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Wrongful Termination?

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What is the name of your state?What is the name of your state? NC
I will "try" to keep this as short as possible. (Here's on for ya enasni, :) )

Here's the story:
My friend works at a Hotel and went out with a guest after he was "off the clock". After droppping him off back at the Hotel, the guest got sick all over the lobby floor. A co-worker was upset to have to clean up the mess and told the managers that my friend took him out and was fraternizing with guests.

My friend was fired today for fraternization. He was told the company has a no fraternazation policy with guests.

Heres the fun part:
I work at a different Hotel, but owned by the same company (a big company). I was also out with my friend and the guest that night. I had no prior knowledge that he was a guest of the other hotel. I was called into my managers office and told that my friend was fired and I "may be" written up for fraternization. He explained that we can not fraternize with any "registered" guest. The hotel offers a friends and family discount when your friends and family stay at the hotel. How can they have a no fraternization policy with guests that are your friends and family I asked? If they stay at the hotel they become a "registered" guest. So I wouldn't be allowed to go out with, let's say, my Dad when he visits?. He said "Well if they are your family and friends that's different". I questioned him about how this would be proven when dealing with termination on grounds of who is or isn't "your friend" and he couldn't answer.

The questions: How can my friend be fired for hanging out with a guest when he was "off the clock"? How can I be written up (they wanted to fire me also, but my manager stood up for me) for being with someone, one, I did not know was a guest and two, was not even staying in the hotel I work in? To me this is ridiculous, I have never heard of fraternization policies that reach outside "employee" relationships in my entire life. Besides maybe in strip clubs where dancers can not legally leave the club with customers, but isn't that completely different? Do they have any kind of legal stand point here? My common sense tells me NO WAY. Does this mean if I ever find out someone is staying at a Hotel this company owns (over 20) I must leave and not be allowed to associate with them? Where is the line drawn, anywhere they please?
 


cbg

I'm a Northern Girl
No, this is not a wrongful termination.

It may or may not be "ridiculous" but nothing in the law forbids them from fring an employee for violating a policy, even if the policy does not make sense and even if the employee does not understand the details of how the policy worked.

Unless it is ILLEGAL for an employer to fire the employee for the reason they did, it is not a wrongful termination, regardless of whether you agree with the reason or not.
 
Employee Rights?

In their "policy", it doesn't specify anything about when your "off the clock", only covers when your "on duty", does this even matter? Does it have to be covered by the empolyer somewhere in a handbook? According to what you have written it sounds like they can fire you for any reason "they" feel is just. So would it even matter if it was a policy or not? Basically what I have gathered from your statement is: That "wrongful termination" is only limited to illegal activities. So what is that? Firing someone for not sleeping with you? Or firing an enployee for not killing someone for you? BUT, Yes they can fire you for wearing a blue shirt when you know they hate that color? What rights do we really have? :eek:
This just does not make sense to me.... One more question to think about. If I were to be fired or written up for fraternizing with a guest. How could it be considered fraternizing when 1. I never saw, talked, or even knew of his existance until later in the evening when I was off the clock. 2. He wasn't a guest of the Hotel I work in. How is this fratereniztion? What if a huge company tried to enforce this kind of regulation? What if Marriott Hotel had this kind of policy? "Oh your staying at the Marriott in Las Vegas? Sorry, I can not associate with you any longer, you see I work for a Marriott property in New York city and we have a no fraternization policy, maybe next time..." Does this not sound absuard to you? :confused: Is there nothing I can do?
Oh and here's soemthing interesting to think about. Do you know how many people actually have met their significant other while "on the job"? I don't know an actual number, but I do know it's huge. That's alot of fired people. ;)
 
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S

seniorjudge

Guest
Q: How can my friend be fired for hanging out with a guest when he was "off the clock"?

A: The company has a no fraternazation policy with guests.
 

ENASNI

Senior Member
Let me Introduce myself

Why you think I have any care about your Problems is not the point.
You ARE.. by your posts trying to keep some kinda semblance to your life.

YYAAA PAARRty.. not saying you can't blow off some steam..
but sometime in all that fog you knew where ms or mister throwy up kid came from... and you did not care..
Whoa PARTY.. let me guess... the vomiter paid for all...

Any who.. You mentioned my name... why :confused:
You knew he/she was a patron.. what should you do heck if I know...
I have worked in that industry and boy rules go out the window it seems.
 
Enasni

I mentioned your name because your posts are so delightful :eek: Man, just wanted your input on the subject...please calm down, life is short.

And yes at some point I did know he was a patron of ANOTHER HOTEL, one of which I WAS NOT AN EMPLOYEE (Do you actually read the posts before replying?). I did not honestly feel there was a problem then and I do not now. Even my General Manager did not see a problem with it, he was forced to take action. This is the first time I've ever even heard of such a policy, which by the way is not covered in the employee handbook and was just recently fabricated. Employees have friends in the hotel "all the time" and go out with them. We even have a special friends and family rate for that very purpose. It was never an issue until this last incident. Most likely because the guy got sick. He wasn't even staying in the hotel I work in, I did not have any prior contact with him nor did I go into the hotel where he stayed, except briefly to use the bathroom at the end of the night.
The same Hotel has two brothers working there, one is a supervisor over the other. Several complaints were made about fraternization there, but yet they still both work there. To me that is fraternization, why no action there? By the way the guy who made a big deal about it and had to clean up the mess is the brother of the supervisor I mentioned above. Ironic isn't it?

FYI: All my posts do not always pretain directly to me, this one did though, and your point is? Law just fascinates me and I like to learn about it. You know, you do not really have rights if you do not know what they are, do you? This forum is probably here for people to learn a little not just for advice, I feel my questions are valuable. :rolleyes: And no I paid for my own drinks, and barely saw the guy in the whole 2 hours we were in the club.
 
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ENASNI

Senior Member
erg

did get half way down your post
then started praying to the paragraph god..

so if there is anything you want to say to me..
opps sorry my cell phone is ringing
 

Renee3

Junior Member
Hotel policies

You can't figure out why hotels have policies that forbid hotel employees from "fraternizing" with hotel guests?!?!?!?!?!?! You have got to be kidding me!!!! Ever hear about a certain very famous professional basketball player and a certain hotel employee?

Suppose she says that the hotel management forced her to go to this hotel guest's room and "entertain" him or get fired? Suppose she files an employment claim for a bazillion gazillion dollars? But, no, she probably isn't going to be able to do that, because the hotel probably has some policy about hotel employees not fraternizing with hotel guests........

Or, suppose a hotel employee goes out partying with a hotel guest, who just happens to be some psychopath mass murderer, who binds, tortures, and kills the hotel employee after first cleaning out the employee's bank account. The heartbroken and poverty stricken family of the late lamented hotel employee want to sue the hotel, but no, probably isn't going to be able to do that because the hotel probably has some policy about hotel employees not fraternizing with hotel guests.........
 
Reene3

You obviously did not read the previous postings. The guest I was accused with fraternizing with did not stay at the hotel I worked in. He stayed in the hotel my friend worked in, which is owned by the same company. I had no idea this person was going out with us. I had no idea he was even a guest of the other hotel until later in the evening. The only thing I really shared with him was the ride to and from the club. Barely even saw him the club. Our friends are allowed to stay in the hotel, I had no way of knowing that this wasn't a friend of his staying in the hotel or a "regular guest". It sounds confusing, but there is suposingly a difference. The difference being that a friend you knew prior to them becoming a guest is not considered fraternization, that came from management.
 

ljt99

Member
SinCity89103, As you have probably figured out by now, most of the people on this forum are not here to offer advice but are here to berate and insult those who ask for help.

To me it is obvious that it does not make sense to offer a discount to the employee's friends and family and then prohibit the employee from "fraternizing" with those same people. If it did make sense in some way, it probably would be outlined in your employee handbook. Since it is not, it is probably one of those grey areas.

It sounds like the guy who had to clean up the puke was ticked off and took advantage of his brother being in a position to cause trouble for you and your friend. Chances are nothing would have been made of it if not for the puke cleaning.

Unfortunately for your friend he could probably contest the unfair firing since it is not in the handbook but it would cost a lot of money in legal fees. In the end the hotel would probably just grasp at some straw of another reason and, without a union, would win.

As you have also found out, most other people on this forum apparently do not actually read the posts, instead jumping to the first idiotic conclusion they can. I'm not sure why "ENASNI" even bothered to post a reply to your questions except to prove that "he" is an a**hole. And for Renee3 to compare your situation to the Kobe Bryant situation proves what I said about people jumping to idiotic conclusions. Obviously there is no comparison when the guest was not even from your hotel.

Good luck with your job. I would continue to ask management exactly how the "no fraternization but we offer a discount to your family and friends" actually works. Although it will probably tick them off if they cannot come up with a legitimate explanation so you do have to choose your fights wisely. Again, good luck.
 

ENASNI

Senior Member
umm correction

ljt99 said:
SinCity89103, As you have probably figured out by now, most of the people on this forum are not here to offer advice but are here to berate and insult those who ask for help.

To me it is obvious that it does not make sense to offer a discount to the employee's friends and family and then prohibit the employee from "fraternizing" with those same people. If it did make sense in some way, it probably would be outlined in your employee handbook. Since it is not, it is probably one of those grey areas.

It sounds like the guy who had to clean up the puke was ticked off and took advantage of his brother being in a position to cause trouble for you and your friend. Chances are nothing would have been made of it if not for the puke cleaning.

Unfortunately for your friend he could probably contest the unfair firing since it is not in the handbook but it would cost a lot of money in legal fees. In the end the hotel would probably just grasp at some straw of another reason and, without a union, would win.

As you have also found out, most other people on this forum apparently do not actually read the posts, instead jumping to the first idiotic conclusion they can. I'm not sure why "ENASNI" even bothered to post a reply to your questions except to prove that "he" is an a**hole. And for Renee3 to compare your situation to the Kobe Bryant situation proves what I said about people jumping to idiotic conclusions. Obviously there is no comparison when the guest was not even from your hotel.

Good luck with your job. I would continue to ask management exactly how the "no fraternization but we offer a discount to your family and friends" actually works. Although it will probably tick them off if they cannot come up with a legitimate explanation so you do have to choose your fights wisely. Again, good luck.
See above in bold.. correction is SHE is and continue from there...

Thank you and have a nice day.

SINCITY... haven't been to Vegas for awhile... its getting too hollywood.
I stay off the strip.
Gee I get to gamble in California... but I miss Craps...
 

ljt99

Member
ENASNI said:
See above in bold.. correction is SHE is and continue from there...

Thank you and have a nice day.

ENASNI - Sorry, I didn't know for sure what gender of a**hole you are by your logon name, hence the quotation marks on "he". I stand corrected. SHE is proving HERSELF an a**hole in HER reply.
 

ENASNI

Senior Member
um

ljt99 said:
ENASNI said:
See above in bold.. correction is SHE is and continue from there...

Thank you and have a nice day.

ENASNI - Sorry, I didn't know for sure what gender of a**hole you are by your logon name, hence the quotation marks on "he". I stand corrected. SHE is proving HERSELF an a**hole in HER reply.
insert your lovely noun here*

A *rose my any other name is still a *rose

Look kid.. I don't know how you got kicked off this board, found another email and came back on.

But yeah.. There are better things in life than to come around and chase a person down for a "bad post" get a life is a good thing to live by... Jeesh.. gonna go pull some weeds... and stay off the computer for a bit..
have a friggin nice day :)
 

ljt99

Member
ENASNI said:
insert your lovely noun here*

A *rose my any other name is still a *rose

Look kid.. I don't know how you got kicked off this board, found another email and came back on.

But yeah.. There are better things in life than to come around and chase a person down for a "bad post" get a life is a good thing to live by... Jeesh.. gonna go pull some weeds... and stay off the computer for a bit..
have a friggin nice day :)
FYI - I'm not a kid and I was NEVER kicked off of this board. Get your facts straight before spouting lies. I'm a 46 year old professional woman who finds the abuse leveled at the those posters who make the mistake of coming to this forum for advise to be deplorable. I fully expect to be kicked off of this board any time now since I have recently decided to address those people who are rude as hell and call them out on it. If there is anyone who should get a life it is the many members of this board who apparently mistake bad manners and verbal abuse for "free advice". I do not understand why those who cannot be respectful in their answers, or do not have any constructive advice to give, do not simply keep their mouths shut. If my feeling this way means I will be kicked off of the board, then so be it.

You have a great day too.
 
S

seniorjudge

Guest
ljt99 said:
FYI - I'm not a kid and I was NEVER kicked off of this board. Get your facts straight before spouting lies. I'm a 46 year old professional woman who finds the abuse leveled at the those posters who make the mistake of coming to this forum for advise to be deplorable. I fully expect to be kicked off of this board any time now since I have recently decided to address those people who are rude as hell and call them out on it. If there is anyone who should get a life it is the many members of this board who apparently mistake bad manners and verbal abuse for "free advice". I do not understand why those who cannot be respectful in their answers, or do not have any constructive advice to give, do not simply keep their mouths shut. If my feeling this way means I will be kicked off of the board, then so be it.

You have a great day too.
You got two correct answers.

What else do you want?
 

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