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Grandparent Rights Oregon and Washington

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Teacher21

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? OR and WA

My daughter moved to Oregon with our grand daughter. Both had lived with us for six years. We went to Child Protective Services who removed the child and allowed her to return to our home in Washington. Our daughter has completed all requirements to have our granddaughter return. This occured in late June. We are supportive of the reunion, however, our daughter at times becomes very angry that "we" caused her to miss out on the past two years of her daughters life and holds us seeing her again above our heads. Can we seek visitation rights? Also, can this be done without hiring a lawyer, by completing forms and submitting them to the court or do we need to hire someone to do this for us? If hiring a lawyer is needed does this mean a court proceeding will occur?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?
 


Hisbabygirl77

Senior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? OR and WA

My daughter moved to Oregon with our grand daughter. Both had lived with us for six years. We went to Child Protective Services who removed the child and allowed her to return to our home in Washington. Our daughter has completed all requirements to have our granddaughter return. This occured in late June. We are supportive of the reunion, however, our daughter at times becomes very angry that "we" caused her to miss out on the past two years of her daughters life and holds us seeing her again above our heads. Can we seek visitation rights? Also, can this be done without hiring a lawyer, by completing forms and submitting them to the court or do we need to hire someone to do this for us? If hiring a lawyer is needed does this mean a court proceeding will occur?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)?
Why did you go to CPS? Where is the father? How long have they been in Oregon? Normally I would say no way you could get visitation being a grandparent but it seems you actually had custody of child for awhile? through CPS placement?
 

Teacher21

Junior Member
The father has never been involved. He chose not to be a part of her life and has never paid child support etc... We called CPS for prescription drugs and other stuff. The courts became involved because she challenged CPS's rights to take her daughter. Eventually, the courts placed her in our custody until my daughter met all the requirements of CPS. Our daughter was very successful and our granddaughter was returned to her a year and a half later. Although we have been supportive of her recovery and getting help and mostly repaired our relationship with her, she has many feeelings that come up at times and threatens to never let us see her again. Prior to our daughter leaving two years ago, her and her daughter lived with us (6 years) and our granddaughter for an additional one and a half. My daughter moved to Oregon almost two years ago. My granddaughter lived there for about a month when CPS became involved. She was placed with us and we rented an apartment in Oregon during the court proceedings of her challenging CPS, so that our granddaughter would not have to go into foster care (because we lived in Washington we could not take her while the proceedings were going on). We returned to Washington with her three months after CPS first became involved.

I have been reading there is a way to petition for grandparent visitation, but don't know where to go for the forms etc...
 

Hisbabygirl77

Senior Member
The father has never been involved. He chose not to be a part of her life and has never paid child support etc... We called CPS for prescription drugs and other stuff. The courts became involved because she challenged CPS's rights to take her daughter. Eventually, the courts placed her in our custody until my daughter met all the requirements of CPS. Our daughter was very successful and our granddaughter was returned to her a year and a half later. Although we have been supportive of her recovery and getting help and mostly repaired our relationship with her, she has many feeelings that come up at times and threatens to never let us see her again. Prior to our daughter leaving two years ago, her and her daughter lived with us (6 years) and our granddaughter for an additional one and a half. My daughter moved to Oregon almost two years ago. My granddaughter lived there for about a month when CPS became involved. She was placed with us and we rented an apartment in Oregon during the court proceedings of her challenging CPS, so that our granddaughter would not have to go into foster care (because we lived in Washington we could not take her while the proceedings were going on). We returned to Washington with her three months after CPS first became involved.

I have been reading there is a way to petition for grandparent visitation, but don't know where to go for the forms etc...

Ok just to clarify its been two years since your daughter got custody of her child back correct? and they have been living in Oregon these last two years? So if you filed it would have to be in Oregon and honestly after 2 years of child being with mom fulltime well you would need an attorney and this battle may get expensive and if you lose (which is likely) you will have pissed daughter off to the point she never lets you see grandaughter......Wait for some other posters to respond though I know a few on here have a lot more experience with grandparent cases and laws.
 

Ohiogal

Queen Bee
Troxel v. Granville was fought in WA. OP if your daughter doesn't want you to see your granddaughter you may not be seeing her.
 

Zephyr

Senior Member
OP you are going to have to understand that no matter how appropriate for your granddaughter it was to call CPS and even if your daughter agrees that you probably did the right thing there will be times when that resentment comes out. Logic and emotion don't always point the same direction. I'm sure on many levels she feels very betrayed by you, distrustful of you and angry with you. It will take time to get past that.
 

CJane

Senior Member
And the constitution of the state of which the child is a resident is going to work against you.
 
This is the Oregon Statute:

109.119 Rights of person who establishes emotional ties creating child-parent relationship or ongoing personal relationship; presumption regarding legal parent; motion for intervention. (1) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (9) of this section, any person, including but not limited to a related or nonrelated foster parent, stepparent, grandparent or relative by blood or marriage, who has established emotional ties creating a child-parent relationship or an ongoing personal relationship with a child may petition or file a motion for intervention with the court having jurisdiction over the custody, placement or guardianship of that child, or if no such proceedings are pending, may petition the court for the county in which the child resides, for an order providing for relief under subsection (3) of this section.
(2)(a) In any proceeding under this section, there is a presumption that the legal parent acts in the best interest of the child.
(b) In an order granting relief under this section, the court shall include findings of fact supporting the rebuttal of the presumption described in paragraph (a) of this subsection.
(c) The presumption described in paragraph (a) of this subsection does not apply in a proceeding to modify an order granting relief under this section.
(3)(a) If the court determines that a child-parent relationship exists and if the court determines that the presumption described in subsection (2)(a) of this section has been rebutted by a preponderance of the evidence, the court shall grant custody, guardianship, right of visitation or other right to the person having the child-parent relationship, if to do so is in the best interest of the child. The court may determine temporary custody of the child or temporary visitation rights under this paragraph pending a final order.
(b) If the court determines that an ongoing personal relationship exists and if the court determines that the presumption described in subsection (2)(a) of this section has been rebutted by clear and convincing evidence, the court shall grant visitation or contact rights to the person having the ongoing personal relationship, if to do so is in the best interest of the child. The court may order temporary visitation or contact rights under this paragraph pending a final order.
(4)(a) In deciding whether the presumption described in subsection (2)(a) of this section has been rebutted and whether to award visitation or contact rights over the objection of the legal parent, the court may consider factors including, but not limited to, the following, which may be shown by the evidence:
(A) The petitioner or intervenor is or recently has been the child’s primary caretaker;
(B) Circumstances detrimental to the child exist if relief is denied;
(C) The legal parent has fostered, encouraged or consented to the relationship between the child and the petitioner or intervenor;
(D) Granting relief would not substantially interfere with the custodial relationship; or
(E) The legal parent has unreasonably denied or limited contact between the child and the petitioner or intervenor.
(b) In deciding whether the presumption described in subsection (2)(a) of this section has been rebutted and whether to award custody, guardianship or other rights over the objection of the legal parent, the court may consider factors including, but not limited to, the following, which may be shown by the evidence:
(A) The legal parent is unwilling or unable to care adequately for the child;
(B) The petitioner or intervenor is or recently has been the child’s primary caretaker;
(C) Circumstances detrimental to the child exist if relief is denied;
(D) The legal parent has fostered, encouraged or consented to the relationship between the child and the petitioner or intervenor; or
(E) The legal parent has unreasonably denied or limited contact between the child and the petitioner or intervenor.
(5) In addition to the other rights granted under this section, a stepparent with a child-parent relationship who is a party in a dissolution proceeding may petition the court having jurisdiction for custody or visitation under this section or may petition the court for the county in which the child resides for adoption of the child. The stepparent may also file for post-judgment modification of a judgment relating to child custody.
(6)(a) A motion for intervention filed under this section shall comply with ORCP 33 and state the grounds for relief under this section.
(b) Costs for the representation of an intervenor under this section may not be charged against funds appropriated for public defense services.
(7) In a proceeding under this section, the court may:
(a) Cause an investigation, examination or evaluation to be made under ORS 107.425 or may appoint an individual or a panel or may designate a program to assist the court in creating parenting plans or resolving disputes regarding parenting time and to assist the parties in creating and implementing parenting plans under ORS 107.425 (3).
(b) Assess against a party reasonable attorney fees and costs for the benefit of another party.
(8) When a petition or motion to intervene is filed under this section seeking guardianship or custody of a child who is a foreign national, the petitioner or intervenor shall serve a copy of the petition or motion on the consulate for the child’s country.
(9) This section does not apply to proceedings under ORS chapter 419B.
(10) As used in this section:
(a) “Child-parent relationship” means a relationship that exists or did exist, in whole or in part, within the six months preceding the filing of an action under this section, and in which relationship a person having physical custody of a child or residing in the same household as the child supplied, or otherwise made available to the child, food, clothing, shelter and incidental necessaries and provided the child with necessary care, education and discipline, and which relationship continued on a day-to-day basis, through interaction, companionship, interplay and mutuality, that fulfilled the child’s psychological needs for a parent as well as the child’s physical needs. However, a relationship between a child and a person who is the nonrelated foster parent of the child is not a child-parent relationship under this section unless the relationship continued over a period exceeding 12 months.
(b) “Circumstances detrimental to the child” includes but is not limited to circumstances that may cause psychological, emotional or physical harm to a child.
(c) “Grandparent” means the legal parent of the child’s legal parent.
(d) “Legal parent” means a parent as defined in ORS 419A.004 whose rights have not been terminated under ORS 419B.500 to 419B.524.
(e) “Ongoing personal relationship” means a relationship with substantial continuity for at least one year, through interaction, companionship, interplay and mutuality. [1985 c.516 §2; 1987 c.810 §1; 1993 c.372 §1; 1997 c.92 §1; 1997 c.479 §1; 1997 c.873 §20; 1999 c.569 §6; 2001 c.873 §§1,1a,1e; 2003 c.143 §§1,2; 2003 c.231 §§4,5; 2003 c.576 §§138,139]
It may be that you have established a parent-child relationship with your granddaughter, but the fact that you have not seen her in two years works against you--notice the wording is "if a child-parent relationship exists," not "existed.". Also, even if you have such a relationship you would still have to rebut the premise that the mother acts in the best interest of her child. If the child has thrived in the years that you have not seen her, then that will be difficult to prove.

So here's the deal as I see it (just opinion). This is a complicated case, so if you try to do this without legal counsel you have zero chance of winning. If you hire an attorney, you have a slim chance of getting an order of visitation, but realize that it will cost in the tens of thousands of dollars and will make your daughter your sworn enemy.

It would be far, far, far better for you to find some way--any way--to work things out with your daughter before resorting to the courts.

JMHO
 

LdiJ

Senior Member
This is the Oregon Statute:



It may be that you have established a parent-child relationship with your granddaughter, but the fact that you have not seen her in two years works against you--notice the wording is "if a child-parent relationship exists," not "existed.". Also, even if you have such a relationship you would still have to rebut the premise that the mother acts in the best interest of her child. If the child has thrived in the years that you have not seen her, then that will be difficult to prove.

So here's the deal as I see it (just opinion). This is a complicated case, so if you try to do this without legal counsel you have zero chance of winning. If you hire an attorney, you have a slim chance of getting an order of visitation, but realize that it will cost in the tens of thousands of dollars and will make your daughter your sworn enemy.

It would be far, far, far better for you to find some way--any way--to work things out with your daughter before resorting to the courts.

JMHO
Case law in OR is not really favorable to grandparents either. Its not as clear cut unfavorable as it is in WA (and the statute that the WA legislature put through after Troxel, was also struck down by the WA supreme court), but its not favorable.

OR would definitely have jurisdiction if that is where the mom and child are residing, and its absolutely NOT something that could be done without an attorney.

I also need to warn these grandparents that if they sue, and lose, (and that is a very viable possibility) then I can guarantee that their daughter will cut them off for good. They need to hang in there and try to repair their relationship with their daughter.
 

Zigner

Senior Member, Non-Attorney
Seems strange to me that the OP only called CPS after the daughter left. I mean, for the 6 years prior to that, I guess they were fine with how their daughter was raising the child. :rolleyes:
 

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