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unemployment appeal

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nosanity4me

Junior Member
What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Missouri
It's been a couple of weeks since I applied for an appeal to my denial. When I was sent all the information that Unemployment had about the situation, I was shocked to find out that there was another final "issue occurred when patient medications were not being correctly transcribed which could have resulted in a fatal injury if it had not been observed by another employee." I was mortified when I read this. Of course this could also be translated as something was missed when transcribing the error that was observed by another person." Anyway this was never mentioned to me before or on the termination date and this information came from a place called UC Express located in St Louis, which I assume is some corporate hired place to fight unemployment claims. It was unusual that they sent along a copied page of their firing policy and placed asterisks near the "pertainent" points. Also no copy of the actual termination notice was produced. I talked with the individual heading the tribunal (she is the tribunal in this case) and she said I could request that documentation of the pertainent information be sent, but the hearing is set for next week, and who and how do I request the information? And how will I get it on time?
This person also stated that I was not terminated until 1/22/11 because I called off on 2 shifts, this is a lie. My normal days off were SUN,MON,TUES I reported for work on WED orientated another nurse to the unit and when I came in on THURS I was fired with no explanation.
 


swalsh411

Senior Member
They are not required to give you any and all records. You got what they choose to give you. At the appeal mantain that you did your job to the best of your ability and you did not abandon it. They will bear the burden of proof to show that the mistake you were fired for rose to the level of misconduct. Do not bring up unneccessary issues that do not pertain to the reason you were terminated.
 

nosanity4me

Junior Member
employment appeal

Do I need to fax the unemployment tribunal rep an actual copy of my non specific notice of termination? The appeal tribunal representative, said that I had a copy of all the documents sent in by Medicalodge. I also have an email recommedation from my most recent Assistant Director of Nursing do I need to send that?
 
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commentator

Senior Member
Right. You don't need this stuff. This is just a distractor from your side of the whole issue. If they did not give you a copy of the termination letter at the time you were terminated, what would you think you would need it now anyway? Just say you did not receive this letter, were not given this letter.

Yes, U.C. Express is one of the giant conglomerate of unempoyment service providers. They know absolutely nothing about your case individually, and always appeal everything on every claim, whether they have a good chance to win the appeal or not. The person who attends your hearing will either be on the phone from St.Louis, or will have flown in to cover your hearing. The U.I. appeals hearing officer will be thoroughly familiar with this situation.

But what will happen in the appeals hearing is not that you go in and make like Perry Mason, objecting to their information and responding to each point in their evidence like some trial lawyer. You will present evidence, then they will present evidence. Then each of you will have the opportunity to ask the other party questions. The tribunal officer may hae questions for either of you. The hearing will be taped, you will be sworn in, and there will be a very strict process followed.

What happens is that you, in the most careful detail, will explain exactly what happened that resulted in your termination. To the best of your knowledge only. Ignore what they are saying now unless you had been told about it prior to your firing. I do not think you need copies of their information, though the appeals system representative can tell you how to go about requesting it. But I maintain you don't need it anyhow, so why bother? At the hearing, repeat exactly what you were told on the day you were terminated by whoever terminated you. If you did not receive a letter of termination or any paperwork, or can't find it now, tell them this, and repeat to the best of your memory what any paperwork you saw actually said.

Emphasize that you had, if this is really the case, no prior warnings about any of the issues they have raised, that you had received no written warnings, no documentation of warnings about any wrongdoing or misperformance on your part. In other words, you were given NO opportunity to change your behavior and keep your job, you did not even know your job was in jeopardy.

The U.C. Express person will attempt to show from what your former company has given them that they had a valid misconduct reason to terminate you.That you were warned, and chose to repeat the actions that were going to get you fired. If they read off something that is absolutely false, then when it comes time to ask questions of them, you can ask if there is a record that this was brought to your attention or if they have any signed paperwork showing that they talked to you about this issue. Yes, you may have signed off on what is in their company handbook, but you were not aware that you were violating a handbook procedure and you were never told that you were doing this. You have been working there xxxx years and you have been doing your job the same way, and always to the best of your abilities, not deliberately violating any procedures.

Remember, be polite, professional and to the point. Even though you have spoken to him/her before, do not expect the tribunal officer to be even remotely friendly to you. Do not make small talk. Do not become emotional. Keep to the facts. Do not interrupt. Listen carefully to the directions you are given, and follow them.

You don't need to see all the mish-mash of supposed reasons for your termination that the company has drummed up, because you have not seen any of them before, and you had no idea they existed before you were terminated. You do not have to argue everything they said to the floor. You had no knowledge of this. That is your defense, and all you need to say. There is the assumption in such a hearing that either party, either you or your employer may be lying. They will go with whichever is most believable, and your word is as good as theirs.

Bring to the hearing, or fax to the tribunal ahead of time for distribution your actual letter of termination that you received when you were fired. NO, you do not need to include a recommendation letter from your latest D.O.N. No one cares about what a fine person you really are, they just want to know if you deliberately did something to give your old employer a reason to fire you.
 
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commentator

Senior Member
Okay, during your presentation at the hearing, you may want to mention that in fact, not only did you not realize your job was in jeopardy, but that you have a commendation from the person who supervised you sometimes on this job saying your performance was good.
 

nosanity4me

Junior Member
employment appeal

The reference letter provided on 2/23/2011 by the ADON who was responsible for my unit says as follows:
To who it may concern:
I have worked with xxx for approximately 2 1/2 years and would recommend her for a nursing position. She shows compassion in caring for people and works well with all staff. She is eager to learn and quick to assist others. Given the appropriate position she would prove to be an excellent addition to your staff. Please feel free to contact me with any additional questions. Signed et phone number.

Incedentally, she signed the warning meeting, and then the generic termination slip as a witness.
 
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commentator

Senior Member
Given this, I'd just leave this reference letter out of the hearing. Frankly, it doesn't contribute to your claim that you had no evidence of your supposed wrongdoing, and doesn't add to the discussion. Brief. To the point. Concise. Factual. This is what you need to stress in this hearing.
 

nosanity4me

Junior Member
employment appeal

Just a note to let you know how the appeals tribunal hearing went. No one from my employer's firm was present at the telephone hearing. I followed the suggestions I was given. I was allowed to explain any of the past warnings I had received since the employer sent every warning I ever received. I was actually able to use one of the past warnings to prove that I was to be in the dining room during mealtimes. I maintained that I was doing my duty to the best of my ablity and was taking action to correct past mistakes. She found no evidence of intent to not perform my duties, and therefore I was discharged on 1/21/11 but not for misconduct connected with my work.
I must say I felt guilty even though I was not and it's hard to stick straight to the facts, but I did. As a result, the decision was reversed and I received compensation.

I have another question. I now have another job as a nurse (for less that 2 weeks), if for some reason I am let go during my probationary period can I still draw unemployment from my previous claim. This is in Missouri.
 

commentator

Senior Member
Glad to hear you got the hearing to go your way.

Now, about the new job. If you show up, follow the rules and do your best, and the new employer is still not satisfied with you, and they let you go during the probationary period, you can most likely reopen your claim and begin drawing it again.

You only get one new claim a year, this will be hooked on to the old one, you'll be drawing what was left in this claim. But being let go during a probationary period for performance issues, as long as you say you did your job to the best of your ability, is generally not disqualifying.

Now if you get exasperated with the new job and they criticize your performance and this leads you to quit, it's quite a different story. (Or of course if you do something really dumb, like let them find you sleeping under a desk!) So do not quit, even if they threaten to let you go. Just do the best you can and let them decide. Then you can probably get back on your claim if it hasn't worked out.
 

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