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social security and divorce

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zmccabe

Junior Member
My parents lived and were married in Washington for 20 years.
When they divorced my mom says she signed away her rights to my dad's retirement, and social security.
Is that even possible or legal?
Doesn't she have protected rights to her share of his social security for staying at home and raising me and my sister?
Anyway, she is in her mid-50's and my dad is disabled and in his late 50's so I thought we should find out for sure since my dad could be collecting his SS soon.
Looking forward to a reply,
Zia
 


nextwife

Senior Member
It's entirely possible she took some other assets comparable to the then value of dad's retirement plan at the time, in lieu.

If she has NOT remarried, she does have seperate benefits from SS available to her on her ex's work credits.

If you are divorced after at least 10 years of marriage, you can collect retirement benefits on your former spouse's Social Security record if you are at least age 62 and if your former spouse is entitled to or receiving benefits. If you remarry, you generally cannot collect benefits on your former spouse's record unless your later marriage ends (whether by death, divorce, or annulment).

http://www.ssa.gov/gethelp1.htm


And of course, whatever she herself acquired into her own retirement plan before or after she took time off for kids is hers.
 
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zmccabe

Junior Member
so I saw the divorce papers....

and in line 11 it states that she is signing away her rights to..."any and all pension, retirement, 401(k), KEOGH, IRA, Thrift Savings, ESOP, and/or SS benefits accruing to him through his employment."
So even though she signed this will she still be able to collect my dad's SS?
She really got the short end of the stick in the divorce and I would be really relieved to find out she still has rights to his SS even though she signed that paper.
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
and in line 11 it states that she is signing away her rights to..."any and all pension, retirement, 401(k), KEOGH, IRA, Thrift Savings, ESOP, and/or SS benefits accruing to him through his employment."
So even though she signed this will she still be able to collect my dad's SS?
She really got the short end of the stick in the divorce and I would be really relieved to find out she still has rights to his SS even though she signed that paper.
Yes, she will still be able to collect SS based on his earnings record. One thing that is important to understand is that if she collects on his earnings record, it will NOT reduce HIS SS benefits. Its a separate entitlement, of her own.
 

nextwife

Senior Member
and in line 11 it states that she is signing away her rights to..."any and all pension, retirement, 401(k), KEOGH, IRA, Thrift Savings, ESOP, and/or SS benefits accruing to him through his employment."
So even though she signed this will she still be able to collect my dad's SS?
She really got the short end of the stick in the divorce and I would be really relieved to find out she still has rights to his SS even though she signed that paper.

Without reviewing the ENTIRE property settlement, you can't know if she got the short end of the stick. She may have ended up with a comparable or greater share of some other marital asset instead. Remember, she would only have been entitled to a split of dad's retirement that accrued DURING the marriage. not this total current retirement account. Did she perhaps retain the marital residence? Might dad have, among other things, given up his share of the house in exchange for her share of the then balance of his retirement?
 

Bali Hai

Senior Member
Without reviewing the ENTIRE property settlement, you can't know if she got the short end of the stick. She may have ended up with a comparable or greater share of some other marital asset instead. Remember, she would only have been entitled to a split of dad's retirement that accrued DURING the marriage. not this total current retirement account. Did she perhaps retain the marital residence? Might dad have, among other things, given up his share of the house in exchange for her share of the then balance of his retirement?
Keep in mind that many woman think they got the short end of the stick after the divorce because the husband isn't homeless and living under a bridge somewhere.
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
Keep in mind that many woman think they got the short end of the stick after the divorce because the husband isn't homeless and living under a bridge somewhere.
However in this case its the woman's adult child who has concerns about his/her mother.
 

nextwife

Senior Member
However in this case its the woman's adult child who has concerns about his/her mother.

True, but "50's" is our age - and not exactly elderly. A fifty five year old still, easilly, has another seven to ten years of working time left. And there are tax laws in place for us post 50-Boomers to make excess catchup contributions.

If the adult child is not informed about the entirety of the divorce agreement, then they are not in a position to judge if a single aspect of property division is "fair" or not. As we know, the divorce decree is comprised of multiple agreements and splits, assumptions of debt and so on. Could be Dad take took mom's share of marital debt (or something else) equal to the share of retirement she gave up. We just DON'T know.

Poster, how many years has Mom been divorced?
 
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LdiJ

Senior Member
True, but "50's" is our age - and not exactly elderly. A fifty five year old still, easilly, has another seven to ten years of working time left. And there are tax laws in place for us post 50-Boomers to make excess catchup contributions.

If the adult child is not informed about the entirety of the divorce agreement, then they are not in a position to judge if a single aspect of property division is "fair" or not. As we know, the divorce decree is comprised of multiple agreements and splits, assumptions of debt and so on. Could be Dad take took mom's share of marital debt (or something else) equal to the share of retirement she gave up. We just DON'T know.

Poster, how many years has Mom been divorced?
I was just making the point to Bali that if an adult child is concerned about one of their parents, that its not impossible that something unfair happened.

Most adult children are going to be fairly "neutral" on divorce issues that involve both of their parents, so I generally tend to respect an adult child who is concerned about one of their parents.

However the particular issue here was SS retirement benefits, and the orders are irrelevant for that.
 

Bali Hai

Senior Member
I was just making the point to Bali that if an adult child is concerned about one of their parents, that its not impossible that something unfair happened.
Most adult children are going to be fairly "neutral" on divorce issues that involve both of their parents, so I generally tend to respect an adult child who is concerned about one of their parents.

However the particular issue here was SS retirement benefits, and the orders are irrelevant for that.
I'm sure everything was "legally fair".
 

nextwife

Senior Member
I was just making the point to Bali that if an adult child is concerned about one of their parents, that its not impossible that something unfair happened.

Most adult children are going to be fairly "neutral" on divorce issues that involve both of their parents, so I generally tend to respect an adult child who is concerned about one of their parents.

However the particular issue here was SS retirement benefits, and the orders are irrelevant for that.

If the adult child doesn't know the entire negotiations, who assumed what debt, what dad agreed to give up or pay for, what each BROUGHT to the marriage, and so on, they are not really in any position to judge "fairness" of one aspect of a much larger overall agreement.

I see this in Real Estate. Sometimes a neighbor will look ONLY at the "sale price" of a neighbor's home, without also considering condition, seller credits to buyer, inclusions, exclusions, whether the buyer had no continguencies, etc. and try to make a judgement of their own homes value, or that the neighbor sold too high or low. But a sales agreement, like a divorce agreement, is comprised of multiple give and take, and can't be judged on just a single aspect, but must be judged on the "package" of agreements.
 

Silverplum

Senior Member
Adults other than the parties to a divorce seem to be the most judgmental of who got shafted and what was fair or unfair.
I like the "seem" part of your sentence (and happen to agree, IMHO) :) ...and I don't like absolutes thrown out there as facts. :rolleyes:
 

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