gifting proceeds from sale of home

[neffew]

What is the name of your state? WI

My elderly uncle just went into an assisted living facility (CBRF) and we are applying for a veterans pension for him. If he qualifies for it, his expenses in the CBRF should be covered. To qualify, his total liquid assets should be below $80k. If we sell his house, he may go over this amount slightly. The VA actually counseled me to have him gift the house (or proceeds from sale) to a relative(s) so that he'll qualify. We understand that this gifted money would still be subject to the 3 or 5 -year look-back period if he eventually needs to apply for medicaid (if his condition worsens and needs a nursing home).

So is it ok to do this gifting, as long as we understand the the $ may have to be used for his care down the road?

Thanks!

 

[BlondiePB]

What is the name of your state? WI

My elderly uncle just went into an assisted living facility (CBRF) and we are applying for a veterans pension for him. If he qualifies for it, his expenses in the CBRF should be covered. To qualify, his total liquid assets should be below $80k. If we sell his house, he may go over this amount slightly. The VA actually counseled me to have him gift the house (or proceeds from sale) to a relative(s) so that he'll qualify. We understand that this gifted money would still be subject to the 3 or 5 -year look-back period if he eventually needs to apply for medicaid (if his condition worsens and needs a nursing home).

So is it ok to do this gifting, as long as we understand the the $ may have to be used for his care down the road?

Thanks!

The following questions are being asked of you for very, very good reasons.

What is YOUR or whoever's legal authorization to handle uncle's affairs? Is uncle competent? What's the big deal if the money goes a little over 80K as that little bit will be soon spent? Does uncle need any medical equipment?

 

[neffew]

Hi and thanks for the reply.

My sister and I are POA's for him, if that's what you mean. The VA told me that they don't investigate the case if the assets are under $80k (and it sounded like the less, the better). We won't know for as long as 5-6 months if he will get the pension. No, no medical equipment required (why?).

Thanks

 

[BlondiePB]

Is your uncle competent? (has dementia)

 

[neffew]

No, I don't believe he is competent. He has some dementia/alzheimers.

 

[BlondiePB]

No, I don't believe he is competent. He has some dementia/alzheimers.

Thank you. First you have to be recogized by the Veteran's Administration as uncle's representative. There is a form on the VA website that you can download and fill out. You'll find the form number in applying for benefits. The last I knew the VA didn't recognize a POA, like Social Security.

Because uncle needs his money for his care, do not gift ANY of his money. That is financial exploitation. You either need to spend his money on his care which won't take too long to drop below 80K or put that money over 80K in an annuity. There are immediate annuities. Don't put the money in a variable annuity.

You can also buy uncle things he needs or will need in the future like a walker, wheelchair, etc. I found some grab bars that go from the floor to the ceiling. They are called superpoles/transpoles. Buy at least two: one for the bathroom and one for by the bed. Don't get the attachments. Elders with dementia will forget about unlocking the attachments to move them out of the way. You can find these and other things at this website www.dynamic-living.com

 

[neffew]

We (I) already applied for the VA pension, so you might be wrong there. OR maybe we did fill out some extra form.. can't remember, but it's done.

If we put the $ in an annuity, it's like giving the principal away, more or less, since he won't live very long to collect the income...? My question is: is it financial abuse or exploitation, from a legal viewpoint, if we have him gift the overflow to us, then keep it to spend on his care? It seems to me one of the benefits of the VA pension is that it allows the vet to retain some of his assets (presumably to pass it on to his heirs?)

I don't think we can add anything to the assisted living facility like bars etc. We can keep some money for things like a TV if he wants one, and personal things like soap etc

 

[seniorjudge]

We (I) already applied for the VA pension, so you might be wrong there. OR maybe we did fill out some extra form.. can't remember, but it's done.

If we put the $ in an annuity, it's like giving the principal away, more or less, since he won't live very long to collect the income...? My question is: is it financial abuse or exploitation, from a legal viewpoint, if we have him gift the overflow to us, then keep it to spend on his care? It seems to me one of the benefits of the VA pension is that it allows the vet to retain some of his assets (presumably to pass it on to his heirs?)

I don't think we can add anything to the assisted living facility like bars etc. We can keep some money for things like a TV if he wants one, and personal things like soap etc

Financial exploitation is this: If you spend one cent of someone else's money improperly, you are in trouble. Spend the money like you will be in court someday explaining every expenditure to a judge. If you give ("gift" is a noun, not a verb) his money to you, that smells bad. If it smells bad, it looks bad. If it smells bad and looks bad, then it's bad.

 

[BlondiePB]

Financial exploitation is this: If you spend one cent of someone else's money improperly, you are in trouble. Spend the money like you will be in court someday explaining every expenditure to a judge. If you give ("gift" is a noun, not a verb) his money to you, that smells bad. If it smells bad, it looks bad. If it smells bad and looks bad, then it's bad.

You omitted explaining every cent in front of a judge, Your Honor. You and I both know about accounting for every single penny of another's money and having a perfect balance to the penny.

 

[BlondiePB]

We (I) already applied for the VA pension, so you might be wrong there. OR maybe we did fill out some extra form.. can't remember, but it's done.

I certainly hope it's done.

If we put the $ in an annuity, it's like giving the principal away, more or less, since he won't live very long to collect the income...?

Did you not see IMMEDIATE annuity?

My question is: is it financial abuse or exploitation, from a legal viewpoint, if we have him gift the overflow to us, then keep it to spend on his care? It seems to me one of the benefits of the VA pension is that it allows the vet to retain some of his assets (presumably to pass it on to his heirs?)

Seniorjudge already addressed this.

I don't think we can add anything to the assisted living facility like bars etc. We can keep some money for things like a TV if he wants one, and personal things like soap etc

Those super/transpoles do not have to be permanently installed. They are not rails on a bed that would confine a resident. I've never had an assisted living facility not allow these. Show the D.O.N. and look at the dynamic-living link. There's a lot of things available that come in handy for elders to make their daily liviing easier.