Curfew?or Loitering?

[Ineeds2noe]

What is the name of your state? California
Son received citation for curfew violation. On the citation it is the officer wrote violation of curfew LCMC 916.020. When I looked this up it refers to Loitering. My son was walking home when he was stopped. He was asked where he was coming from and he told him he was walking his friend half way home and was going back home. The police officer did not believe him and put him in the car and drove to his friends house with 10 other police cars arriving there too. The friend confirmed my son story. After that he was taken to a neighborhood dept store where there was some sort of accident or something. Then later he was bought home by another police officer who told me every thing except arriving with the 10 cars. The mother told me that and that were really questioning her son and telling him he did not have to lie for my son. Bottom line they had believed my son was involved in a crime that had taken place. That I can live with. My question is the officer said he violated curfew. The code the officer cited him for refers only to loitering. Walking is not loitering. The officer admitted he stopped him while walking. Is it possible to get this thrown out on a technicality?

 

[CdwJava]

Son received citation for curfew violation. On the citation it is the officer wrote violation of curfew LCMC 916.020.

What city is this? What time was he contacted?

The elements of the offense and any exceptions should be listed in the municipal code. He may have written the wrong ordinance down.

The code the officer cited him for refers only to loitering. Walking is not loitering. The officer admitted he stopped him while walking. Is it possible to get this thrown out on a technicality?

It depends ... if this goes to Juvenile Court or traffic court, if it has not been amended to the correct section by then, it might get tossed out in court due to an inability to show the elements of the offense. If it goes to the Juvenile Probation office, and you all have to attend a meeting there, they will likely address any concerns there on a more or less informal basis and a warning to go forth and sin no more.

It could be that nothing will come of it.

- Carl

 

[Ineeds2noe]

Set for trial. Now what?

We live in Lancaster Ca. He was contacted at 0300. And yes I totatly agree that he should not have been out at that hour. The problem that I have is the 400.00 fine that the judge wants me to pay. He was only two blocks from home. He was actually walking home. That is not loitering. I even asked the Judge what the definition of loitering was. He sited this definition
9.16.010 Definitions.
[

For purposes of this chapter, the following definitions shall be applicable:
"Loiter" means and includes being dilatory, standing idly, lingering, or delaying an activity with aimless idle stops and pauses.
"Minor" means any person under the age of eighteen (18). (Prior code § 4-1.20)[/CENTER​

​

​

]
Now the actual ordinance is LCMC 916.020
. No minor shall loiter about the public streets, avenues, alleys, parks or other public places between the hours of ten (10) p.m. and six a.m. of the following day

We attended a juvenille traffic court. The judge asked my son if it was true or not. He answered not true and we were given a trial date by the judge and advised eo bring any and all withness to the trial. All to be heard by him then. There are exceptions but my question again. If the I can prove that he was not loitering but walking home him. The fine is 400.00. He is only thirteen years old. What are my chances of getting this off his record. What and how should I go about it/​

 

[shutyourface]

your son should have been at home not walking the streets

. He was contacted at 0300. And yes I totatly agree that he should not have been out at that hour. [/FONT][/I][/B]

. /

then why was he? why wasnt he in bed asleep? frankly, you need to be more aware of your son's whereabouts. it doesnt matter how far he was from home, the fact remains that he was out past curfew. pay the fine. its your job as the parent to know where your child is, and to make sure he comes home at a decent hour, not to allow him to be walking the streets at all hours of the night. he better be glad he's not my kid, he'd be grounded

 

[CdwJava]

It will also depend on what the officer claims he observed your son doing when he observed him. He may not have been walking anywhere. However, the curfew violation seems to be spot on.

By the way, what WAS he doing out at 3:00 AM? If MY son had been out at 3:00 AM the court would be the least of his worried.

- Carl

 

[Ineeds2noe]

legal advice only please

Thank you for responding and your concern regarding my son and my parental skills. But with all do respect, I did not come for advice on parental skills. If that was the case I would have given you more details. But since I did not come to this forum to be judged or have my parental skills questioned, I do not see the relevence. If anyone can respond with legal advice I would appreciate it thank you.

I believe I stated in the first post that the officer stated he saw him walking. Based on the definition on Loitering. How can walking be considered loitering. It says that during these hours minors may not loiter. It does not say that they may not be on the streets during these hours.... The code falls under loitering not curfew. I need legal advice please. If the circumstances behind him being out that late will make a difference I will be glad to post them

 

[CdwJava]

The circumstances WILL be a factor. To think otherwise is to ignore the obvious, since the cause for the contact will likely be the curfew AND the loitering charge. Besides, the officer may have seen him paused and hanging in a spot and not moving with one foot in front of the other.

And whether you like it or not, no child should be out and about at 3 AM!

If you want to address all the facts with an attorney, please go ahead and hire one. Having dealt with juvenile crimes for most of my 15 years in law enforcement, I can honestly tell you that a minor on the streets at 3:00 AM is a recipe for disaster and short of an emergency there is no good reason for him to have been out.

- Carl

 

[panther10758]

challange!

Your under age son is out and about at 3AM and you dont want your parenting challanged! My kids do not go anywhere without my knowedge and come home when they are told to otherwise they get grounded! Example my 12 year old and nine year old were next door and did not come home until after their normal bedtime! Yes Iknew where they were and it was a weekend but regardless they were bothy grounded! Your child had no buiness out that late and the only to do at that tiem is commit a crime! What are you doing about this? Simple enabling him by looking for a loophole to avoid trouble for your son! when he becomes a career criminal and you ask yourself why reflect back to this thread!

 

[Ineeds2noe]

Wow!!!!

The reason my son was out that late at night was he was walking his friend home. His friend was over our house because he lost his house key. His mom went to a concert about 90 miles away and he could not reach her. So I told him to sleep over. Well during the night he had an asthma attack. He used his inhaler and was ok. Then he had another attack and realized the inhaler was nearly empty. He called home and his sister was there but had no car. So the sister agreed to walk to my house with the inhaler but while waiting my son thought he was getting worse so they thought they would meet her on the way so he could get the inhaler sooner. So that is what he did and the brother and the sister walked home and my son was on his way back home when the police saw him. As i posted earlier the police went to the friends house and confirmed the story and everything. He was still given the citation. My son is not a bad kid. The distance between our house and his friends is only about 3 blocks. I was coming off a 75 hour work week and my son tried to wake me but I was not fully waking up quick enough. Now that is the reason my son was out. I am not looking for a loophole or to be judged by anyone. I just was simply asking for advice. The officer said my son was walking home there story was verified. The violation my son was written up for was curfew except the ordiance refered to says loitering and clearly gives the definition for loitering as i posted. The second part of the section talks about daytime during school but it specifically says they may not be upon.


A. No minor shall loiter about the public streets, avenues, alleys, parks or other public places between the hours of ten (10) p.m. and six a.m. of the following day.

B. No minor who is subject to compulsory education or to compulsory continuation education shall loiter, idle, wander or be in or upon the public streets, highways, roads, alleys, parks, playgrounds or other public grounds, public places, public buildings, places of amusement, or eating places, vacant lots or any unsupervised place during the hours of seven-thirty a.m. and two p.m. on days when school is in session. (Ord. 783 § 1, 2000; Ord. 719 § 1, 1996: prior code § 4-1.21)


Is he guilty of loitering? I know he is guilty of curfew but this does not refer to curfew

 

[CdwJava]

When he attends court, report back as to what happened.

- Carl

 

[Ineeds2noe]

Bad advice forum!!!

I am so thankful that I did not take the advice I was given here. We had our court date today and it was over so quick. I could not believe it. We did not have to say a word. Not one!! The judge had asked the officer to tell him about the night he found my son on the street. The officer said "I observed this young man walking from Jstreet onto-" Judge asked him to repeat what he said and he did. He asked him did he stop walking at any time from the time he saw him to the time he asked my son to approach him. The officer said no!!! Judge said case DISMISSED!!!!! He did not even asked what my son was doing out that late. He did after it was all over but not before he dismissed the case. Because there was no evidence of loitering.

To think I wasted my time here. I wanted a simple yes or no. It was real cut and dry. I read the law. I interpeted the law. And I am glad I did the research instead of him pleading guilty and me being out of 400.00. The advice I got for free was about diciplining my kid and me being a terrible parent. There were answers to questions I did not even ask. This forum is here for people to ask advice to certain issues. I am sure the parents who come here have enough on there plate already and do not need someone who does not know them or their kid and only have bits and pieces of the the story try to judge them and their ability to parent their kids. We come for help!! Is it possible for us to get that. I have read the post from the guy asking about suing the police department. It was nice to see that he did get help in the end. But it was a rough start.
Hey I guess you get what you pay for. Free Advice. nothing from nothing leaves nothing. So thanks for nothing

 

[Ineeds2noe]

by the way

my kid is actually a good kid. He's a kid. He mistakes of course but he usually makes good choices. And as to his future as a career criminal NOT. This whole experience made him consider a career as a criminal LAWYER!!

There Is no Right or Wrong
There's just Simply IS**************.