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#1
10-20-2009, 02:57 PM
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Is it possible to sue a college for failure to teach appropriate lessons? (NY)This is long and detailed but I have many frustrations with my school and I need to explain everything in order to get an appropriate response. Thanks! I attend SBI Campus, an Affiliate of Sanford Brown in Melville, NY for Web Design. I first met with admissions a little over a year ago. At the time the school was called "Katharine Gibbs" It was changed after I had already attended the school for a few months to "SBI Campus, an Affiliate of Sanford Brown" which doesn't even sound like a real school! My admissions representative explained to me which classes I would be taking and that the instructors were experienced, and through hard selling, he convinced me to sign up for classes. He also informed me that for the web design program does not offer night courses, and so I was forced to quit my 9-5 job and take a much lower paying part time job on nights and weekends. (this is important to remember for an instance that happens later in my story) In several of my classes, the instructor had not only never taught the course before, but also had absolutely no training on the subject matter whatsoever. One example was my Adobe Flash course. The instructor was a web programmer who had never worked with Adobe Flash a day in his life, and blatantly admitted it to the students. The exact statement was "I never worked with Flash before, so this should be interesting" He simply made us buy a book and spend each class period reading this book and doing exercises on our own, which I could have done from home. When we asked him for help he clearly did not know what to do. The same exact thing happened in my Adobe Dreamweaver class, although this was a different instructor who once again did not know the program. I took 2 courses in the same term called E-commerce and E-business technologies- both which were the exact same class, just taught by different instructors. So they got twice the money out of me, for essentially 1 class. In a course called Advanced Web Authoring, we were supposed to learn how to use server technology by working with the Apache server. However, the school computers needed administrative rights to download the Apache server onto each computer. The instructor was not able to make this happen for us until the very last week of the class. And he only got the server to work on 1 computer for about 20-25 students to share. I never had a turn at that computer, so I had to download the server on my home computer and once again teach it to myself. These are just a few of the instances that have occurred in this school. Students at this school have no control over their schedule. The department chairperson handles it. Our department chairperson actually quit and began working at another school. Immediately after, I was scheduled for 2 classes that had conflicting times. (one class was 2-4, the other was 3-5) When I asked an instructor, he said "Speak with the Registrar" When I asked the registrar, they said "Speak with your department head" When I told them I no longer had a department head, they told me "Speak with your instructor" This went on for about a week, until finally they told me "You have to drop a class and its too late to sign up for another one" forcing me to be a part time student, and prolonging my graduation date. Naturally I was annoyed, as I was supposed to have 1 more session and be done, now it would be 2 more, as they do not let you take more than 2 classes per session. (sessions are 5 weeks long- I had 3 courses left and an internship, so I was hoping to get it all done in 2 sessions, now it would take me 3) But hey assured me, I will definitely be scheduled in the dropped class and another class for the next session, and then the last class (my internship) for my final session. Well my 2nd to last session began yesterday, and I was only scheduled for ONE CLASS. (the one I was forced to drop) And so I went to my new chairperson to find out why, who told me to go to the registrar, who told me to go back to the chairperson (AGAIN with the back and forth) until finally they told me that the last course I needed before my internship was Friday nights from 6-11 and Saturday mornings from 9-2! Because I was told that my classes were offered DURING THE DAY Monday-Friday, I had been working nights and weekends. That was my schedule. I am married living in a 2 bedroom apartment- I'm not some kid living at home with mom and dad. I NEED to work to pay my bills. I had to go out and find a job that allowed me to work nights and weekends because of school. And they tell me the week that my class is supposed to start. Meanwhile I have to give work at least 14 days notice if I cannot work a day I am scheduled- and I am supposed to work this weekend. That is the policy at my job. When I asked my department chairperson why they could not get another instructor to teach it (it is an advanced course in a 3d Modeling program called Maya, so why not get the instructor who teaches the beginner and intermediate Maya courses to teach the course on weekdays) The response from my chairperson was "He is not qualified enough to teach this course" MEANWHILE, my Adobe Flash and Adobe Dreamweaver instructors had never worked with those programs before, but they were teaching it! And I was seriously uninterested in 3d modeling. I was here for web design and the classes I cared the MOST about were Adobe Flash and Dreamweaver and the Advanced web authoring class! So why can't they get someone who is available WEEKDAYS to teach this course- even if he is a little experienced. They should give us a choice! I have absolutely had it with this school. I am almost done- and I am not going to leave the school now, but is there anything I can do? This is just ridiculous. How can they treat the students- the PAYING CUSTOMERS this way? Also I was told by my admissions representative that the school helps you find an internship, but I just found out that I have to find one on my own. And I have 5 weeks to do so. This was long and dragged out, but this only explains a small portion of what I deal with in this school on a daily basis. The past year has just been a horrible experience and as a dissatisfied customer, I want my money back. What can I do? |
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#2
10-20-2009, 03:04 PM
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| You COULD have researched the school better...
__________________ * * The information I gave is based on my 7 seconds of research on Google. Review the information yourself to make an informed decision. Communication is KEY - 10 mins of talking now can save you months of headaches later! Masterfully stating the obvious to the oblivious! (Thanks SP!) Tell it like it is! When all else fails, make up a statistic!  Gender references shall apply equally to the other gender. I will not correct gender mistakes (unless I want to) |
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#3
10-20-2009, 03:07 PM
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| [url=http://www.consumeraffairs.com/education/gibbs.html]Consumer complaints about Katharine Gibbs Schools[/url] Seems you're not alone in your discontent. Have you tried contacting the state Attorney General's office and filing a formal complaint? That would be my first stop. PS: I only read the first 3 sentences of your post.
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#4
10-20-2009, 03:24 PM
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ThanksI did see those reviews- but many of those are based on opinion, not fact, or they were for other programs or other locations (not Melville, NY) I wanted to go to school for web design, I wanted to be finished quickly so that I could get a job (I already have a degree so that part wasn't as important to me as the actual learning part) And I wanted to be able to take web classes without general graphic design classes- that was what this school offered. If someone had experienced poor customer service and received bad products at a Target in Florida, does that mean I should never go to a Target in NY? It's the same thing- this school is a business- a chain as a matter of fact, run by Career Education Corporation. And I am a paying customer. I am dissatisfied with what I received as a customer. So what can I do? I can't go back in time and never go to the school, so please do not tell me what I SHOULD have done. Tell me what I can do NOW. Thanks. |
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#5
10-20-2009, 03:42 PM
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As a dissatisfied paying customer, why did you continue?
__________________ * * The information I gave is based on my 7 seconds of research on Google. Review the information yourself to make an informed decision. Communication is KEY - 10 mins of talking now can save you months of headaches later! Masterfully stating the obvious to the oblivious! (Thanks SP!) Tell it like it is! When all else fails, make up a statistic! Gender references shall apply equally to the other gender. I will not correct gender mistakes (unless I want to) |
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#6
10-20-2009, 04:22 PM
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#7
10-20-2009, 04:46 PM
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moving forward1- I continued because I am not a quitter. Having 1 or 2 bad teachers was no reason for me to drop out after I had already put so much into it. That is not the point... the point is, what can I do now. 2- I did not contact the attorney general... I came on here hoping to get advice and opinions of those with a little more legal knowledge than myself, to see if I would have a legitimate case if I DID contact the attorney general to file the complaint... So what do the experts think? After reading my story, what do you think I should do moving forward? |
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#8
10-20-2009, 04:52 PM
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__________________ * * The information I gave is based on my 7 seconds of research on Google. Review the information yourself to make an informed decision. Communication is KEY - 10 mins of talking now can save you months of headaches later! Masterfully stating the obvious to the oblivious! (Thanks SP!) Tell it like it is! When all else fails, make up a statistic! Gender references shall apply equally to the other gender. I will not correct gender mistakes (unless I want to) |
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#9
10-20-2009, 05:05 PM
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| Let's put it this way. Your chances of success with an AG complaint are higher than your chances of winning a lawsuit. http://www.oag.state.ny.us/bureaus/consumer_frauds/filing_a_consumer_complaint.html
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#10
11-16-2009, 10:09 PM
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| Number 1) Finish the program. Get lots of extra certified copies of your transcripts in case you can't get them later (ie you tick them off or they treat too many people the same way and go out of business) Get references from your instructors too. 2)Figure out how much $$ compensation would make you whole. Send the school a demand letter outlining what you told us and asking for it. 3) If they don't make you a reasonable offer go see 3 attorneys in the area and see if they share the forum members' feeling that it would be a difficult lawsuit. I don't really see that the AG's office could do much for you as they haven't really committed a fraud, they just horribly under-delivered. |
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