on probation, pulled over questionable DUI? PA

[Bethy]

Daughter is 22. She was VERY lucky to just get 2 misdemenours on a separate case in May '08, but it included surrendering her licence for 6 mths starting mid August. Prior to surrendering it, she was pulled over at 1:20am going 98 in a 65 zone. When the police asked her to step out and gave her a breathalizer, it came up zero...twice. She is on meds for bi-polar and a personality disorder and admits she did have a glass of wine 2 hours earlier (and ate and showered since). He brought her to the hospital where they did a blood draw and it came back .082 The public defender said there's a chance she'll get off because of all the meds she's on (w/ the weakened wine) but deep down I'm hoping they send her to some rehab place (she does drink too much and shouldn't be drinking at all on her meds). She's hoping to get off w/ just a $300 speeding fine. I cringed when I read that report....I don't want anyone hurt due to her foolish immature actions/choices.

[FlyingRon]

At .08, she had more than a glass of wine, regardless of what meds she is on.
I doubt they'll send her anywhere, even if she is convicted of DUI and the reckless driving.
Unless she's incapacitated to the point of being committed, you can't force her to get help.

[BigMistakeFl]

I'm sorry to stray, but I can tell you what we did with our son of about the same age, who likewise drank way too much. We didn't make rehab optional, we forced it on him. He nearly died from drinking and was at the bottom. We said he either went that very day to rehab, (we already had it all lined up, with financial aid and our meetings with the rehab counselors completed) or he moved out immediately. Not the next day, not the next week..... immediately. He opted for the rehab and is alive today, thanks to that vital moment.

As Ron said, the medications didn't affect her blood alcohol content, so she, like our son, has been lying to you about her drinking. You see and are aware of only as much as she is willing for you to know. If she's like my boy, she's hiding a great deal more consumption which will not get any better if you don't act.

Good luck.

[CdwJava]

It is unlawful to drive impaired even on prescription medication.

She needs an attorney.

- Carl

[BL]

Isn't it part of her probation to NOT consume ANY alcoholic beverages ?

If not , it should be one of the requirements .

Perhaps her PO can set up rehab.

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by Bethy

Daughter is 22. She was VERY lucky to just get 2 misdemenours on a separate case in May '08, but it included surrendering her licence for 6 mths starting mid August. Prior to surrendering it, she was pulled over at 1:20am going 98 in a 65 zone. When the police asked her to step out and gave her a breathalizer, it came up zero...twice. She is on meds for bi-polar and a personality disorder and admits she did have a glass of wine 2 hours earlier (and ate and showered since). He brought her to the hospital where they did a blood draw and it came back .082 The public defender said there's a chance she'll get off because of all the meds she's on (w/ the weakened wine) but deep down I'm hoping they send her to some rehab place (she does drink too much and shouldn't be drinking at all on her meds). She's hoping to get off w/ just a $300 speeding fine. I cringed when I read that report....I don't want anyone hurt due to her foolish immature actions/choices.

Where is the "questionable" part?

[Bethy]

the questionable part was that after 2 zero breathalizers, why did they send her to the hospital for a bloodwork alcohol test?

In response to the previous "not a choice" rehab, my daughter did move out -- 2 years ago, under a "tough love" try. I started going to tough love a few years ago w/ her psychiatrists recommendation. I was divorced, w/ a younger son, and she fingered every "law" i made under that roof, and also 4 suicide attempts under her belt. I felt guilty and just wanted her to get better. I paid (out of pocket 180/visit) for the psych., meds., and she conned everyone. Last suicide attempt (earlier this year) she was court ordered 302'd and a full diagnosis (which was same as previous) was again made. She goes to school(over 4 yrs still trying for associates - many drops due to health) but is such a different girl before her sr. HS year change....can't seem to stop "grieving"

[seniorjudge]

Originally Posted by Bethy

...
the questionable part was that after 2 zero breathalizers, why did they send her to the hospital for a bloodwork alcohol test?
...

At the scene breath tests are not (and should not be) evidence; the blood draw is the evidence and it, being more accurate, shows she was drunk.

[FlyingRon]

Originally Posted by Bethy

the questionable part was that after 2 zero breathalizers, why did they send her to the hospital for a bloodwork alcohol test

As stated above, the portable breath test is only a screen. It's not legal evidence. If the subject is uncooperative it can be very difficult to get a useful reading.

[BigMistakeFl]

If the subject is uncooperative it can be very difficult to get a useful reading.

People, myself included, sometimes try to fool the breathalyzer by offering shallow or quickly drawn "blows". It's possible that the machine did not function properly, or it's also possible that she didn't cooperate fully enough to give an accurate reading. When this happens, blood draw is often the next course of action.

[Bethy]

I read the police report where the police said that she was cooperative w/ each of the things he asked her to do (got out of the car, produced info., breathalyzer). She had her preliminary yesterday and they are actually dropping the speeding charges (huh?) but are holding onto the DUI and she'll be going to court later this month.

Her probation officer said things do not look very good, but did not specify anything in regards to what she thinks her sentence may be if found guilty. I'm preparing myself to hear jail...it's telling my mom (her g'mother) who is very close in local and emotions that I'm worried about. Anyone have any ideas of how much she could be looking at? Her dad (we're divorced - he remarried) was recently diagnosed w/ lung cancer and hoped to take her to disney for Christmas....he has no idea what's going on though.

[CdwJava]

Originally Posted by Bethy

the questionable part was that after 2 zero breathalizers, why did they send her to the hospital for a bloodwork alcohol test?

Probably because they suspected impairment from drugs (medications). Drugs alone will result in a .000 BAC reading on a breath device. Many psych meds will result in impairment, and when taken in conjunction with other meds (or overdone) will have an exaggerated or "synergistic" impairing effect that each med - by itself - would not have.

If her reading from the blood came back at .082, then she either had a heck of a single glass of wine (i.e. most the bottle!), or, she lied to you about that one glass.

- Carl

[paguy88]

Originally Posted by CdwJava

Probably because they suspected impairment from drugs (medications). Drugs alone will result in a .000 BAC reading on a breath device. Many psych meds will result in impairment, and when taken in conjunction with other meds (or overdone) will have an exaggerated or "synergistic" impairing effect that each med - by itself - would not have.

If her reading from the blood came back at .082, then she either had a heck of a single glass of wine (i.e. most the bottle!), or, she lied to you about that one glass.

- Carl

Carl...

couriosity question...

lets say you are the contact officer at a check point (I did as a variation of this before but humor me)

I am next in line...

you ask have I been drinking anything tonight...

I respectfully say I do not wish to anwser any questions....

you smell or see nothing unusal...

you can ask me to get out of the car? can you?

and if so (if you would or can at that point with noting to suspect)

ask for a FST... I decline.... next the hand held devise? again I say no...

what do you do at that point?
or has the cop taking this what is supposed to be brief detainment stop too far...

[CdwJava]

Originally Posted by paguy88

lets say you are the contact officer at a check point (I did as a variation of this before but humor me)

I am next in line...

you ask have I been drinking anything tonight...

I respectfully say I do not wish to anwser any questions....

you smell or see nothing unusal...

you can ask me to get out of the car? can you?

No, I do not believe I have any cause to direct you to exit your vehicle in this scenario.

and if so (if you would or can at that point with noting to suspect)

ask for a FST... I decline.... next the hand held devise? again I say no...

what do you do at that point?
or has the cop taking this what is supposed to be brief detainment stop too far...

If the officer lacks any articulable suspicion to believe you might be impaired, he shouldn't direct you to the secondary inspection area where you will then be asked to exit the car or perform any tests. So, well before that you should have been advised you were free to leave.

- Carl

[paguy88]

Originally Posted by CdwJava

No, I do not believe I have any cause to direct you to exit your vehicle in this scenario.


If the officer lacks any articulable suspicion to believe you might be impaired, he shouldn't direct you to the secondary inspection area where you will then be asked to exit the car or perform any tests. So, well before that you should have been advised you were free to leave.

- Carl

ok well thanks for anwsering that...

what would you do tho

you ask if I have been drinking...

I say i dotn want to anwser anything...

what does the contact cop do absent any reason to believe anything is goin on?

meaning after I say no officer carl what do you say next?