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Harassment by Rent-A-Center, employees trespassing, making threats

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justalayman

Senior Member
In every city and town... It was a 'criminal' matter instead of a civil matter. The Police department is the one who presses charges against the person in a 'criminal' matter. They are the ones who decide whether or not they have grounds to press charges.

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You are wrong here Hutch. The police do not decide who gets prosecuted. That is why there is a prosecutors office.

Once a report is given to the DA's offfice, it is out of the police' hands and the decision is soley up to the DA.

The STATE presses charges and the DA acts as the state.
 

TigerD

Senior Member
the fact OP did not leave his dwelling and the fact that having some yahoo trying to kick in your door brings this castle doctrine law into effect, I believe.

Somebody trying to kick in a door can reasonably be seen as a threat of violence against the person as physical abuse is being used to gain access to the person and along with any verbal threats, could easily be considered to instill the belief OP was subject to physical harm.
Given the tenor of the OP's postings, I find it hard to believe that RAC employees were trying to kick down his door. Also he opened the door and according to his own words threatened "unreasonable" violence. The RAC people were in a public corridor and since the aggressor, the OP, was within lethal range - I'd put self defense on them -- but I'm not an attorney and Mass laws are but one random dot short of silly to begin with.

But I think I'd just avoid the issue by not answer my front door brandishing a knife.
That's it for me on this thread -- the op isn't going to listen to reason. Perhaps the meds need to be adjusted or taken.

DC
 

NHutch

Junior Member
Given the tenor of the OP's postings, I find it hard to believe that RAC employees were trying to kick down his door. Also he opened the door and according to his own words threatened "unreasonable" violence. The RAC people were in a public corridor and since the aggressor, the OP, was within lethal range - I'd put self defense on them -- but I'm not an attorney and Mass laws are but one random dot short of silly to begin with.

But I think I'd just avoid the issue by not answer my front door brandishing a knife.
That's it for me on this thread -- the op isn't going to listen to reason. Perhaps the meds need to be adjusted or taken.

DC

The RAC employees were NOT in a public corrider, they were in a privately owned corridor. There were 2 doors to get through in the front entrance and one door to get through in the rear entrance. The mailboxes and buzzers are located after the first door which is not locked. That is how the UPS/Fedex/USPS deliver mail and packages by putting the mail in the mailboxes and for the UPS/FEDEX guys to ring the buzzer of the unit to which they are delivering the packages to. They did not even buzz, they had to lie to some old lady who was coming in (which i verified with her, they told her they had just moved in and forgot their key) in order to get into the hallway. The 2nd door in the front entrance automatically locks when it is shut. The rear entrance door also automatically locks when it is shut. Whether the corridor is public or private is irrelevant anyways as they were trying to break into MY exclusive property.

The law that was given is a FEDERAL law, not a state specific law.

Resorting to name calling clearly shows that you know that you are wrong. That's what immature people do to try to level the playing field when they are wrong.
 

NHutch

Junior Member
You are wrong here Hutch. The police do not decide who gets prosecuted. That is why there is a prosecutors office.

Once a report is given to the DA's offfice, it is out of the police' hands and the decision is soley up to the DA.

The STATE presses charges and the DA acts as the state.
My bad, what I should have said was "The sarge said he will talk to the DA and have her drop the charges before it even gets to court." He told me that he will have the charges dropped but the above quotation is what he meant.
 
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justalayman

Senior Member
The law that was given is a FEDERAL law, not a state specific law.

Resorting to name calling clearly shows that you know that you are wrong. That's what immature people do to try to level the playing field when they are wrong.
You keep making it harder to give any support to your arguments. There were no federal laws involved here. The laws I quoted are Mass state laws and nothing you experienced was a federal situation other than your claim of the FDCPA which you were told was not correct.

They were not attempting to collect a debt, they were attempting to reclaim their property as prescribed in the contract you would have signed with them. There is a difference.

and, the fact they were in a corridor at all mean they were not actually inside your residence where the law I posted requires you to be to utilize its defenses. Until they actually crossed your threshold, it does not come in to play and the instant you cross the threshold (including just a knife wielding hand and arm) you have removed that law from use.
 

NHutch

Junior Member
You keep making it harder to give any support to your arguments. There were no federal laws involved here. The laws I quoted are Mass state laws and nothing you experienced was a federal situation other than your claim of the FDCPA which you were told was not correct.

They were not attempting to collect a debt, they were attempting to reclaim their property as prescribed in the contract you would have signed with them. There is a difference.

and, the fact they were in a corridor at all mean they were not actually inside your residence where the law I posted requires you to be to utilize its defenses. Until they actually crossed your threshold, it does not come in to play and the instant you cross the threshold (including just a knife wielding hand and arm) you have removed that law from use.

I can argue that my door is part of my exclusive property, but I won't touch that one. Remember though, I only threatened to use the weapon IF they didn't leave and if they didn't stop harassing me. What I said when I opened the door was this, "Do you wanna get your throat slit?" "Then Keep banging on my door and yelling at me."

Here's my biggest argument though. If they did not feel threatened, then it is not a threat regardless of what was said. If they did not feel I was 100% serious then it is not a threat. My proof of this is that when I shut the door they CONTINUED to bang on it and yell obsenities at me. You don't continue to do something when someone tells you that they will kill you if you continue to do it unless you didn't take them seriously.
 

CollectionGuru

Junior Member
Ok I went down to my local PD and talked to the Sarge. Apparently he's a good friend of my Dad and used to go to school with him. I told him my side of the story thoroughly and he decided to drop the charges and told me that I was within my rights. He repeated what I had thought, "Force used must be proportionate. You can Threaten more force than you entitled to use so long as your intention is just to create apprehension to diffuse the situation."

They were trepassing on my property by the way. Our condo rules that we voted on states that only occupents of the building units have access to the corridors. It is considered the common area of the property owners and occupants (renters.) The hallways are the property of the unit owners. Only the property owners and maintenance are allowed to use them and they are closed to the public. After asking them to leave and giving them the time to leave immediately, I can then resort to physically removing them. The sarge told me it's a better idea to give the police a call to do that for me.


Well at first I thought you were stupid, now I also think you are a liar.
 

Just Blue

Senior Member
My bad, what I should have said was "The sarge said he will talk to the DA and have her drop the charges before it even gets to court." He told me that he will have the charges dropped but the above quotation is what he meant.
You are such a liar. Go away.
 
Remember though, I only threatened to use the weapon IF they didn't leave and if they didn't stop harassing me. What I said when I opened the door was this, "Do you wanna get your throat slit?" "Then Keep banging on my door and yelling at me."
Your front door is your first line of defense. Opening it esculated the situation. Look, I know you are young but are you really that thick headed?

Here's my biggest argument though. If they did not feel threatened, then it is not a threat regardless of what was said. If they did not feel I was 100% serious then it is not a threat. My proof of this is that when I shut the door they CONTINUED to bang on it and yell obsenities at me. You don't continue to do something when someone tells you that they will kill you if you continue to do it unless you didn't take them seriously.
Ok so you have an arguement. Now apply it to how it will be taken in a court of law. What do you think the judge would say about the actions and words YOU took. You are the one that is being charged with a criminal offense.

It doesn't matter that they continued to bang on the door, what matters is that you opened it in the first place.

"Yes your honor, I was protecting my propery and THAT is why I opened up my door instead of locking it."

Look, you are young and lack experience. So I say this - MAN UP. YOU posted here asking for advice. Don't get me wrong, this thread is entertaining, but kids your age that are this bull headed suffer from selective extinction.

You want to be in the right, who doesn't. MAN UP and realize that maybe you are in the wrong.

I'll be back, gonna go get some popcorn for this.

TiredOfAbuse
 

You Are Guilty

Senior Member
Two thoughts:

The OP is clearly disturbed and it's a little embarrassing that only one person seems to have recognized that fact. Arguing is certainly not going to change his perceptions, any more than telling him the purple rabbit that lives in his sock drawer isn't real.

And for anyone in the future who may be reading this thread (since it's clear the OP is off in la-la land): The legal use of force is dictated by what level of force you are confronted with. If you are confronted with a skinny 19 year old's fists, you cannot respond with deadly force. You can legally punch him back, and if he whips out a gun, you can pull your knife.
 

NHutch

Junior Member
Ok so I spoke with an attorney today for about 2 hours who is going to defend me if the charges against me aren't dropped and we will file a criminal and civil case against them. This will greatly help in my defense because it allows him to get a lot more information that he wouldn't normally be able to get in addition to a settlement for the damages they caused. There are atleast 4 charges that we will be filing and I don't remember exactly what they are but someone who's more knowledgeable about law can take a stab at what they are. The condo association is the one who can press charges for the trespassing and I cannot. The other charges from what I remember (disturbing the peace, assault, harassment causing severe emotional distress, vandalism ect.) will come from me. This will cost me a good chunk of change but I'm willing to do it not only for myself but for others who have been bullied by these thugs and don't have the money for a lawyer. It makes sense that RAC uses illegal tactics to bully customers because they know that those people don't have the money to afford a lawyer. I do have the money for this because my last weeks paychecks from both jobs added up to nearly $2K and the car that was totaled in the accident last weekend had been completely paid off and I paid this month's rent as well as next months rent early. I have (or had) two vehicles that I had already paid off. The car that was totaled was my baby, 2004 Dodge SRT-4 w/40K miles, mopar stage 3 kit, full tein ss suspension and a few other toys. Insurance company is sending me a check for $15K for the vehicle and I will obviously settle with drunk drivers insurance company for the injuries. My other car is a 96 Jetta GL w/ 77K miles and I've had everything fixed on it so I can use it for awhile and save myself a lot of money on car insurance (my insurance for the SRT-4 was $3800 + $1300 for the jetta.)

I wouldn't call myself thick-headed, I do understand what each person has said and understand where they are coming from. Whether I agree with what you say is another story. I would call it something a little less degrading, something more like 'Lacks the fear necessary to be bullied.'
 

NHutch

Junior Member
Your front door is your first line of defense. Opening it esculated the situation. Look, I know you are young but are you really that thick headed?



Ok so you have an arguement. Now apply it to how it will be taken in a court of law. What do you think the judge would say about the actions and words YOU took. You are the one that is being charged with a criminal offense.

It doesn't matter that they continued to bang on the door, what matters is that you opened it in the first place.

"Yes your honor, I was protecting my propery and THAT is why I opened up my door instead of locking it."

Look, you are young and lack experience. So I say this - MAN UP. YOU posted here asking for advice. Don't get me wrong, this thread is entertaining, but kids your age that are this bull headed suffer from selective extinction.

You want to be in the right, who doesn't. MAN UP and realize that maybe you are in the wrong.

I'll be back, gonna go get some popcorn for this.

TiredOfAbuse
Again, I DO NOT HAVE TO RETREAT ON MY PROPERTY. That means I do not have to avoid physical confrontation if someone is attempting to gain entry to my home. Whether the door is open or not is completely irrelevant in this situation. Opening the door falls under not having to retreat in one's own property. They were attempting to break the door down so by me opening the door I was PROTECTING my own property (the door is part of my property.) Whether they broke the door down or not I still was behind it and I was still brandishing my weapon. I did not leave my exclusive premisis when I confronted them and I made no physical moves towards them so they were in no imminent danger according to the law. I gave them the opportunity to retreat which the law states that you must retreat if you have the opportunity to do so in order to avoid physical confrontation. If one does not retreat, if given the opportunity to do so without resulting in physical harm, then they are provoking physical confrontation and they become the aggressors. Since I do not have to retreat in my own home I was in self-defense the entire time of the confrontation, from the second they knocked on my door until the second they left the building.

Calling me a 'kid' is merely trying to insult my intelligence and credibility because of my age. Trust me bud, I've been through more in my mere 21 years than most have in an entire lifetime. I'm not your typical 21 year old and I'd appreciate if you'd not group me in with the majority. I understand that most 21 year olds really are children, but I'm not one of them. I live like I'm a married 35 year old with kids, honestly. I work my butt off and earn a salary that exceeds that of most married 35 year old men with children working a professional job in the technology field. I have a wonderful supportive girlfriend (4 years in March that we've been together) who's 24 and she'd be the first to tell you that I'm much older than that. I don't party anymore, I grew out of that when I was about 18 years old. I grew up fast, and have been through a helluva lot which has only made me stronger and more intelligent. I'm pretty sure my parents who are both approaching 50 party more than I do. I am a member of Mensa and scored an 800 on the math portion of my SATs. So again, I ask that you please not think of me as your typical party-first minded 21 year old, as I find it offensive and completely fictional. Thank you.
 
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Ozark_Sophist

Senior Member
btw: I do believe you should have simply left the door closed and called the police. If it were me and as long as I had my desert eagle at my side waiting on the other side of the door I would not have worried about the kids coming in.

I can assure you that when they walked in the door and looked at a 50 cal pistols business end, they would tend to calm down quite a bit.
I have a 44 desert eagle (went with the 44 for option of a long barrel). Given the penetration power, I went with a .410/45LC Thunder Five for home defense. The short (1 1/2") barrel with a 410 shot load leads to a wide dispersion. The 45LC makes a big hole.

I would load three 410 shell and two 45 long colt. The sheer size of the Thunder Five is more intimidating than the desert eagle.

I had an guy who abused his wife come looking for her at my place after I got her to a safe house. I invited him in for a "talk." I never had to resort to display of weapons -- my demeanor and size discouraged him. ;)
 
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