Old debt collection (time barred?) questions

[NeedtoBreathe]

What is the name of your state? North Dakota, but I obtained the credit cards when I lived in Minnesota.

I have several outstanding credit card debts that have been in collection for a number of years. I obtained the cards in Minnesota and have since lived in North Dakota for 6 years, then Kansas for a year, and now I'm back in North Dakota. I continue to get collection calls and letters from new debt collectors who apparently have purchased the debt from the old debt collectors (who purchased it from the credit card companies).

I'm not sure how this "time barred" debt issue works and I have a number of questions.

1) Do I rely on the statute of limitations for debt collections in MN, where I lived when I obtained the credit cards, or do I rely on ND, where I currently live?

2) Does moving to different states reset the statute of limitations (for example, do I have to live in the same state for X years for the statute of limitations to count)?

3) How do I find out what the relevant statute of limitations is?

4) If the debt is time barred, I've read that they can still attempt to collect it even after you've told them you dispute the debt. Is that true, and what can they do to collect it? Do those collection attempts impact your credit rating or does it start to improve after you've denied the validity of those debts using the time-barred defense?

5) Let's say there is a 7 year statute of limitations on collection of a debt in my state before it becomes time-barred. When does that 7 years begin? At the time I first owed it? At the time it went to collections? How do I find out when the "clock began ticking," so to speak? What do I look for on my credit report to tell me the start date?

Thanks for answering any/all of my questions. This is a confusing area and I don't want to accidentally restart any statutes of limitations. Plus, I want to start improving my credit score right away.

 

[NeedtoBreathe]

I'm still hoping that someone has some knowledge in this area and can help me out. Thanks in advance.

 

[TigerD]

There is no such thing as time-barred. Why don't you put your effort into paying your debt.

DC

 

[Debt Guy]

C'mon DC. Don't be so hard on the guy.

I'm not sure how this "time barred" debt issue works and I have a number of questions.


You are using the term wrong. That is what DC is referring to. Time-barred or an expired statute of limitations is merely an affirmative defense against a lawsuit. You will always owe the debt.

1) Do I rely on the statute of limitations for debt collections in MN, where I lived when I obtained the credit cards, or do I rely on ND, where I currently live?

Now you are making it complicated. The FDCPA says you may be sued either in the judicial district in which you live or the judicial district in which you signed the contract. Further, some contract agreements provide for jurisdiction in a third state -- typically one very creditor friendly.

2) Does moving to different states reset the statute of limitations (for example, do I have to live in the same state for X years for the statute of limitations to count)?


Big time complication. The SOL does not reset, it tolls. Tolling means the clock stops running but will start running again when you go back to that state. If that is not confusing enough, some states have "borrowing statutes" that borrows the SOL from the other state. You are going to have to read the statutes of three or four different states to figure out what you got.

As best I can guess from what you said, your SOL is tolled in MN, expired in ND, not applicable in KS. In my opinion, you could be sued in MN and then have the judgment domesticated in ND and consequently nailed with a judgment and ensuing garnishment.

3) How do I find out what the relevant statute of limitations is?

The source I trust is here:

http://www.1-collection-attorney.com/

But even then, there is no promise the information is accurate and reliable.

4) If the debt is time barred, I've read that they can still attempt to collect it even after you've told them you dispute the debt. Is that true, and what can they do to collect it? Do those collection attempts impact your credit rating or does it start to improve after you've denied the validity of those debts using the time-barred defense?

Part 1 -- yes. Part 2 -- anything not barred by the FDCPA. Part 3 -- depends on FCRA.

Translation -- they can sue. They can call you until you exercise your cease and desist rights under FDCPA. Disputing a debt may or may not halt collection activity depending on the "timeliness" of your dispute -- which I expect yours is not timely. Under FCRA, negative items may not be reported for longer than seven and 1/2 years after the date of first default.

5) Let's say there is a 7 year statute of limitations on collection of a debt in my state before it becomes time-barred. When does that 7 years begin? At the time I first owed it? At the time it went to collections? How do I find out when the "clock began ticking," so to speak? What do I look for on my credit report to tell me the start date?

The clock starts running from the date of first default -- which is generally 30 days after the last payment made on the account. Your credit report may or may not tell you the DOFD -- usually not. In which case you may have to call the CRA and ask.


Now, all this is highly technical. You should go to FTC.GOV and read the FDCPA and the FCRA.

DC and I share many common beliefs. The one where we tend to disagree is the statute of limitations. I believe those laws exist for a reason. That reason is to ensure that legal actions are brought in a timely fashion. It causes me no pain to see a consumer utilize an OOS defense. So, I have answered those questions for you.

However, it think it is morally and ethically corrupt to use debt verification/validation as a tool to obfuscate and avoid payment of a debt that you owe.

By your own admission, you know you owe this money. It is way bad karma to look for loopholes to avoid doing the right thing. Go read Romans 13:8.

On that, DC and I are in full agreement. I just take more words to say it.

 

[TigerD]

DC and I share many common beliefs. The one where we tend to disagree is the statute of limitations. I believe those laws exist for a reason. That reason is to ensure that legal actions are brought in a timely fashion. It causes me no pain to see a consumer utilize an OOS defense. So, I have answered those questions for you.

I have no problem with raising the defense in court either. It is a valid defense. I do have a problem with the people, and we get them here quite frequently, that think because they managed to evade paying their debts for 3-4-5 years, that those debts are non-existant anymore. Or that they have no responsibility to pay them -- but then we are getting into the moral discussion, which I will avoid.



My final thought for the OP: SOL is an affirmative defense, which means you don't get to raise it until you are sued. I am a firm believer in the power of honest negotiation in resolving most issues and every debt related issue. Communication is key. Just try to be aware of what it is that you are communicating.

 

[Sarchon Fosberg]

time barred defense - when does the clock starts ticking

My friend is permanently disabled in Minnesota. He has Parkinson's disease and degenerative disc disease (he has a morphine pump in his back) and suffers from depression and anxiety. His only income is SSA and he has no 401k, no pension, and no savings. He surrendered his driver's license and has no car or any other assets to sell.

He has a consumer credit card debt that he cannot repay. It doesn't matter what "the right thing to do" is -- he cannot afford to hire a lawyer or file for bankruptcy because his SSA is "just enough" to prevent him from gettign public legal assistance. So if you could set aside your moral indignation for a moment, I have a couple of questions.

After the account went into default in 2009, a collection agency contacted him in 2009, and he set up a plan to repay the debt at $100 per month. When his wife divorced him in 2012, he stopped repaying the debt and the account went into default again.

He is being sued for this debt. I believe the statute of limitations in Minnesota is six years. Question 1: At what point can he use the time-barred defense? Did the statute of limitations start in 2009 or 2012?

Personally, I think he should go to court and let the plaintiffs get a judgement against him because they can't garnish SSA and he has no assets so if the case is decided with prejudice that's the end of it. But he is terrified that if he appears in court without a lawyer he will have an anxiety attack and faint.

Second question: in January, they got a court date in May 2015 but three weeks later the plaintiff sent a letter for my friend to sign accepting a dismissal without prejudice. The plaintiff didn't sign it. Why bother setting a court date only to ask for a dismissal three weeks later? I know what "without prejudice" means -- why would the plaintiff want to postpone going to court? Is it possible that the plaintiff will just discard the letter my friend signed and keep the court date, hoping that my friend doesn't appear in court? Is this some kind of trick?

Thanks!

 

[Zigner]

This thread is from 2008. Please don't necropost. Please start your own thread. Thank you for your understanding.

My friend is permanently disabled in Minnesota. He has Parkinson's disease and degenerative disc disease (he has a morphine pump in his back) and suffers from depression and anxiety. His only income is SSA and he has no 401k, no pension, and no savings. He surrendered his driver's license and has no car or any other assets to sell.

He has a consumer credit card debt that he cannot repay. It doesn't matter what "the right thing to do" is -- he cannot afford to hire a lawyer or file for bankruptcy because his SSA is "just enough" to prevent him from gettign public legal assistance. So if you could set aside your moral indignation for a moment, I have a couple of questions.

After the account went into default in 2009, a collection agency contacted him in 2009, and he set up a plan to repay the debt at $100 per month. When his wife divorced him in 2012, he stopped repaying the debt and the account went into default again.

He is being sued for this debt. I believe the statute of limitations in Minnesota is six years. Question 1: At what point can he use the time-barred defense? Did the statute of limitations start in 2009 or 2012?

Personally, I think he should go to court and let the plaintiffs get a judgement against him because they can't garnish SSA and he has no assets so if the case is decided with prejudice that's the end of it. But he is terrified that if he appears in court without a lawyer he will have an anxiety attack and faint.

Second question: in January, they got a court date in May 2015 but three weeks later the plaintiff sent a letter for my friend to sign accepting a dismissal without prejudice. The plaintiff didn't sign it. Why bother setting a court date only to ask for a dismissal three weeks later? I know what "without prejudice" means -- why would the plaintiff want to postpone going to court? Is it possible that the plaintiff will just discard the letter my friend signed and keep the court date, hoping that my friend doesn't appear in court? Is this some kind of trick?

Thanks!

 

[Proserpina]

My friend is permanently disabled in Minnesota. He has Parkinson's disease and degenerative disc disease (he has a morphine pump in his back) and suffers from depression and anxiety. His only income is SSA and he has no 401k, no pension, and no savings. He surrendered his driver's license and has no car or any other assets to sell.

He has a consumer credit card debt that he cannot repay. It doesn't matter what "the right thing to do" is -- he cannot afford to hire a lawyer or file for bankruptcy because his SSA is "just enough" to prevent him from gettign public legal assistance. So if you could set aside your moral indignation for a moment, I have a couple of questions.

After the account went into default in 2009, a collection agency contacted him in 2009, and he set up a plan to repay the debt at $100 per month. When his wife divorced him in 2012, he stopped repaying the debt and the account went into default again.

He is being sued for this debt. I believe the statute of limitations in Minnesota is six years. Question 1: At what point can he use the time-barred defense? Did the statute of limitations start in 2009 or 2012?

Personally, I think he should go to court and let the plaintiffs get a judgement against him because they can't garnish SSA and he has no assets so if the case is decided with prejudice that's the end of it. But he is terrified that if he appears in court without a lawyer he will have an anxiety attack and faint.

Second question: in January, they got a court date in May 2015 but three weeks later the plaintiff sent a letter for my friend to sign accepting a dismissal without prejudice. The plaintiff didn't sign it. Why bother setting a court date only to ask for a dismissal three weeks later? I know what "without prejudice" means -- why would the plaintiff want to postpone going to court? Is it possible that the plaintiff will just discard the letter my friend signed and keep the court date, hoping that my friend doesn't appear in court? Is this some kind of trick?

Thanks!

Please start your own thread