Possession of Alcohol by a Minor in Kentucky. Accept guilt but want to protect record

[l4t13]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Kentucky, Fayette County

I have received a citation for Possession of Alcohol by a Minor in Fayette County, Kentucky. I am fully ready to mail in the fine (174.89) and be done with it. I understand mailing in the fine is an admission of guilt. The issuing officer was really friendly and said we should not worry about the citations because they were less severe than a speeding ticket since we didn't even have to get our insurance involved and no classes to attend. He also stated this would not go on our permanent record if we mailed it in. His exact words were: "if you mail it in on time, you will never hear about it again." I just wanted to confirm this was correct because when I called in to get the price the clerk stated it would go on our record unless you came to court and pleaded guilty and paid the fine in court. She said if we came to court it would not go on the record, even with a guilty plea. I am going to call back in a day or two and ask again and see if maybe the clerk made a mistake. I want to believe the officer over the clerk but I also want to be sure. I am guilty and accept that fact, I just can't have a record. Thank you so much.

[ProSePA]

When it comes down to legal matters that affect you, your rights, and your reputation you should not trust the officer or the clerk at the court. First, the officer's job is to enforce the law and have the process move along smoothly. He/she is nice and friendly to you because then you will feel like you had a positive experience, plead guilty, pay your fine and then that is it. The clerk at the court (and there is usually a sign there that will say this) is not an attorney and can not provide you with legal advice. The only person that will look out for your interests are: 1.) yourself, or 2.) an attorney. So far the persons that you have had contact with work for the state, and the state wants you to pay your fine and conclude the matter. You have no obligation to plead guilty to the charge. I am confident in saying that this will be on your record. If it is a Non Traffic Citation, which is most likely, then it will be a Summary Offense and will likely not appear on a companies background check. But, it will still be on your record.

You have a legal right to plead not guilty, obtain counsel (or represent yourself) and require the state to prove that you committed the alleged offense. If you are found guilty at the District Justice level, you have the right to appeal to the next level court and have the state prove its case again. You can not be punished MORE severely because you chose to plead not guilty.

If everyone that was charged with a crime exercised their rights and pled not guilty, the court dockets would bust at the seams and change would be required. This is why it is in the state's best interest to make you feel warm and fuzzy and just plead guilty.

All that aside, if you post the statute that you were charged under I will post the actual wording and you can start with that.

[l4t13]

Thank you for your post. I just do not see a way to plead not guilty. It would come down to his word vs. my word. It is a non-traffic citation but was wrote on the standard traffic citation slip KY cops use. He left all of the vehicle information blank and at the bottom in comments wrote KRS 244.085(3) "Minors not to possess alcohol. Coors light beer"

The exact statue is KRS 244.085(3).

[ProSePA]

KRS § 244.085 - Minors not to possess or purchase liquor nor to misrepresent age -- Use of fraudulent identification -- Prohibition against minors remaining on premises where alcoholic beverages sold.

(3) A person under 21 years of age shall not possess for his or her own use or purchase or attempt to purchase or have another purchase for him or her any alcoholic beverages. No person shall aid or assist any person under 21 years of age in purchasing or having delivered or served to him or her any alcoholic beverages.

(9) A violation of subsection (2), (3), (4), (5), or (8) of this section shall be deemed a status offense if committed by a person under the age of eighteen (18) and shall be under the jurisdiction of the juvenile session of the District Court or the family division of the Circuit Court, as appropriate.

The intent of KRS 244.083 and subsection (2) of this section is to discourage the purchase and possession of alcoholic beverages by minors for their personal consumption.

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I am not familiar enough with Kentucky law to know exactly how a "status offense" is listed on a persons record. It sounds like it is considered equal to a moving violating under the vehicle code and thus would not appear most background checks. If you applied for a government job I am sure they could find it though.

The wording of the statute clearly states that you shall not possess for your personal use.. an alcoholic beverage. Plead not guilty and make the state prove that the beverage was for your personal use. Did you tell the cop you drank from the can? Did the copy witness you drink from the can? is there evidence to show that the can was indeed for your personal use? The state needs to prove that you violated the wording of that statute. The chances of you winning are slim, but there is no additional monetary cost to making the state prove its burden. At the very least you get to learn how the court process works and then at least get something from the fine you will pay.

Experience brings with it knowledge and if you can gain that experience then why not plead not guilty and learn from it all. You can use that knowledge when you talk to your friends that may encounter the law. You can tell them that the system is really not that scary and prepare them for what they might encounter. You can come on this board and tell others who are in your situation what happened and what they can expect if they plead not guilty. You worked to earn that money, make the state work to earn it from you. A status offense is a great way to gain first hand experience, because you really don't have much to lose.

It sounds twisted, but you could plead not guilty, lose at the JP level, appeal that, lose again at the court level and in a sense consider yourself the winner. From doing all that you just learned A LOT, like how to dress for court, how a judge acts, what an officer is taking into consideration when he approaches a person, how a basic hearing works, how an appeal is filed, etc. Considering that law students pay tens of thousands of dollars to learn that info in a classroom, you just made out cause you only paid $178 for a real life experience. (Take that all as more of a philosophical statement rather then one in which I am saying you are on equal footing as a student attending Harvard Law)

[mgcarr01]

For first-time offenders (i.e. new UK students), Fayette County does have a diversion/community-service program that should enable you to keep the citation from being on "your record."

Advice: even if you take the diversion program, admit the citation, explain subsequent steps taken, and state what "you learned" on all future applications. Trying to hide citations on medical or law school applications is always worse than admitting the "mistake".

[dave33]

Personally, I would not consider saying you have never been convicted "hiding" something if you complete the program. The single biggest positive aspect of any type of diversion program is you can answer "no" and that is perfectly acceptable.goodluck.