Laid off then company coded it as a quit..

[Lenymo]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Kansas

I was recently employed as an Assistant Manager(General Manager in training) with a Bowling alley. On march 8th, after 8 months of employment I had informed my boss that i was not happy with the hours i was working(3pm to 3am six to seven says per week, Sundays were 10am to 12am, for six months so he could have a day off). The hours just were not working with my family life. My boss completely understood and informed the District manager. When he came into town(first time meeting this new DM) we has talked and I explained my position. HE understood, asked me to reconsider. At this time i was simply looking for another job, i didn't turn in any sort of notice, nothing. Two week prior we had a Loss prevention(LP) audit. THe LP auditor had caught two employees over pouring liquor, both determined less than 100.00 in the last five years, they were both termed for theft. I was then called in and they accused me of stealing Food product, (the actual product they were refering to was a Pretzel). After being accused for two hours in a small room and pleading my case that it was a Free manager meal that i must have simply forgot to ring in for myself. The LP auditor actually had no idea of this policy(free manager meal per 8 hour shift), it had only been in place for less than 30 days at this point. After i brought this up LP called HR quickly changed his tune, apologized, and i left, obviously angry for the situation.

April, 24 the DM comes into the center. He sits me down, tells me that they are closing one of the four centers in the city(not my center), tells me they are giving me thirty days, moving the current GM i am working with to Colorado, moving the closing centers GM to this center and letting me go in 30 days. Sunday, May 25 was my last day, worked a 12 hour shift. I go in to turn my Keys into the new GM and to get my Release form from the company. They coded the termination as quit with notice. I didn't quit, i was simply told i had 30 days from 4/24. I know i will be denied UI because of this. My question is, How do i proceed with this? I didn't quit, I was never offered a position else where. I filed for UI on 5/26 so i haven't heard back just yet, I'm just trying to be prepared.

Thanks for your help.

 

[cbg]

Why do you think that the UI office will automatically accept what the employer is telling them and ignore what you tell them? You did tell them what you told us, didn't you?

 

[Proserpina]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Kansas

I was recently employed as an Assistant Manager(General Manager in training) with a Bowling alley. On march 8th, after 8 months of employment I had informed my boss that i was not happy with the hours i was working(3pm to 3am six to seven says per week, Sundays were 10am to 12am, for six months so he could have a day off). The hours just were not working with my family life. My boss completely understood and informed the District manager. When he came into town(first time meeting this new DM) we has talked and I explained my position. HE understood, asked me to reconsider. At this time i was simply looking for another job, i didn't turn in any sort of notice, nothing. Two week prior we had a Loss prevention(LP) audit. THe LP auditor had caught two employees over pouring liquor, both determined less than 100.00 in the last five years, they were both termed for theft. I was then called in and they accused me of stealing Food product, (the actual product they were refering to was a Pretzel). After being accused for two hours in a small room and pleading my case that it was a Free manager meal that i must have simply forgot to ring in for myself. The LP auditor actually had no idea of this policy(free manager meal per 8 hour shift), it had only been in place for less than 30 days at this point. After i brought this up LP called HR quickly changed his tune, apologized, and i left, obviously angry for the situation.

April, 24 the DM comes into the center. He sits me down, tells me that they are closing one of the four centers in the city(not my center), tells me they are giving me thirty days, moving the current GM i am working with to Colorado, moving the closing centers GM to this center and letting me go in 30 days. Sunday, May 25 was my last day, worked a 12 hour shift. I go in to turn my Keys into the new GM and to get my Release form from the company. They coded the termination as quit with notice. I didn't quit, i was simply told i had 30 days from 4/24. I know i will be denied UI because of this. My question is, How do i proceed with this? I didn't quit, I was never offered a position else where. I filed for UI on 5/26 so i haven't heard back just yet, I'm just trying to be prepared.

Thanks for your help.

You did imply you were quitting, even if you didn't actually say "I quit". With the events afterwards it might actually be better for you to have quit than been fired for what can be viewed as theft - yes, you had the "Manager Meals", but you didn't ring them up.

Wait around for the others though. They'll be able to help more.

 

[Lenymo]

Virtually word for word. I suppose because I've been on the other end of these calls and i know how the company I worked for was. I'm not sure, and hope that they do not simply take what they say, but its pretty much my word versus theirs. I just have no proof that I was Laid off but they have no proof I quit. There was another person in the room when the DM spoke to me about the 30 days.

 

[Proserpina]

Virtually word for word. I suppose because I've been on the other end of these calls and i know how the company I worked for was. I'm not sure, and hope that they do not simply take what they say, but its pretty much my word versus theirs. I just have no proof that I was Laid off but they have no proof I quit. There was another person in the room when the DM spoke to me about the 30 days.

You weren't laid off.

From what you've said, you either quit or you were term'd for theft (or something similar - cbg can confirm).

If it was my choice, I'd take the quit. Theft is not something you want on your record because your ex-employer WILL tell any future employer. It's not guaranteed that they wouldn't anyway, but at least you might have a shot.

 

[Lenymo]

You did imply you were quitting, even if you didn't actually say "I quit". With the events afterwards it might actually be better for you to have quit than been fired for what can be viewed as theft - yes, you had the "Manager Meals", but you didn't ring them up.

Wait around for the others though. They'll be able to help more.

The theft was never brought up as an issue, i was never issued any progressive disciple for the matter. Implication is not action. Just because i implied does not mean that "i did". I suppose that's my real issue, I didn't quit. Yes, i did plan to, but on my terms, not theirs. They took it into their hands and termed me.

 

[Nellibelle]

You did imply you were quitting, even if you didn't actually say "I quit". With the events afterwards it might actually be better for you to have quit than been fired for what can be viewed as theft - yes, you had the "Manager Meals", but you didn't ring them up.

Wait around for the others though. They'll be able to help more.

Fired for theft? I guess you missed the part indicating the OP was exonerated. The employer did not persue this, so being fired for theft is not an issue here. Implying that one may quit isn't saying they quit. The employer was trying to avoid paying UI benefits by saying so.

 

[Proserpina]

Fired for theft? I guess you missed the part indicating the OP was exonerated. The employer did not persue this, so being fired for theft is not an issue here. Implying that one may quit isn't saying they quit. The employer was trying to avoid paying UI benefits by saying so.

Oh but it will be an issue if the ex-employer raises the point, dear.

Alas, I've misplaced the crystal ball.

 

[Nellibelle]

Oh but it will be an issue if the ex-employer raises the point, dear.

Alas, I've misplaced the crystal ball.

It certainly don't appear the company will raise that issue since the OP can prove that there was a free 'Manager's Meal' he was entitled to. The only issue the OP is really dealing with is to show he didn't quit, like the employer is trying to say he did.

 

[commentator]

Quote: "I know i will be denied UI because of this. My question is, How do i proceed with this? I didn't quit, I was never offered a position else where. I filed for UI on 5/26 so i haven't heard back just yet, I'm just trying to be prepared."

The thing is, unemployment systems are very familiar with the tactics of employers who "force a quit." They were shutting down one of their operations. They needed to lose about four employees. SO they call them in, accuse them of stealing, try to convince them that if they quit now, it will "look better" on their references (which is flatly, not true! It never looks better if you quit to avoid being fired for cause.) If you quit because they're making false accusations, or because you think they may fire you, they're really happy little employers, because that is leaving of your own choice, and you are much less likely to be approved for unemployment which will cost them money.

I saw hundreds of employer who tried this tack, called everybody in and cleaned house, accused everyone of stealing toilet paper or not washing their hands enough, or SOMETHING, it is called "forcing a quit." When honestly they should have been giving them a simple lack of work lay off. But it does NOT mean that you will be denied unemployment. It just has to be processed a little more. If you file immediately, and begin making weekly certifications, the claim will be back paid to the time you file, if you are approved later by decision.

It involves a protest of the claim by the employer, and you may have to file an appeal of a first decision regarding your reason for leaving the job. it's not just a file and be approved situation, but I think your chances of being approved are pretty good. You may be denied in the initial decision, and you keep certifiying for weeks, and file an appeal. In the appeals hearing, you tell your story again, and they make another decision. You maintain that you did NOT chose to quit the job. Forget that you were looking for another job, that you had spoken to the employer a few weeks earlier and told them you wanted better hours, even that you were looking. You did not quit then, and you did not give them notice.

And then when they did the little "you stole a pretzel" episode, they did not treat you as someone who had quit the job and were working out your notice, so don't even bring that prior situation of telling the manager you were dissatisfied with your hours, etc. into the issue about unemployment.

They marked it as a "voluntary quit" because they hoped you'd think that "sounded better" somehow, and that you'd feel lucky they didn't report you were fired for stealing, which you of course were not, but mostly they did it because they really hoped you would accept that with a voluntary quit separation, their unemployment account wouldn't get tapped when they had to close this store and actually let go some employees through no fault of their own, which is what unemployment insurance is designed for!

You did not quit this job, OP. You are out of work through no fault of your own because your employer is closing your worksite, and they'd prefer not to pay unemployment in on you. Tell the unemployment system exactly what happened the last day you worked there, what you were told, etc. DO NOT tell them about your discussion previously. THat's not the reason they put that you voluntarily quit. They put that you voluntarily quit because that's what they would like the unemployment office to believe. They'd like the unemployment system to believe that four or so employees suddenly quit or had to be fired for good misconduct cause, just as (what a coincidence!) they were shutting down the facility.

Just for general information, voluntarily quitting a long term job, suddenly out of the blue, with no good job to go to immediately doesn't look better on a resume than being terminated, for whatever reason. That's a fallacy that employers love to tell people they are getting ready to lay off or fire, because they know that they may be on the hook for unemployment benefits.

 

[Lenymo]

Anyways, I feel confident now that I've heard a few opinions both here on this forum and from a few HR people that I know from other fields. Time to tackle this issue head on. Thanks all!

 

[cbg]

Tell you what, Nelli.

Do one of two things. Either provide us with evidence that you not only work for the OP's employer but have reason to be in the loop as to what the employer will do with regards to the OP's unemployment claim, or admit that you were guessing when you tried to claim what they would do.

 

[Nellibelle]

Tell you what, Nelli.

Do one of two things. Either provide us with evidence that you not only work for the OP's employer but have reason to be in the loop as to what the employer will do with regards to the OP's unemployment claim, or admit that you were guessing when you tried to claim what they would do.

I certainly will not admit to guessing! Where are getting that I need to prove I work for the OP's employer? If you read his post, you will see that he was unhappy with his work-hours and he was going to find another job. He didn't quit! Then he was told by his former employer that he was going to be let go after 30 more days of work. Then his former employer lied on his termination papers when they said he quit with notice.

The fact that the OP had a meeting where his former employer accused him of theft, is irrelevant because there is no indication at all that the OP had a choice of either quitting or getting terminated for theft. To believe or assumed that this happened (as a few of you are doing) is purely guessing.

It is crystal clear that the employer is trying to avoid paying UI benefits to the OP by saying he quit! Why else would they lie about his termination? As far as the OP's unemployment claim, I never said one way or the other what the employer would ultimately do concerning it! Obviously, if they are trying to lie about the OP quitting, then that would be a good way to avoid paying benefits. Whether the OP will get around the employer's lie when he tries to prove he never quit, but was let go, remains to be seen.

 

[quincy]

I certainly will not admit to guessing! Where are getting that I need to prove I work for the OP's employer? If you read his post, you will see that he was unhappy with his work-hours and he was going to find another job. He didn't quit! Then he was told by his former employer that he was going to be let go after 30 more days of work. Then his former employer lied on his termination papers when they said he quit with notice.

The fact that the OP had a meeting where his former employer accused him of theft, is irrelevant because there is no indication at all that the OP had a choice of either quitting or getting terminated for theft. To believe or assumed that this happened (as a few of you are doing) is purely guessing.

It is crystal clear that the employer is trying to avoid paying UI benefits to the OP by saying he quit! Why else would they lie about his termination? As far as the OP's unemployment claim, I never said one way or the other what the employer would ultimately do concerning it! Obviously, if they are trying to lie about the OP quitting, then that would be a good way to avoid paying benefits. Whether the OP will get around the employer's lie when he tries to prove he never quit, but was let go, remains to be seen.

Your continued guessing - and then arguing about it after you have been corrected - is a good way to get banned from this forum, Nellibelle.

 

[cbg]

It certainly don't appear the company will raise that issue

Either you are employed by the OP's employer and have input into what issues they will and will not raise, or this is a guess.

Pick one.