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religious beard discrimination

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CdwJava

Senior Member
I know of cases in public employment out here where the disparity argument for assignments were determined NOT to be discriminatory, but a function of management discretion ... so long as it did not affect the base pay of the party involved (a property interest). In some cases, assignments have been shown to be a path for promotion and a property interest has been determined to exist. Though, I will again admit that I am uncertain as to whether this would apply in the private sector in another state.
 


LdiJ

Senior Member
In the simplest terms; the employer cannot take any action becausenof the beard unless there is a valid reason such as with the gas maask.


With respect to religion, Title VII prohibits among other things:

disparate treatment based on religion in recruitment, hiring, promotion, benefits, training, job duties, termination, or any other aspect of employment (except that "religious organizations" as defined under


What we are speaking of is disparate treatment in assignment of the job duties.
This is what he originally said:

I am going to be put indefinitely at the service gate, which is least desired, as a reward for being awesome. All officers normally rotate to different posts everyday / week. I can't help but feel segregated and discriminated against. HR says they have the right to manage the appearance of member facing positions. Every other department here that has dealings with members more often than my department has bearded men. Am I wrong? Is HR right?
He also mentioned the possibility of losing overtime opportunities at member events.

There is a difference between "least desired" and lesser pay. There is a difference between a well groomed beard and an unkempt one. There is a difference between very occasional overtime opportunities and significant overtime opportunities.

I would fully expect to be relegated to the back room doing quality control of tax returns, with the same pay I am getting now, should I decide to somehow change my appearance enough that it would "put off" our clients, even if it was due to a religious issue...or even due to a disability related issue. My clients are always asking if I will be there for the long term, and I always joke that even if I am using a wheel chair or walker with an oxygen tank strapped to my back I will be there.

The reality of things however is that the wheel chair probably wouldn't bother any of our clients, but the oxygen tank probably would...it would raise some concerns as to competency.

This OP is apparently in the security business. While a well trimmed beard might not raise issues with clients, an unkempt one certainly could. Not because of who that person might be culturally, but of competency...because a lack of grooming raises competency issues.
 

justalayman

Senior Member
The trimmed beard v. Unkempt:

Nope, at least if unkempt is the style of his religion. Some sects of Jews, Amish, Muslim all do not trim their beard. Since that is the style of their religion you cannot discriminate because of it.
 
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davew128

Senior Member
Dave, you just made me giggle.

In 2004, I used to go in and help out a neighbor who was 96 years old and was mostly okay on her own but needed a bit of help with meals and changing clothes. She was a huge Red Sox fan but she thoroughly disapproved of Johnny Damon. Every time she saw him she would cluck her tongue and announce, "They should make him cut his hair".

She had passed away by the time Damon went to the Yankees (sadly, she had passed away before that wonderful, wonderful October) but I couldn't help thinking of what her reaction would have been.
Clearly you understand the nature of my question. My guess is such a player would be allowed to keep it, although sadly, Jesus Damon was forced to shave his off.
 

tranquility

Senior Member
I might agree with that, but, if the OP is not being compelled to take a pay cut and only being limited in assignments, is it still discriminatory?
It could be. There are any of a number of factors to the...quality...of a job other than pay. (And, if by being limited in assignments you mean they are not hired for additional work because of the discrimination alone, yes.)

The employer is not saying he cannot have the beard, only that they may limit where he works. In general, administration has the freedom to make work assignments so I would think that this might undercut any discrimination claim.
The employer has a right to not hire a person. It is only when the rights are exercised for a discriminatory (prohibited category) reason, is there a problem.

I know that the scheduling prerogative has been a winner for public agencies in CA, but I cannot say whether it might be in this arena or in the private sector in the OP's state.
I think this gets to what a reasonable accommodation is. With public safety, I believe you are correct there have been a number of cases that found that, because of the nature of staffing, scheduling demands for religious reasons were considered "unduly burdensome".
 

dmerlin25

Junior Member
I just talked with an impartial investigator with the Montana Human Rights Bureau. She is pretty surprised at some of the facts I stated. She is mailing me forms to sign to initiate the complaint and investigation. Other pertinent facts to consider are that Fu Man Chu and goatee is authorized in my department and beards are not. My department is 1 of 8 and the only department not too allow beards. Other departments that work with members much more often than we do, allow beards. They have no policy for religious accommodation and I am the first request my employer has ever had out of 1000 employees yearly for 20 years. This service gate is literally 500 to 10,000 times busier than every other post here and no one has ever worked it for 12 hours straight before me. There are no bathroom facilities, I have to be relieved to relieve myself which takes as much as an hour for their arrival after the request. This post is normally manned by 2 officers until my situation. I will be greatly hindered in promotional boards because I won't be well rounded in experience with all other tasks that we do and that everyone else is routinely rotated through everyday. Not that I'm mad or whining, just trying to paint a picture for you guys. I have been told by HR that they don't want to set a precedent for future requests.

I plan on keeping my beard presentable and trimmed. No more hairy than most others who work here or live here (about 2 inches long.) I requested this accommodation 40 days ago and they still have not answered it officially or definitively. I do however have a meeting with the president of this fine establishment tomorrow at his request which is unprecedented. Nobody who is not 3 supervisor positions higher here has ever had a meeting with him officially.
 
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davew128

Senior Member
I would only advise that beards are usually a hindrance to advancement. Commander Riker was on the fast track to captaincy until he grew a beard. Then he remained as first officer of the Enterprise-D and E for 15 years until he trimmed it down and took a promotion to captain the USS Titan. Be forewarned...
 

dmerlin25

Junior Member
The wheels turn slow. I had a grievance hearing for 7 written counseling statements (write ups) I was given in the span of 48 hours. 2 were determined not to be true. another was for contacting HR with out my supervisors knowledge (the grievance was against him). 3 were considered legitimate. The 3 that were considered legitimate are completely malicious such as using the restroom and abandoning my post without relief because someone never showed up and not smoking in a designated smoking area. The reason they knew about this is that they sent someone out to spy on me (instead of relieving me to urinate.) There is no designated smoking area and no other employee is smoking in an "area" including my supervisor. The man who investigated my grievance is a close personal friend with my supervisor. That fellow said that they have a right to manage overtime opportunity and that I don't qualify for any overtime that is not at my permanent post which will never happen. I have been disqualified from about a dozen overtime events since my accommodation. Another write up that was upheld was for speeding in a company vehicle, my supervisor was following me down a canyon and accused me of speeding and wrote me up for not slowing down fast enough for a reduced speed limit. This action has cost me greatly because I cannot drive the carpool anymore which accounted for 20% of my pay. I did argue that if some of the write ups were dismissed because they were not true, how can you justify any of them. I have been denied promotion once so far even though I scored highest on the test they gave us and the hiring board was my supervisor and the man that investigated my grievance against him. Late July is go time for the state investigator to make a visit and make a recommendation to the state attorney. Just thought I would vent a little.
 

cbg

I'm a Northern Girl
Well, since you never did convince me that your desire for a beard was anything more than an attempt to circumvent the dress code, all I can say is, thanks for the update.
 

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