What do I do if collections agency breaks laws on a defaulted loan?

[skyfire322]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

Loan is from NYS five years ago
Just moved to Virginia


My loan was sent into default back in October of 2012. Starting in November, a third party collections agency (the infamous Performant Recovery Inc., aka Diversified Collection Services) started to contact me. They were calling me two to three times a day from six different phone numbers never leaving messages. I attempted to call them back multiple times, leaving many messages, and in early December, I finally got through to them.

They asked for three references including phone numbers and addresses, my SS#, my place of employment, what my salary was, which bank I used, and how much was in my account. Since this was my very first time speaking to a collections agency, I gave them all of my information. After that, she stated that I had a defaulted loan, and that I would have to make a payment (and WOULD NOT NEGOTIATE) before December 26th in order for me to be approved for the debt rehabilitation program. I told her that I was unemployed at the time, so I would not be able to make any payment. She then told me verbatim "Borrow money from someone. You need to pay this." She then stated that if I didn't make that payment, they would begin to garnish my wages and taxes. After that, there was no communication.

She then started calling me back on January 2nd, and stated the same exact thing. If I didn't make that initial payment, they would garnish wages, and asked if I knew anybody who could loan me the money. I told her that I'd see what I could do, but didn't make any promises. They have sent non-certified, non-registered advisory letters stating the same thing she has repeated, but it has the claimant, original creditor, account number, and balance. On the back, it states that if I do not respond within 30 days to dispute the debt, the collector would assume that the debt is valid, and that if I do respond disputing, they would give me the name and address of the original creditor.

After doing some research, I have noticed that they have broken laws under the FDCPA, including repeated/harassing phone calls, calling at inconvenient times, and threatening to garnish my wages. I have also noticed that I can send them a Cease & Desist letter, but if they do receive it, they have the right to sue. I am also worried that if I send a dispute letter, they will say that I admitted on the phone by saying "I'll try to make a payment." also, I have checked my credit report, and the loan IS on there.

What should I do? I do know that the loan won't go away, but I do not trust giving money (that I don't have at the moment) to a collections agency that is breaking the law.


**PLEASE DO NOT LEAVE COMMENTS ABOUT HOW I AM BEING LAZY, AND JUST DON'T WANT TO PAY. I NEED ACTUAL ADVICE ON THIS MATTER. Thank you!**

 

[sandyclaus]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?

Loan is from NYS five years ago
Just moved to Virginia


My loan was sent into default back in October of 2012. Starting in November, a third party collections agency (the infamous Performant Recovery Inc., aka Diversified Collection Services) started to contact me. They were calling me two to three times a day from six different phone numbers never leaving messages. I attempted to call them back multiple times, leaving many messages, and in early December, I finally got through to them.

They asked for three references including phone numbers and addresses, my SS#, my place of employment, what my salary was, which bank I used, and how much was in my account. Since this was my very first time speaking to a collections agency, I gave them all of my information. After that, she stated that I had a defaulted loan, and that I would have to make a payment (and WOULD NOT NEGOTIATE) before December 26th in order for me to be approved for the debt rehabilitation program. I told her that I was unemployed at the time, so I would not be able to make any payment. She then told me verbatim "Borrow money from someone. You need to pay this." She then stated that if I didn't make that payment, they would begin to garnish my wages and taxes. After that, there was no communication.

She then started calling me back on January 2nd, and stated the same exact thing. If I didn't make that initial payment, they would garnish wages, and asked if I knew anybody who could loan me the money. I told her that I'd see what I could do, but didn't make any promises. They have sent non-certified, non-registered advisory letters stating the same thing she has repeated, but it has the claimant, original creditor, account number, and balance. On the back, it states that if I do not respond within 30 days to dispute the debt, the collector would assume that the debt is valid, and that if I do respond disputing, they would give me the name and address of the original creditor.

After doing some research, I have noticed that they have broken laws under the FDCPA, including repeated/harassing phone calls, calling at inconvenient times, and threatening to garnish my wages. I have also noticed that I can send them a Cease & Desist letter, but if they do receive it, they have the right to sue. I am also worried that if I send a dispute letter, they will say that I admitted on the phone by saying "I'll try to make a payment." also, I have checked my credit report, and the loan IS on there.

What should I do? I do know that the loan won't go away, but I do not trust giving money (that I don't have at the moment) to a collections agency that is breaking the law.


**PLEASE DO NOT LEAVE COMMENTS ABOUT HOW I AM BEING LAZY, AND JUST DON'T WANT TO PAY. I NEED ACTUAL ADVICE ON THIS MATTER. Thank you!**

I'm sorry, but I simply do not see how what they were doing was illegal in any way.

These people are working to collect a debt that you owe. The information they seek is intended to assist them in that goal. They are not required to be nice to you or to call at times YOU consider convenient. They are not threatening you in any way, they are simply informing you of what their next step could be in order to further their agenda.

FYI, that next step for them will require them to file a lawsuit against you in order to seek a judgment in the amount of the debt you owe. If it gets to that point, you'll ALSO owe for court costs and legal fees. Once a judgment is obtained against you, the debt is officially and legally confirmed, which gives your debtor the right to start collecting the money from you in ways you'll find even MORE inconvenient - including wage garnishments, levying your bank accounts, placing liens on any substantial assets including real estate and vehicles.

Instead of getting all uppity about someone doing their job to get money from you that you rightly owe, I suggest that you beg, borrow or steal (not really steal, but you get the point), or start selling off assets in order to pay off this debt. That judgment will end up on your credit report for years to come, and your debtor will have many more years to collect it from you.

 

[skyfire322]

Laws broken:
FDCPA considers repeat calls as harassment. [15 USC 1692d] § 806(5)

Calls at these times are considered harassment. [15 USC 1692c] § 805(a)(1)

Collectors can't threaten to sue or file charges against you, garnish wages, take property, cause job loss, or ruin your credit when the collector cannot or does not intend to take the action. [15 USC 1692e] § 807(5)

A collector is not allowed to contact you at work if you’ve let them know your employer doesn’t approve of these calls. [15 USC 1692c] § 805(a)(3)

 

[sandyclaus]

Laws broken:
FDCPA considers repeat calls as harassment. [15 USC 1692d] § 806(5)

They are allowed to call you more than once. They are allowed to make ONE contact per day, but they can keep calling as long as they do not make contact or leave a message. You have proof that they have done this, right?

Calls at these times are considered harassment. [15 USC 1692c] § 805(a)(1)

"These times" are any day, anytime before 8:00am and after 9:00pm local time. Are you claiming that they are calling outside of these hours? You have proof of this?

Collectors can't threaten to sue or file charges against you, garnish wages, take property, cause job loss, or ruin your credit when the collector cannot or does not intend to take the action. [15 USC 1692e] § 807(5)

Note the emphasized section. ONLY if they don't intend to follow through with the legal actions. You don't know whether or not they intend to because it hasn't gotten that far. You can only claim the have violated this section IF and WHEN they do not proceed with suing you and obtaining a garnishment order against you.

A collector is not allowed to contact you at work if you’ve let them know your employer doesn’t approve of these calls. [15 USC 1692c] § 805(a)(3)

You never said anything about them calling you at work. If they have done so, they must stop only if you have informed them not to call because your employer does not allow them. You have proof, of course, that your employer disallows such calls and that the creditor has continued to make them, right?

Honestly, it sounds like you are making claims that these creditors are committing these violations without anything to back it up. Just your word, that of a deadbeat who refuses to pay or negotiate like an adult, isn't going to cut it.

 

[Bosco]

"These times" are any day, anytime before 8:00am and after 9:00pm local time. Are you claiming that they are calling outside of these hours? You have proof of this?

That's not correct.

(1) at any unusual time or place or a time or place known or which should be known to be inconvenient to the consumer. In the absence of knowledge of circumstances to the contrary, a debt collector shall assume that the convenient time for communicating with a consumer is after 8 o'clock antimeridian and before 9 o'clock postmeridian, local time at the consumer's location;

They are only allowed to assume that the 8am-9pm window is convenient unless you tell them otherwise. If you do that and they continue to call, it's a violation.

It sounds to me like they may have committed the "overshadowing" violation, but we'd need more info to be sure, and the OP would need to have some proof to go along with it.

Virginia is a one party state, so I'd suggest the OP start recording and saving these calls. If you have a debt collector on the phone, it's a question of when and not if they will violate the law.

 

[swalsh411]

$10 says the OP never comes back because he's not getting the advice he wanted to hear.

 

[justalayman]

I see various violations. The thing is; OP can sue the collector if they wish. They can file a complaint with the FTC.

after all of that, they still owe the bill. If OP doesn't want to deal with this CA, they need to research to determine if this CA owns the debt or is merely hired to collect on it. If the latter, then OP can send money to the original creditor. If the former, OP can either choose to deal with the CA or send a cease and desist letter and see what happens from there.


btw: making multiple calls without leaving information is a violation as it is considered to be harassing actions which are forbidden. The threats to garnish are illegal if there is no intention to follow through with the threat.

I do wonder about the OP though since this is one of the complaints:

collector is not allowed to contact you at work if you’ve let them know your employer doesn’t approve of these calls. [15 USC 1692c] § 805(a)(3)

considering the fact OP said they are unemployed, I am wondering just how the CA was able to make such a call.

as to the inconvenient times: OP never said anything about when the calls were made. Maybe it was outside the range of allowed times, maybe not.

 

[Michaelcostagan]

skyfire

Its really very nice when we get such a great platform to discuss our problems and get a lot of suggestions from people and it definitely helps us overcome our problems , skyfire I hope you would have decided the right thing.

 

[TigerD]

btw: making multiple calls without leaving information is a violation as it is considered to be harassing actions which are forbidden.

Actually that is wrong. Leaving messages on machines is extremely risky for collection agencies in the post-Foti world. When collectors leave messages for consumers they must include the name of the company and the mini-Miranda warning. This exposes them to disclosure to a third party.

A collection agency should never leave a message until the Court or Congress sorts out the Foti issues. There was something pending on it last year, but I am in the second year bubble and haven't followed the progress of Frank's bill or the SC case.

DC

 

[skyfire322]

after all of that, they still owe the bill. If OP doesn't want to deal with this CA, they need to research to determine if this CA owns the debt or is merely hired to collect on it. If the latter, then OP can send money to the original creditor. If the former, OP can either choose to deal with the CA or send a cease and desist letter and see what happens from there.

Thank you. That's pretty much all I wanted to know. I will be starting payments on the debt at the end of this month, so I guess I should call the original creditor and find everything out.