How do I know?

[mskeg]

What is the name of your state? New York

I was recently let go from my job with the reason "performance issues". I understand that in New York State they do not have to give me a reason why I was let go.

My question is if I am given no reason, how do I know if I have any kind of claim? As far as I, as well as several employees of "X" company know, there were no performance issues with me. How can I tell if I'm not being discriminated against if no reasonable explination is given?

Also, if an owner of the company has said something about you that is not a true statement, is that discrimation? If he assumed a statement he said and you for fact know it's not true.

 

[eerelations]

You don't have any kind of legal claim unless you were let go because of your race, religion, disability, otr gender etc. (And I can't imagine any employer, no matter how stupid, admitting that to an about-to-be-fired employee.)

Firing you because of performance problems (be they specified or unspecified), or because of "something" someone said about you may be discrimination, it just isn't illegal discrimination.

 

[Beth3]

My question is if I am given no reason, how do I know if I have any kind of claim? You were given a reason - performance issues. Unless you think that reason is pretextual and the real reason you were terminated was an illegal one, then you have no claim.

 

[mskeg]

Please execuse me if I'm out of line, but I'm trying to understand the process. The only reason I question the reason of performance issues is that I was not aware of any. I recently had an evaluation. I was told that I had some performance issues and how I might fix them. I followed their advice, dealt with the issues and than was told that I was having great improvement just a week after my evaluation. I asked time and time again that if any issues were to arise that I be notified so that they could be resolved and they even admitted to me that they were at fault not notifying me of some issues that had arose, making it hard for me to improve my performance. Because I had taken steps to improve my situation and my employer didn't, can that be considered harrassment as interference with work performance? How was to perform my duties to their expectations if I was being told that I was having great improvement? How can an HR person tell you that your performance is improving, yet you are let go due to performance issues? That impedes my work performance and puts alot of stress upon me. Again, I apologize for any annoyance. Thanks for the advice.

My question is if I am given no reason, how do I know if I have any kind of claim? You were given a reason - performance issues. Unless you think that reason is pretextual and the real reason you were terminated was an illegal one, then you have no claim.

 

[Betty]

Since NY is an at-will state, they can let you go for any reason (ie performance issues) or for no reason as long as it is not an illegal one - age, sex, race, etc. It doesn't matter what they told you previously about your performance (ie that you were having great improvement) - they could still terminate you for performance issues (or anything else). Maybe it doesn't seem right/fair but it isn't illegal. You really have no case.

 

[mskeg]

Thanks for the info. I think I understand. A company gets away with no explination to the employee. The employee has no idea why, be it legal or illegal. With no explination, no legal reason is given, no illegal reason would be looked into. No claim can be filed.

A company procedure of termination is not followed. No one pays any mind to the rights of the employee. Employee gets screwed. If only there was a "in english" version of employee rights. All this legal jargon confuses me.

Since NY is an at-will state, they can let you go for any reason (ie performance issues) or for no reason as long as it is not an illegal one - age, sex, race, etc. It doesn't matter what they told you previously about your performance (ie that you were having great improvement) - they could still terminate you for performance issues (or anything else). Maybe it doesn't seem right/fair but it isn't illegal. You really have no case.

 

[Betty]

Remember that even though they could terminate you "at-will" - you could have quit your job at any time for any reason.

 

[mskeg]

Absolutely, but at least I would have given them a reason, not an excuse. And because I had no idea of any wrong doing with my performance, that just makes me think that had no reason, they just made one up. When they put in writing and make a contract with you and the process that it supposed to be taken upon termination and they don't follow it, well contract broken, at will or not. Alot more at will issues are being overturned now a days and the employee is winning.

Remember that even though they could terminate you "at-will" - you could have quit your job at any time for any reason.

 

[pattytx]

There's always a "reason". Most employers don't just wake up one day and say "Oh, I think I'll fire someone today; especially someone who's doing a great job.". If employers did that, they would be out of employees and soon, out of business.

 

[mskeg]

Believe me, there wasn't a justifiable reason, not to anyone. I'm not to upset anymore because I've heard from all my co-workers. They were concerned about the way I was treated and all of them were totally blown away by the decision. They just can't believe what happened and they all are wondering how they are going to get along without me saying "they don't know what they have lost". To me that's what counts. The positive performance comments from my co-workers, becuase they are the people that I worked closely to. People who also are my friends. People who know I did a great job and who counted on me and my assistance and knew that whatever they asked of me I did and did a great job. I really don't care how my employer felt, it wasn't like they even knew what was going on anyway. They were ready to make changes and I didn't fit their personal imagine anymore. It's a blessing. I spent a long time with the company. I've seen a numerous employee turnover and everyone has the same reason for leaving...the company doesn't know how to treat their employees, they have no training in employee relations, they make to many radical changes and there is no communication in the office. I received no incentive to continue with the company and at that point was looking for a new job anyway. Good thing is, people who I've talked to have also confirmed my work abilities and also can't believe my circumstances. I was WAY underpaid for the tasks I was doing and all the agencies I've signed up with agree that it was for the best. I'm moving along. I'm still seeking some legal advice just to read the severance package they gave me, which is hard for me to understand. Once I get that read by a lawyer and explained to me in english, I'll be able to wrap things up. I'll have absolutely NO problem finding another job. I have many credible references and people helping spread the word that I'm available. Thanks to everyone for the advice!

There's always a "reason". Most employers don't just wake up one day and say "Oh, I think I'll fire someone today; especially someone who's doing a great job.". If employers did that, they would be out of employees and soon, out of business.

 

[moburkes]

Believe me, there wasn't a justifiable reason, not to anyone. I'm not to upset anymore because I've heard from all my co-workers. They were concerned about the way I was treated and all of them were totally blown away by the decision. They just can't believe what happened and they all are wondering how they are going to get along without me saying "they don't know what they have lost". To me that's what counts. The positive performance comments from my co-workers, becuase they are the people that I worked closely to. People who also are my friends. People who know I did a great job and who counted on me and my assistance and knew that whatever they asked of me I did and did a great job. I really don't care how my employer felt, it wasn't like they even knew what was going on anyway. They were ready to make changes and I didn't fit their personal imagine anymore. It's a blessing. I spent a long time with the company. I've seen a numerous employee turnover and everyone has the same reason for leaving...the company doesn't know how to treat their employees, they have no training in employee relations, they make to many radical changes and there is no communication in the office. I received no incentive to continue with the company and at that point was looking for a new job anyway. Good thing is, people who I've talked to have also confirmed my work abilities and also can't believe my circumstances. I was WAY underpaid for the tasks I was doing and all the agencies I've signed up with agree that it was for the best. I'm moving along. I'm still seeking some legal advice just to read the severance package they gave me, which is hard for me to understand. Once I get that read by a lawyer and explained to me in english, I'll be able to wrap things up. I'll have absolutely NO problem finding another job. I have many credible references and people helping spread the word that I'm available. Thanks to everyone for the advice!

You make it sound like you single-handedly ran this company. When I quit working for my dad, I also thought that he didn't realize what he lost. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter one bit. If the company is SOOOOOOOOO bad, then it is good that you no longer work there. None of the things that you mentioned are illegal. We are all way underpaid. All of us. I'm worth several thousand dollars per hour. Let me know when you are hiring.

 

[moburkes]

And, by the way - the reason doesn't have to be justifiable - except to the owner. If he can sleep at night, and even if he can't, frankly, that is all that matters. His employees are not required to know or understand his reasons.

 

[mskeg]

I will let you know when I'm hiring! Don't care if it was legal or illegal at this point. I've been reaffirmed by people who care about me that I did a great job. That's all that matters. I know that God blessed me by sending me this message and it's time to move on. The employees are not required to know or understand.....understandable. It's the law. There's a higher power to explain that too, but you know he already understands. He'll be the judge. Peace out!

And, by the way - the reason doesn't have to be justifiable - except to the owner. If he can sleep at night, and even if he can't, frankly, that is all that matters. His employees are not required to know or understand his reasons.