

Thanks.

If it was an honest mistake, own up to it and pay the debt.

DC

[rastoma]

Originally Posted by debtcollector`

If it was an honest mistake, own up to it and pay the debt.

DC

I would and have tried, but I (she) will NOT pay 3 times the amount because someone lied about serving us papers.

Yes I KNOW people say they were not served all the time... probably MOST of the time. Whether or not you believe that, I don't care.... we actually were NOT served.

[debtcollector`]

Originally Posted by rastoma

I would and have tried, but I (she) will NOT pay 3 times the amount because someone lied about serving us papers.

Yes I KNOW people say they were not served all the time... probably MOST of the time. Whether or not you believe that, I don't care.... we actually were NOT served.

That is not important. You still owe interest and late fees - compounding for several years.

So here is the situation.
You (applies to you and your wife or just your wife) owe the money.
The post judgment interest rate is 10 percent. The default rate on the card was probably 29 percent or more.
So if you successfully fight the judgment, you will owe about 2.5 times the judgment amount. So at this point you can either pay your debt or keep getting your backside up and wind up paying far more.

I'd recommend you simply pay your debt and move on with your life. If you don't pay voluntarily, you will be made to pay involuntarily. As for being judgment proof -- good luck with that. You will learn an expensive lesson.

That said, good luck to you.

DC

[Zigner]

Let me restate what DC has said...
Your wife incurred a debt. She moved out of state and, in a state of bliss due to her recent marriage, she neglected to pay one of her bills. The notices were sent to her last known address, but your wife never got them, as she did not update her address with the creditor (as required by the credit agreement). Your wife was properly served notice of a lawsuit (per the court), and did not respond. This led to a default judgment.

Have I got it right so far? I think so.

Now, what DC is saying is that you should pay NOW, because if you have the suit overturned, then the creditor will re-file based on a much higher default interest rate. You agree that your wife owes the money, so your wife will get a NEW judgment against her for a much higher amount.

Principles can be an expensive thing...pay the debt now, or pay a lot more later. Your choice.

[Texas Pooh]

OP,

In addition to the interest which has accrued over the last seven years, the creditor is entitled to collect the costs of pursuing this debt - filing fees and attorneys' fees. Thus, the debt is easily several times the original debt.

Who do you think should bear the costs of your wife's failure to update her address? The creditor has paid filing fees and attorney's fees. Surely they should not bear the brunt of these costs.

Your best bet is to enter into an agreement to pay this debt and avoid post-judgment remedies, which are (a) painful (asset seizures, etc). and (b) expensive for you, since it just adds costs to the judgment.

[lawstudent9]

Rastoma,
It's been a while since you posted this thread, but I Google searched "Missouri," "default judgment" and "interest rate," and this was the first Web site listed.

I am an intern at a legal aid clinic in Missouri, and I have been working on consumer cases like yours. Unfortunately, debtcollector, Zigner and Texas Pooh are correct. I hope you have taken their harsh advice to heart. Both Missouri and Tennessee are among the states that have the fewest protections for consumers, according to the National Consumer Law Center's Small Dollar Loan Products Scorecard.

You must pay this bill as soon as possible. It is an unfortunate truth that those unfamiliar with the legal system sometimes get the short end of the stick. I am working on a case right now where the consumer agreed to an interest rate of more than 200 percent, creating for himself a negatively amortizing loan (that is, the amount owed increases each month, despite his payments). Consider yourself fortunate you're not in the same situation.

In essence, it doesn't matter any longer that you weren't served properly. If you don't pay the bill, you are merely exacerbating the problem. There's a lot of triage, in the interest of efficiency, in the legal system.

In my opinion, if you feel very strongly that you - and many other borrowers and consumers like you - have been treated unfairly (and I most certainly agree), the best way to act on your principles is to go to your legislators. The reason statutes are so consumer-unfriendly in states like Missouri and Tennessee is because businesses and lenders have been much more successful in their lobbying efforts. Put your rightful indignance to good use.

Best of luck.

[Zigner]

Originally Posted by lawstudent9

In my opinion, if you feel very strongly that you - and many other borrowers and consumers like you - have been treated unfairly

Yeah! Why should one be expected to pay back the money they borrow?

[lawstudent9]

It's a shame that we need stronger consumer-protection laws to protect unsophisticated borrowers and buyers from predatory businesses and lenders. We ought to be able to trust such merchants to act honestly and in good faith, but sometimes they do not. When someone borrows $500, why should she or he ever be required to pay back more than $6,000 less than two years later? Yet, the laws of many of our states permit this very situation; obviously, I've seen it happen.

I agree that one should diligently fulfill his or her obligations, but I also believe in mercy, particularly when a consumer has been plagued by serious illness, abuse, crime, poverty or natural disaster.

Our legal system also believes in mercy. We just call it "equity."

Have a heart.

[cosine]

Originally Posted by lawstudent9

Our legal system also believes in mercy. We just call it "equity."

Or bankruptcy. This isn't the way problems like this should be solved. Unfortunately, it is too often the only way out.

[Zigner]

Originally Posted by lawstudent9

It's a shame that we need stronger consumer-protection laws to protect unsophisticated borrowers and buyers from predatory businesses and lenders. We ought to be able to trust such merchants to act honestly and in good faith, but sometimes they do not. When someone borrows $500, why should she or he ever be required to pay back more than $6,000 less than two years later? Yet, the laws of many of our states permit this very situation; obviously, I've seen it happen.

I agree that one should diligently fulfill his or her obligations, but I also believe in mercy, particularly when a consumer has been plagued by serious illness, abuse, crime, poverty or natural disaster.

Our legal system also believes in mercy. We just call it "equity."

Have a heart.

Nice rant...now, how would that apply to THIS op? This OP incurred a debt and then IGNORED it and EVADED it.

ETA: Correction, his WIFE incurred a debt and then IGNORED it and EVADED it.