constitution of genaral area?

[ted connaughton]

My 9 (4 of them 21 year old friends) and I where at the beach this weekend and 2 cops came down and broke up our little pow wow then they started the tickets long story short 5 of my friends got a MIPA (minor in possesion of alcohol) my 4(21yr) friends and myself told the cops that the beer was ours. They said that the minors where in the genaral area of the alcohol(thats why they got tickets) then when asked what the genaral area was they could not explain and/or know what the "genaral area" was. Do any of you?

 

[BelizeBreeze]

My 9 (4 of them 21 year old friends) and I where at the beach this weekend and 2 cops came down and broke up our little pow wow then they started the tickets long story short 5 of my friends got a MIPA (minor in possesion of alcohol) my 4(21yr) friends and myself told the cops that the beer was ours. They said that the minors where in the genaral area of the alcohol(thats why they got tickets) then when asked what the genaral area was they could not explain and/or know what the "genaral area" was. Do any of you?

it's within an area where they have access. Plain and simple.

 

[Zigner]

I wonder how many times the cop has heard "oh that's mine".
You guys were toasted, your friends were probably observed "in possession" of the alcohol before you realized the cops were even there.
They're not going to get out of this by having their older friends lie for them.

 

[CdwJava]

Did you really try to tell the cops that the the underage kids were not drinking the alcohol? Was there enough alcohol for 9? Or for 4? And was there soft drinks for the "kids"?

Heck, even if I wasn't a cop I wouldn't believe such a tale. 9 pals partying around alcohol and only 4 of them were drinking?!

- Carl

 

[xylene]

Did you really try to tell the cops that the the underage kids were not drinking the alcohol? Was there enough alcohol for 9? Or for 4? And was there soft drinks for the "kids"?

Heck, even if I wasn't a cop I wouldn't believe such a tale. 9 pals partying around alcohol and only 4 of them were drinking?!

- Carl

Carl; your post makes a lot of sense, as does everyone else's. However good old fashioned common sense and probablities are not a solid legal basis.

How much is alcohol is "enough" for 9 or 4 or 1 person. Is their a carry limit?

Soft drinks for kids? Is their some proper hydration ratio to be abided in possesion of alcohol. In my experience when I was a child at family parties the provisioning of drinks was always about 4 to one ratio of alcohol to soft drinks. Plenty of people will drink 4 (even 5 SCANDALOUS) beers in an afternoon at the beach. Even as a kid I knew that 4 sodas was ticket to hyperactivity and sickness. No way would my folks havew allowes me to drink even more than one...

Lets put it this way... is my 17 year old cousin a MIP when she is babysitting at the neighbors house and they have a 12 pack in the fridge... In that case their is no adult present, and no there is no lock on the fridge... Just her and a six month old... Now, what if the neighbors comes home and they invite my cousin over to have dinner and Mr. neighbor drinks a beer with dinner...

Too bad Ted didn't post a state with his story...

 

[CdwJava]

Carl; your post makes a lot of sense, as does everyone else's. However good old fashioned common sense and probablities are not a solid legal basis.

In this case it's good for a minor in possession. Possession requires knowledge and access ... and, of course, good reason to believe that the minors had consumed or were going to consume the alcohol. And unless a reasonable argument can be made that they were ingesting something else (and, of course, there was no odor of alcohol on the underage folks) they will be found guilty of being in possession of the alcohol.

As for the rest of it, this was NOT Uncle Ted and a beer with dinner - this was a group of teens and adults partying and slamming brews, not a family get together or a babysitting gig. Plus, imbibing alcohol in your own home is not likely to result in a criminal charge as most states will permit that. The offense usually requires the parties be in public. There may be OTHER offenses involved if an adult provides non family members alcohol in the home, but it wouldn't usually be an MIP.

The moral of the story is: Don't let your underage friends party with you!

- Carl

 

[xylene]

In this case it's good for a minor in possession. Possession requires knowledge and access ... and, of course, good reason to believe that the minors had consumed or were going to consume the alcohol. And unless a reasonable argument can be made that they were ingesting something else (and, of course, there was no odor of alcohol on the underage folks) they will be found guilty of being in possession of the alcohol.

As for the rest of it, this was NOT Uncle Ted and a beer with dinner - this was a group of teens and adults partying and slamming brews, not a family get together or a babysitting gig. Plus, imbibing alcohol in your own home is not likely to result in a criminal charge as most states will permit that. The offense usually requires the parties be in public. There may be OTHER offenses involved if an adult provides non family members alcohol in the home, but it wouldn't usually be an MIP.

The moral of the story is: Don't let your underage friends party with you!

- Carl

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your moral. I just want to understand a little more.

If the police officers smelled alcohol on the breath of the minors why not and/or a Minor in Consumption charge?

If the those over the age of 21 present claimed ownership of the beer and the police charged those under 21 with possession, then aren't those who supplied the beer commiting a number of very serious offenses themselves? And directly admiting them!

It sounds like busting a crack head for what is in the dealers pockets - and then letting the dealer walk.

I mean it would seem the only way that ONLY minors can be charged without those over 21 being charged is for those over 21 not supplying the beer. Didn't those of legal age admit it was theirs?

Now depending on ALL the facts, I think their is a chance for these guys to get away with their drinking.

 

[CdwJava]

If the police officers smelled alcohol on the breath of the minors why not and/or a Minor in Consumption charge?

Because some states - like CA - do not have a "consumption" offense. Possession, yes. Consumption, no.

If the those over the age of 21 present claimed ownership of the beer and the police charged those under 21 with possession, then aren't those who supplied the beer commiting a number of very serious offenses themselves? And directly admiting them!

Possibly. I know I would have cited them for providing it. And we don't know they WEREN'T cited. However, there may be a flaw in the law of the OP's un-named state that does not permit this citation. And, of course, all because the cops CAN cite for the 21+ crowd providing the beer doesn't mean they have to.

And if the under 21 folks were 18+ they were certainly able to make their own "adult" decision, and they may fall outside the un-named state's laws for contributing or providing alcohol to a minor (since 18+ is not a minor ... just too young to buy liquor).

Now depending on ALL the facts, I think their is a chance for these guys to get away with their drinking.

Sure ... if a judge shows mercy and says, "boys will be boys" ... or, the under 21 crowd comes in with a believable tale about how they stayed far from the beer, did not drink any of the devil's brew, and would never break the law.

I cannot conceive of any situation where there is a party, and beer, and underage partiers, where a possession charge ain't gonna fly. A judge may decide to show mercy or give a warning, but these parties on the beach are where you go to slam brews and kick it with the buds!

But, if the 21ers want to come in to court and assert that they brought the alcohol and none of the underagers drank any, then a judge might see that as reasonable doubt.

However, I'm gonna take a guess that more than one of the underage crowd had been seen holding a beer or smelled of brew.

I'm guessing common sense will prevail here and they will have to pay their fine and move on.

- Carl