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  #1  
Old 10-26-2009, 07:13 AM
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Dine and Dash in Massachusetts

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Massachusetts

Is it legal for a manager to force a server to make up the loss on a dine and dash in Massachusetts? I would appreciate any links to pertinent law as I will be confronting the manager about this.
  #2  
Old 10-26-2009, 07:56 AM
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"Make up what loss" how? What are the details of this situation?
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Last edited by pattytx; 10-26-2009 at 07:58 AM.
  #3  
Old 10-26-2009, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pattytx View Post
"Make up what loss" how? What are the details of this situation?
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that what I think OP is saying is that they are a server (or have a friend that is a server) and had a table eat and leave without paying. Manager then made OP make up the loss (the check amount) out of his or her tips and now OP wants to know if that is legal and wants the pertinent law (if it isnt) so he or she can use it to confront manager.

I was in the same situation long ago and far away in a distant galaxy as a server back in high school. Had a table eat about $75 worth of food (drinks, 4 childrens meals, appetizers etc) and when I went to get the check, I came back to an empty table and an unpaid $75 bill! Manager made me pay the $75 out of my tips that night at cash-out.
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Originally Posted by Zigner View Post
The "debt" wasn't created by the court. The "debt" was created by the tube-steak boogie
Quote:
Originally Posted by FingerLakes View Post
1st: I am not an attorney
2nd: I didn't stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyShot View Post
A "silly mistake" is showing up in a costume at a formal event...
If you cannot have a criminal record, then don't commit criminal acts - seems simple enough.
Last edited by RRevak; 10-26-2009 at 09:40 AM.
  #4  
Old 10-26-2009, 09:50 AM
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Rrevak, you're probably right, but I'm not a dentist and I get tired of trying to pull teeth here. Posters need to learn to provide enough information for us to answer the question correctly.
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  #5  
Old 10-26-2009, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by pattytx View Post
Rrevak, you're probably right, but I'm not a dentist and I get tired of trying to pull teeth here. Posters need to learn to provide enough information for us to answer the question correctly.
Agreed, as unless Ms. Cleo is a FA member i'm fairly certain we arent psychic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zigner View Post
The "debt" wasn't created by the court. The "debt" was created by the tube-steak boogie
Quote:
Originally Posted by FingerLakes View Post
1st: I am not an attorney
2nd: I didn't stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyShot View Post
A "silly mistake" is showing up in a costume at a formal event...
If you cannot have a criminal record, then don't commit criminal acts - seems simple enough.
  #6  
Old 10-26-2009, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by RRevak View Post
Agreed, as unless Ms. Cleo is a FA member i'm fairly certain we arent psychic
Well, we used to be, but SJ took the crystal ball and hasn't returned it.
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  #7  
Old 10-26-2009, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RRevak View Post
Agreed, as unless Ms. Cleo is a FA member i'm fairly certain we arent psychic
I be here chil'. What you be needin' from Ms. Cleo. Ya be knowin' I be already havin' the answer but I be wantin' you to be askin' the question first.
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  #8  
Old 10-26-2009, 04:41 PM
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Yes the second poster was correct. Sorry I thought I was clear but I had just woken up when I posted this. My girlfriend was the server and a table left without paying a $150 bill. My girlfriend only made $40 in tips for the night and was forced to give all of this to the manager. I am wondering if this was legal.
  #9  
Old 10-27-2009, 07:59 AM
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OK, then, no, it is not legal. (This Fact Sheet is, IMHO, required reading for all tipped employees.)

Quote:
Retention of Tips: The law forbids any arrangement between the employer and the tipped employee whereby any part of the tip received becomes the property of the employer. A tip is the sole property of the tipped employee.
[url]http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs15.pdf[/url]

She can file a complaint with the state Attorney General's office, which serves as the Dept. of Labor in MA.
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  #10  
Old 10-27-2009, 02:58 PM
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patty, this comes up enough and the answer is so often that the employer cannot reduce the wages below minimum wage or the tips cannot be taken.

I cannot remember if on this forum or another I frequent but one regular poster explained it that is was always no simply because the employer could not require the employee to reimburse the employer for theft. Simple as that.

While it sounded so simple, it also made a lot of sense. The dasher is stealing from the employer so why would the employee be any more responsible for the loss than if a robber came in and forced the cashier to empty the register and took the money.

any comment?
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  #11  
Old 10-27-2009, 03:16 PM
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In the third world employer lovin' state where I hang out, it is legal to demand that a server pay for "dine and dash" or a convenient market clerk pay for a drive off who pumps and dashes IF they have signed a contract agreeing to do this as part of their initial employment contract. And many places have it in the contract, you bet!

The rationale used by the employers is that a person can come in and eat a meal who is a friend of the server, and the server can say, "Well, I was powerless, they just left and I didn't see them," when he/she was actually treating her pals. Same with the drive offs. What if you didn't notice, but it happened to be your boyfriend?

Few people are going to go to the trouble of holding up a place, much easier to walk out and get a freebie; it is VERY motivational to the waitstaff or the cashiers to notice who walks out without paying or drives away if they know they are going to be responsible for it.
  #12  
Old 10-27-2009, 03:25 PM
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well, now you are getting into contract law and away from labor law but even with the contract, it is contestable.


there is never anything preventing the employer from firing an employee if they believe they are part of such a scam or even seeking compensation via legal means (suing them) if they believe they were a party to such a scam.

I tend to agree with the other guy that you cannot require an employee to compensate an employer for thefts from the business that the employee has no control over.

and I was wondering commentator, are you related to any royaltators or has your entire bloodline been commontators.
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  #13  
Old 10-27-2009, 07:06 PM
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Actually goes back to a time in my life when I was a retail clerk in tourist town. There were a lot of counterfeit bills being passed, and we were all told that if we accepted one of the bills, it would be in our next paycheck. You never saw such diligent bill checkers!

Later, wondering about it, suspecting it was probably shifty, I talked at length with some Wage and Hour people, (state and federal) and found out the thing about yes, if you've agreed to it beforehand, at the time you were hired (yes, this does get into contract law) they can do this to you, though it has to come out of the hourly paycheck, not the tips, or something like that, to make sure the person still gets minimum wage....very vague. But in my career in employment services, I have seen many poor convenient market clerks in understaffed businesses who had a drive off and had their paycheck significantly reduced. Pitiful! And then there's that wonderful prospect of being shot in a hold up. For minimum wage.

Justalayman-- in my family, we're all common taters on axe (Acts) which is an obscure scene from the "Little House on the Prairie" books.
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