Legal Methods of Collecting Asset Info on a Debtor

[cszokeable]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? New Jersey

Hi,

In 2006, 12 hours after a glass broke in my hand, severing few nerves/muscles, I went to the ER for stitching. The Doc was a complete joke and told me to see a specialist and sent me on my way eventhough I told him that there was a glass piece still in there. The hospital billed my Insurance and the insurance paid out the agreed contractual amount. The ER doc then billed me for the remainder due. Forward to Feb 2009, the hospital filed and was granted by the court for BK Chap 7- full liquidation). On the hospital's website, it said that outstanding bills will be erased and not pursued. So, I never paid, but still got calls from the collector. I did tell the collection agency he (the Doc) was an idiot and the insurance company already paid. Forward to 2009 approx. 2 months ago, I rec'd a complaint filed in special civil, I intentionally never responded (b/c I knew that I would file for Bankruptcy - Chapter 7). Forward to Oct. 19, I rec'd a letter from my bank that an acct I opend under my son's name back in 2006 was being levied by the creditor (when i opened this acct in 06, I listed my then 2 yr old son as the account holder and me as the custodial parent, given that a minor can not enter into a contractual agreement). I was told by the creditor's Atty that the court officer is the one who obtained all my personal info and bank acct numbers, at which point he then forwarded that info to the creditor atty for levy approval from the judge.

I spoke with both the Judge's law clerk and confirmed with the info on the court's website that it is the creditor who must obtain the acct info for the bank in order to get the levy approved by the judge.

So, after this long spill, the question is, is it legal for them to obtain such personal info such as my bank acct info? Is it legal for the lending institution to levy an acct opened in my son's name? Would this be a good ground to file a motion to vacate judgment?

Your help is much appreciated.

Thank you

[Zigner]

Originally Posted by cszokeable

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? New Jersey

Hi,

In 2006, 12 hours after a glass broke in my hand, severing few nerves/muscles, I went to the ER for stitching. The Doc was a complete joke and told me to see a specialist and sent me on my way eventhough I told him that there was a glass piece still in there. The hospital billed my Insurance and the insurance paid out the agreed contractual amount. The ER doc then billed me for the remainder due. Forward to Feb 2009, the hospital filed and was granted by the court for BK Chap 7- full liquidation). On the hospital's website, it said that outstanding bills will be erased and not pursued. So, I never paid, but still got calls from the collector. I did tell the collection agency he (the Doc) was an idiot and the insurance company already paid. Forward to 2009 approx. 2 months ago, I rec'd a complaint filed in special civil, I intentionally never responded (b/c I knew that I would file for Bankruptcy - Chapter 7). Forward to Oct. 19, I rec'd a letter from my bank that an acct I opend under my son's name back in 2006 was being levied by the creditor (when i opened this acct in 06, I listed my then 2 yr old son as the account holder and me as the custodial parent, given that a minor can not enter into a contractual agreement). I was told by the creditor's Atty that the court officer is the one who obtained all my personal info and bank acct numbers, at which point he then forwarded that info to the creditor atty for levy approval from the judge.

I spoke with both the Judge's law clerk and confirmed with the info on the court's website that it is the creditor who must obtain the acct info for the bank in order to get the levy approved by the judge.

So, after this long spill, the question is, is it legal for them to obtain such personal info such as my bank acct info? Is it legal for the lending institution to levy an acct opened in my son's name? Would this be a good ground to file a motion to vacate judgment?

Your help is much appreciated.

Thank you

The moral of the story? Don't ignore court proceedings!

[cszokeable]

Wow, I would have never figured that one out without your expertise! Perhaps you were misdirected to this website, and specifically to my thread, so please allow me to help you find the correct website you were looking for, [url]www.wannabelawyertocompensateforlackofmanliness.com[/url].

BTW - if you are a lawyer, I would highly recommend asking for a refund from the Bar Association and strongly suggest that you don't name drop the law school you graduated from, that is if you don't want the institution to go bankrupt.

My 4 year old son is more mature than you!

[Country Living]

Originally Posted by cszokeable

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? New Jersey

Hi,

In 2006, 12 hours after a glass broke in my hand, severing few nerves/muscles, I went to the ER for stitching. The Doc was a complete joke and told me to see a specialist and sent me on my way eventhough I told him that there was a glass piece still in there. The hospital billed my Insurance and the insurance paid out the agreed contractual amount. The ER doc then billed me for the remainder due. Forward to Feb 2009, the hospital filed and was granted by the court for BK Chap 7- full liquidation). On the hospital's website, it said that outstanding bills will be erased and not pursued. So, I never paid, but still got calls from the collector. I did tell the collection agency he (the Doc) was an idiot and the insurance company already paid. Forward to 2009 approx. 2 months ago, I rec'd a complaint filed in special civil, I intentionally never responded (b/c I knew that I would file for Bankruptcy - Chapter 7). Forward to Oct. 19, I rec'd a letter from my bank that an acct I opend under my son's name back in 2006 was being levied by the creditor (when i opened this acct in 06, I listed my then 2 yr old son as the account holder and me as the custodial parent, given that a minor can not enter into a contractual agreement). I was told by the creditor's Atty that the court officer is the one who obtained all my personal info and bank acct numbers, at which point he then forwarded that info to the creditor atty for levy approval from the judge.

I spoke with both the Judge's law clerk and confirmed with the info on the court's website that it is the creditor who must obtain the acct info for the bank in order to get the levy approved by the judge.

So, after this long spill, the question is, is it legal for them to obtain such personal info such as my bank acct info? Is it legal for the lending institution to levy an acct opened in my son's name? Would this be a good ground to file a motion to vacate judgment?

Your help is much appreciated.

Thank you

You intentially ignored a notice to appear in court and now you have a judgment against you. The collection agency has the right to be paid which means they can go after your separate and joint bank accounts and other assets.

[cszokeable]

My arguement is 2 fold: (1) the ER Doc already rec'd his contracted payment thru my insurance company, and should not be charging me; and, (2) his firm used illegal tactics to obtain personal banking information (such as my acct number that a bank would never give out to a 3rd party unless it's court ordered - which I confirmed was not). The legal methods to obtain acct numbers is thru discovery or subpeona, which neither was filed with the court.

Whether I showed up to the hearing or not, is not the relevant part, it's the fact that acct info was released without the proper court filings or notification. Further, what's even more disturbing about this is that the Judge actually approved the Levy without having the firm disclose how they obtained my personal acct information.

[debtcollector`]

Originally Posted by cszokeable

My arguement is 2 fold: (1) the ER Doc already rec'd his contracted payment thru my insurance company, and should not be charging me; and, (2) his firm used illegal tactics to obtain personal banking information (such as my acct number that a bank would never give out to a 3rd party unless it's court ordered - which I confirmed was not). The legal methods to obtain acct numbers is thru discovery or subpeona, which neither was filed with the court.

Whether I showed up to the hearing or not, is not the relevant part, it's the fact that acct info was released without the proper court filings or notification. Further, what's even more disturbing about this is that the Judge actually approved the Levy without having the firm disclose how they obtained my personal acct information.

It is time for you to start taking responsibility for your actions or failure of your actions.

1. Your name is on the account - it is your account. They took their money from your account and you screwed your son.

2. You ignored the court when you had an opportunity to argue the merits of your case; therefore you lost right to be heard. You lost. Period, end of story.

3. Gathering information is what collectors and judgment enforcers do. And we do it well. And before you get sued again, I would stop accusing the law firm of acting illegally.

4. Your attitude and ignorance is the reason you are in the situation you are in. Fortunately for you, both are curable.

DC

[dfromnyli]

Ugh dude, you REALLLLY can't ignore things like this. I almost feel bad for you but you really got what you had coming to you.

[cszokeable]

Listen up, if my question would have been about life's lessons, I would have consulted with my mother and not taken it to a public forum. I asked for professional legal advice and not your personal comments, opinions, or judgments regarding the matter. Second, this post was meant to be answered by licensed professionals who actually obtained their law degree and passed the bar exam and not by a bunch of "Al Bundies" sitting on the sofa scratching their balls wondering why they are stuck in such a mindless dead end job. I hope that one day when you ask for help the same courtesy is extended onto you**************and oh that day will come b/c everyone eventually needs help.

By the way, I am far from being ignorant, you backward hick!

Originally Posted by debtcollector`

It is time for you to start taking responsibility for your actions or failure of your actions.

1. Your name is on the account - it is your account. They took their money from your account and you screwed your son.

2. You ignored the court when you had an opportunity to argue the merits of your case; therefore you lost right to be heard. You lost. Period, end of story.

3. Gathering information is what collectors and judgment enforcers do. And we do it well. And before you get sued again, I would stop accusing the law firm of acting illegally.

4. Your attitude and ignorance is the reason you are in the situation you are in. Fortunately for you, both are curable.

DC

[JETX]

Originally Posted by cszokeable

(1) the ER Doc already rec'd his contracted payment thru my insurance company, and should not be charging me

Not true. People often misunderstand what insurance is for. It is NOT necessarily a 'paid in full' deal. YOU are liable for every bill you receive. You have 'hired' (by paying premiums) for a third party (insurance company) to pay SOMETHING on the bill. This could be payment in full or partial payment. Depends entirely on YOUR policy coverage.
Now, it may be that your insurance coverage paid PART of the bill and you are liable for the rest. It is also just as likely that you are confusing the 'doctor bill' for the entire bill. A visit to a hospital usually gets you SEVERAL bills. From the doctor, from the hospital, from ER services, from an outside radiologist, etc.
You would have to review the ENTIRE bill... and where it came from.

(2) his firm used illegal tactics to obtain personal banking information (such as my acct number that a bank would never give out to a 3rd party unless it's court ordered - which I confirmed was not). The legal methods to obtain acct numbers is thru discovery or subpeona, which neither was filed with the court.

Sorry, but also not true. There are LOTS of perfectly legal methods for a judgment creditor to obtain your bank information that do NOT involve subpoena or post-judgment discovery.

There are LOTS of perfectly legal methods for me to obtain your bank information. Some are:
1) Depending on the local laws, I could 'dumpster dive' on your trash and find your bank statement.
2) ChexSystems. I can find out where you have opened, or attempted to open a checking account.
3) The check printer firms themselves.
4) Depending on where you live, I could even send an 'information subpoena' to the local banks around you and you won't know it.
5) Google 'bank account locates' and you will get LOTS of suggestions and firms offering services.

Bottom line....
You have a judgment against you. The time to have challenged their rights to pursue (your question 1) was at the hearing.
Your attempting to 'side-step' your obligation to pay a valid judgment by somehow claiming that they obtained your bank information improperly simply doesn't 'hold water'.

[annajosie]

Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 4

Listen up, if my question would have been about life's lessons, I would have consulted with my mother and not taken it to a public forum. I asked for professional legal advice and not your personal comments, opinions, or judgments regarding the matter. Second, this post was meant to be answered by licensed professionals who actually obtained their law degree and passed the bar exam and not by a bunch of "Al Bundies" sitting on the sofa scratching their balls wondering why they are stuck in such a mindless dead end job. I hope that one day when you ask for help the same courtesy is extended onto you**************and oh that day will come b/c everyone eventually needs help.

By the way, I am far from being ignorant, you backward hick!


I have this mental image of a babbling bunch of Al Bundies sitting on a sofa scratching their balls lol lol lol

thanks, I needed a good laugh today!!!!

[debtcollector`]

Originally Posted by cszokeable

Listen up, if my question would have been about life's lessons, I would have consulted with my mother and not taken it to a public forum.

Perhaps that isn't a good idea, she obviously failed you already.

Originally Posted by cszokeable

By the way, I am far from being ignorant, you backward hick!

Isn't that pretty much what we would expect an ignorant person to say? I mean, really, how many ignorant people stand up and waive it like a flag? Other than you, of course.

DC

[Country Living]

I think his mother would be embarrassed that he ignores his financial obligations. I also suspect she would be appalled he was claiming the money belonged to a five year old in order to hide it from creditors.

Hick? I haven't been called a hick in a long time. Ah, thanks....I guess I'll just sit on the sofa and scratch something.

All that edumacation - edukation - edication - whatever - made me use too many big words for a backwards hick.

[cszokeable]

Thank you for your detailed and non biased response JETX. I will research your suggested websites and take it from there.

Originally Posted by JETX

Not true. People often misunderstand what insurance is for. It is NOT necessarily a 'paid in full' deal. YOU are liable for every bill you receive. You have 'hired' (by paying premiums) for a third party (insurance company) to pay SOMETHING on the bill. This could be payment in full or partial payment. Depends entirely on YOUR policy coverage.
Now, it may be that your insurance coverage paid PART of the bill and you are liable for the rest. It is also just as likely that you are confusing the 'doctor bill' for the entire bill. A visit to a hospital usually gets you SEVERAL bills. From the doctor, from the hospital, from ER services, from an outside radiologist, etc.
You would have to review the ENTIRE bill... and where it came from.


Sorry, but also not true. There are LOTS of perfectly legal methods for a judgment creditor to obtain your bank information that do NOT involve subpoena or post-judgment discovery.

There are LOTS of perfectly legal methods for me to obtain your bank information. Some are:
1) Depending on the local laws, I could 'dumpster dive' on your trash and find your bank statement.
2) ChexSystems. I can find out where you have opened, or attempted to open a checking account.
3) The check printer firms themselves.
4) Depending on where you live, I could even send an 'information subpoena' to the local banks around you and you won't know it.
5) Google 'bank account locates' and you will get LOTS of suggestions and firms offering services.

Bottom line....
You have a judgment against you. The time to have challenged their rights to pursue (your question 1) was at the hearing.
Your attempting to 'side-step' your obligation to pay a valid judgment by somehow claiming that they obtained your bank information improperly simply doesn't 'hold water'.