Father's Estate and his Creditors

[mmmagique]

The family has no obligation to pay decedent's bills.

I'm sorry that I cannot answer the question regarding the phone bill.

It might be a good idea to get a few free consultations with probate attorneys to find out where you and your mom stand.

Good luck.

[anteater]

Originally Posted by Heir7

Yes, you and other posters were arguing with the information.

And did you notice that no one else bothered to answer the original poster's question about whether or not the family is required to open probate? Debt collectors don't want the information to get out to the public, so they just try to trash and bully anyone like me who tries to give out the information.

Go clean some toilets now.

I see that you are as scrupulous in making arguments as you are in other aspects of your life. I never said that. And, in fact, I have told a number of posters on the Probate forums that they are not obligated to open probate. Of course, I have never condoned anybody fraudulently obtaining the deceased's assets while attempting to stiff legitimate creditors of the estate. That is something that I will leave to lowlifes like yourself.

What you overlook in your creditor-bashing frenzy is that the person who steps up to administer an estate is entitled to compensation for doing so. And estate attorney compensation is paid from estate assets. And such compensation has precedence over creditor claims.

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by Heir7

...
There is no state in the country that forces the family to open probate.
...

Wrong. Here's one.

Missouri Revised Statutes
Chapter 473
Probate Code--Administration of Decedents' Estates
Section 473.020

August 28, 2008


If no application filed, others may request administration or probate--petition, form, contents--hearing, notice, orders.

473.020. 1. If no application for letters testamentary or of administration is filed by a person entitled to such letters pursuant to section 473.110 within twenty days after the death of a decedent, then any interested person may petition the probate division of the circuit court which would be the proper venue for the administration of the estate of such decedent for the issuance of letters testamentary or of administration. For purposes of this section, in addition to persons provided for in subdivision (15) of section 472.010, RSMo, any person who has attached a claim supported by an affidavit setting forth the basis upon which such person has a claim against the decedent shall be an interested person. [emphasis supplied]

2. The petition must be filed within one year after the date of death of the decedent and shall include the following:

(1) The decedent's name, the address of the decedent's last residence and the date of death of the decedent;

(2) If a written will of the decedent has been presented for probate, the names and addresses of the personal representatives designated in such will; and

(3) The names, addresses and relationships to the decedent of the decedent's heirs as is known to, or can be reasonably ascertained by, the petitioner.

3. Within fifteen days from the date of filing, the petition shall be set for hearing to determine who should be directed to apply for letters testamentary or of administration, and not to determine the validity of any claim. Notice of the hearing shall be served upon all interested persons in the manner and within such time as directed by the court. Upon hearing of the petition, the court shall enter such order or orders as it deems appropriate, including any of the following:

(1) An order directing the person found by the court to be entitled to the issuance of letters testamentary or of administration to apply for and qualify for such letters within such time as is allowed by the court, and in default of such timely application and qualification, upon application, the court shall issue letters of administration to some other person found suitable by the court;

(2) An order refusing letters on the estate; or

(3) An order dismissing the petition.

(RSMo 1939 § 8, A.L. 1955 p. 385 § 34, A.L. 1957 p. 829, A.L. 1980 S.B. 637, A.L. 1996 S.B. 494)

Prior revisions: 1929 § 8; 1919 § 8; 1909 § 10

Effective 5-23-96

(1961) Where appointment of an administrator who had no interest in the estate was made eleven months after decedent's death on application of attorney for widow having wrongful death action against decedent's estate, the burden was on those opposing the appointment to establish that persons entitled to administer were residents and otherwise qualified. In re Norman's Estate (A.), 347 S.W.2d 908.

(1962) In subsequent proceeding in prohibition to restrain action for damages for wrongful death against administrator was void for lack of finding of nonresidence of widow, judgment in "In re Norman's Estate" held res judicata and preliminary writ quashed. State ex rel. Farmer v. Allison (A.), 359 S.W.2d 245.

(1992) Personal representatives did not waive and renounce their right to apply for letters testamentary by filing their petition after the twenty days allowed by the statute. Statute does not limit the time in which a named executor must file the application for letters in probate; rather, statute merely ensures that where executor has failed to file in a in a timely manner, other interested persons should be free to do so. Matter of Estate of Bloemker, 829 S.W.2d 7 (Mo. App. E.D.).


© Copyright

bottom Missouri General Assembly

[Antigone*of*Greece]

Hey SJ, the heir-apparent of stupidity has bid his farewell. At least that's what he said in his goodbye to the forum he so dearly loved and tremendously contributed to.

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by Wirelessany1

Hey SJ, the heir-apparent of stupidity has bid his farewell. At least that's what he said in his goodbye to the forum he so dearly loved and tremendously contributed to.

There is a God!

Heir7
Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 32
Goodbye, I'm Leaving the Debt Collector Forum!
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?


This is a complete waste of time.

And with that, I close this thread.

http://forum.freeadvice.com/debt-collections-84/goodbye-im-leaving-debt-collector-forum-436651.html

[Heir7]

Originally Posted by seniorjudge

Wrong. Here's one.

Missouri Revised Statutes
Chapter 473
Probate Code--Administration of Decedents' Estates
Section 473.020

August 28, 2008


If no application filed, others may request administration or probate--petition, form, contents--hearing, notice, orders.

473.020. 1. If no application for letters testamentary or of administration is filed by a person entitled to such letters pursuant to section 473.110 within twenty days after the death of a decedent, then any interested person may petition the probate division of the circuit court which would be the proper venue for the administration of the estate of such decedent for the issuance of letters testamentary or of administration. For purposes of this section, in addition to persons provided for in subdivision (15) of section 472.010, RSMo, any person who has attached a claim supported by an affidavit setting forth the basis upon which such person has a claim against the decedent shall be an interested person. [emphasis supplied]

2. The petition must be filed within one year after the date of death of the decedent and shall include the following:

(1) The decedent's name, the address of the decedent's last residence and the date of death of the decedent;

(2) If a written will of the decedent has been presented for probate, the names and addresses of the personal representatives designated in such will; and

(3) The names, addresses and relationships to the decedent of the decedent's heirs as is known to, or can be reasonably ascertained by, the petitioner.

3. Within fifteen days from the date of filing, the petition shall be set for hearing to determine who should be directed to apply for letters testamentary or of administration, and not to determine the validity of any claim. Notice of the hearing shall be served upon all interested persons in the manner and within such time as directed by the court. Upon hearing of the petition, the court shall enter such order or orders as it deems appropriate, including any of the following:

(1) An order directing the person found by the court to be entitled to the issuance of letters testamentary or of administration to apply for and qualify for such letters within such time as is allowed by the court, and in default of such timely application and qualification, upon application, the court shall issue letters of administration to some other person found suitable by the court;

(2) An order refusing letters on the estate; or

(3) An order dismissing the petition.

(RSMo 1939 § 8, A.L. 1955 p. 385 § 34, A.L. 1957 p. 829, A.L. 1980 S.B. 637, A.L. 1996 S.B. 494)

Prior revisions: 1929 § 8; 1919 § 8; 1909 § 10

Effective 5-23-96

(1961) Where appointment of an administrator who had no interest in the estate was made eleven months after decedent's death on application of attorney for widow having wrongful death action against decedent's estate, the burden was on those opposing the appointment to establish that persons entitled to administer were residents and otherwise qualified. In re Norman's Estate (A.), 347 S.W.2d 908.

(1962) In subsequent proceeding in prohibition to restrain action for damages for wrongful death against administrator was void for lack of finding of nonresidence of widow, judgment in "In re Norman's Estate" held res judicata and preliminary writ quashed. State ex rel. Farmer v. Allison (A.), 359 S.W.2d 245.

(1992) Personal representatives did not waive and renounce their right to apply for letters testamentary by filing their petition after the twenty days allowed by the statute. Statute does not limit the time in which a named executor must file the application for letters in probate; rather, statute merely ensures that where executor has failed to file in a in a timely manner, other interested persons should be free to do so. Matter of Estate of Bloemker, 829 S.W.2d 7 (Mo. App. E.D.).


© Copyright

bottom Missouri General Assembly

Nowhere in that quote does it state that a family member MUST open probate. What quoted says that if no one from the family opens probate, then any interested party (such as a creditor) may open probate.

So, I win! I was right and you were wrong.

The original poster asked the question-- are family members required to open probate.

THE ANSWER IS NO.

[debtcollector`]

Heir -- not only are you frequently dangerously wrong. You are a liar. You promised to leave and not come back and yet here you are like a bad case of the clap - with about as much positive value.

DC

[Antigone*of*Greece]

Originally Posted by debtcollector`

You promised to leave and not come back and yet here you are like a bad case of the clap - with about as much positive value.

DC

Damn DC, I wish I would have thought of that one!!!

[BlondiePB]

Originally Posted by kpence73

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Florida

My father passed away in September and his estate is worth less than $10K. He rented his house and the only thing of value is the car and personal items.

If he rented his house, where's mom living? Real Estate that is rented is not protected under FL's homestead.

Florida law excludes personal items like furniture, etc from liquidation in probate court.

FL has very nice exemptions.

Florida also doesn't require probate for anything less than $50K or something like that.

Not true. For example, if dad had any bank account solely in his name without a designated beneficiary with...let's say for example $5,000.00 in it, probate would have to be opened to obtain the money.

His creditors of course all said they would file a claim against his estate and do a property search for anything specific to file a claim on.

Let them.

My question is if they file a claim, are we required to probate his will and estate?

Let them open probate too.

Also, all of the utility services that were in his name such as his home phone were disconnected. They have just recently sent a collection notice for the money owed on the phone account. The account was opened in my father's name with his social security number. My mother has a fear they will come after her for the payment even though her name isn't anywhere on the account (yes they lived in the same house).

Which house...the one that was rented?

My research online told me that anything (creditors, utilities, etc) only in my father's name and not joint with my mother would not be held against my mother.

The estate is responsible for paying creditors.

Doesn't mom need utilities? Are the utility companies changing the account without being paid?

[BlondiePB]

Originally Posted by Heir7

Well, I would value the opinion of a real attorney in Washington over your opinion any day.

You're just some hack on a website who thinks he's very smart, but you're an idiot debt collector.

Wow, anteater changed jobs????


(Note to anteater: What's up with you changing jobs and not letting us all know? )

[BlondiePB]

Originally Posted by Wirelessany1

Hey SJ, the heir-apparent of stupidity has bid his farewell. At least that's what he said in his goodbye to the forum he so dearly loved and tremendously contributed to.

Most trolls bid farewell only to renege until their potty mouths get them banned.

[BlondiePB]

How ya doing, Arkie?

[anteater]

Originally Posted by BlondiePB

Wow, anteater changed jobs????


(Note to anteater: What's up with you changing jobs and not letting us all know? )

Well, with the downturn in the markets, my attempt to corner the pork belly futures market is suffering. Decided that I needed a side business.

Anybody need some bacon and/or sausage? I figure that there is about a 10 year supply about to show up on my door step.

[kpence73]

Quote:
Originally Posted by kpence73 View Post
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Florida

My father passed away in September and his estate is worth less than $10K. He rented his house and the only thing of value is the car and personal items.
If he rented his house, where's mom living? Real Estate that is rented is not protected under FL's homestead.

Quote:
Florida law excludes personal items like furniture, etc from liquidation in probate court.
FL has very nice exemptions.
Quote:
Florida also doesn't require probate for anything less than $50K or something like that.
Not true. For example, if dad had any bank account solely in his name without a designated beneficiary with...let's say for example $5,000.00 in it, probate would have to be opened to obtain the money.
Quote:
His creditors of course all said they would file a claim against his estate and do a property search for anything specific to file a claim on.
Let them.
Quote:
My question is if they file a claim, are we required to probate his will and estate?
Let them open probate too.
Quote:
Also, all of the utility services that were in his name such as his home phone were disconnected. They have just recently sent a collection notice for the money owed on the phone account. The account was opened in my father's name with his social security number. My mother has a fear they will come after her for the payment even though her name isn't anywhere on the account (yes they lived in the same house).
Which house...the one that was rented?
Quote:
My research online told me that anything (creditors, utilities, etc) only in my father's name and not joint with my mother would not be held against my mother.
The estate is responsible for paying creditors.

Doesn't mom need utilities? Are the utility companies changing the account without being paid?

The Realtor who handles the house took care of the rental agreement, the electric and cable were switched to my mom's name with no problems. The phone was the issue. She has a cell phone and no need for 2 land lines, which is what my dad had, so those were disconnected not transferred. As far as the bank account goes, there was one and it is a joint account.

[seniorjudge]

Why do you keep double posting on this subject!?

Keep all your questions in one thread.