ECB Tickets keep coming for uncovered trash container

[pablo cordoba]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? New York, Queens County.

This is un-believable,

To bring you up to date, we bought a house and decided to renovate it. We hired a contractor, who brought 30' trash container to move out trash from the house.
By the time they could pick it up, (they can only pick up on mondays since that's the date of street cleaning) it filled up. They arranged pick up on a certain monday but that monday was a religious holiday, and NYC declared that day non-alternate street parking day, so no cleaning was done, no cars moved, they could not remove the container.

Contractor could not get the container picked up, which added another week. Finally it was picked up. During that time we received two tickets for "uncovered receptacle".

I paid $100 and than $130. First one on time, second one was never left on the door or flew away, I had to pay $130 with penalty.

Now I got another letter yesterday that I didn't pay another ticket, which was $130 with fine and now it is $300. I was ready to accept and pay that. I got another one today for another violation. Mailing dates are 1 week apart.

Total will be $100+$130+$300+$300 to date... So far I did not pay the last 2 yet..

I don't know what to do. I was not living there at the time of "offense". Can I mail them a copy of my change of address proof from post office and tell them to go after the contractor, and show them my contract copy?

Should I go to ECP board and discuss this in person? What are your suggestions? I am running out of time. I must respond by 8/13.

 

[pablo cordoba]

No chance?
Am I -for lack of a better word- screwed.

 

[You Are Guilty]

If you post the specific section they accuse you of violating on the tickets, I may have a few ideas.

 

[pablo cordoba]

Specific section? Not sure what you mean.
On the ticket, it said "Maintaining Receptacles"
A.C. 16-120(A)
DATE OF OCCURRENCE: 6/12/08
DEFAULT DATE: 07/21/08
ISSUING AGENCY: SANITATION OTHERS

The other one is same, instead
A.C. 16-120(A)
DATE OF OCCURRENCE: 6/04/08
DEFAULT DATE: 07/14/08
ISSUING AGENCY: SANITATION OTHERS

On the old tickets, it said "Uncovered Receptacle, overfilled with garbage"


There were two before these, luckily, I received the notices from ECP and was able to pay those in time (thinking I could get the money from the contractor).. I checked the violation numbers, these are different.

When I check above two on NYC Serv - New York City On-Line Payment Services, they still show $130, but I guess they don't really consider the Default information on the website (or update as quickly).

Please, suggestions are welcome. My biggest chance is claiming and proving that I was nto living there, and it was the contractors fault, and to their defense, they could not move the recepticle because it was a holiday with alternate side of street was not in effect.

 

[Zigner]

It's your property - you are responsible to the city.
However, you CAN sue your contractor in Small Claims Court.

ETA: You won't get the penalties from him though...those are on you.

 

[pablo cordoba]

So you are saying replying with explanation won't make any difference..

 

[You Are Guilty]

It might - but you may have other options. First things first:

Receptacles for the removal of waste material. a. The owner, lessee, agent, occupant or other person who manages or controls a building or dwelling shall provide and maintain in accordance with this section separate receptacles for the deposit of incinerator residue and ashes; refuse, and liquid waste. The receptacles shall be provided for the exclusive use of each building or dwelling and shall be of sufficient size and number to contain the wastes accumulated in such building or dwelling during a period of seventy-two hours. The receptacles shall be made of metal or other material of a grade and type acceptable to the department, the department of health and mental hygiene and the department of housing preservation and development. Receptacles used for liquid waste shall be constructed so as to hold their contents without leakage. Metal containers shall be provided with tight fitting metal covers.

Based on that section, it seems arguing that you did not own at the time of the violation won't hold water. However, ECB tickets are one of the two types of tickets issued in NYC which have to be filled out correctly or else they can be automatically dismissed (unlike, say, a speeding ticket).

There is no guide that will spell all the possible errors out for you for ECB tickets, so start with this PVB guide and it should give you a good idea what to look for:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dof/html/pdf/07pdf/parking_guide.pdf

If the ticket is filled out correctly, you can still argue that you were improperly (not) served with the tickets that now have late fees. In support of your argument, point to the fact that you paid the other tickets promptly and without complaint - why would you have paid the first and last, but not the ones in the middle?

If all else fails, throw yourself on the mercy of the ALJ and hope they're sympathetic. But as someone already mentioned, no matter what happens, you have a pretty strong small claims case against the contractor for reimbursement of all the base fines that you paid.
http://www.courts.state.ny.us/courts/nyc/smallclaims/startingcase.shtml

Good luck.

 

[pablo cordoba]

I think I am just going to reply to them with information that first ticket was lost, so I had to pay online, which I did immediately. Second ticket was actually taped on our door, but was almost flying away because the office did not tape it properly.
Rest of the tickets, which I am now under default and charged with $300 fine, were never received. I also did not receive any other follow up notice in my mailbox.

I can probably attached the first two ticket payment receipts.
Is it OK to make them an offer and say that I am willing to pay $100 fine for each ticket, since I am just notified of these now?

I am really worried that I am going to keep receiving these because they never served me with those, or they got lost during construction...

 

[You Are Guilty]

Generally, although your chances are never "good", they are significantly "better" when you contest in person as opposed to via mail or online. I'd strongly recommend you take an hour and go down to contest the NOVs face-to-face. The Queens office is located just south of the LIRR station in Jamaica (I forget the specific address) and the Manhattan office is at 66 John St.

PS: A possible reason for the lack of responses to your post is that a garbage ticket is not an "environmental or toxic tort"


{edit}
It seems I may have spoken out of school. Found a guide to ECB tickets here:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dob/html/violations/ecbviorefguide.shtml

 

[pablo cordoba]

But don't you think the "careful and thoughtful officer" should have at least put it under the door, or just tape it twice instead of just taping it with a tiny tape (one of them I found was almost about to fly). Sure, they send a follow up message in the mail, but for some reason I honestly never received that.

Anyway, I went to ECB today, well there was a line which didn't look like was going to be over in 2-3 hours. So I went back, and gave them a call. They said the fine was still $130 and that I could pay it and get rid of it. I decided not to go through with it and to just pay the fine.

Everything is a learning experience, my contractor is really PITA, from what I have been going through, which I will start another topic, but for this one, I just accepted and paid it. So far $103.50 + $133.50 x 3 = $504 in fines, including online payment fee.

Thanks for the responses, but I can't fight with them for these now, I am just happy that they were not $300 yet.

 

[You Are Guilty]

Probably what I would have done, but save your receipts and see the link above for how to collect them from your contractor in small claims. No reason for you to be out the $500.

 

[Zigner]

Actually, I would consider offseting from the final payment. Let the contractor sue YOU!

 

[pablo cordoba]

Actually, I would consider offseting from the final payment. Let the contractor sue YOU!

In the end, this is what will happen. I will deduct this from his final pay (only if he could finish the darn job he started. )

Thanks again.

PS: Always find a well reputed and well recommended contractor, not some crook you think you know because you see his sign every day when you pass by.

 

[Zigner]

In the end, this is what will happen. I will deduct this from his final pay (only if he could finish the darn job he started. )

Thanks again.

PS: Always find a well reputed and well recommended contractor, not some crook you think you know because you see his sign every day when you pass by.

The down-side is that he may just file a lien against your house until the amount is paid...

 

[pablo cordoba]

That's a good point. $500? Would his lean be even valid if he actually owes that money to me for not taking good care of the garbage container? Maybe I should just ask him to pay first, and check his reaction, if he won't pay, then sue him in small claims court?