Vacated property for repairs, property mgr won't give compensation info - California

[acantrell15]

Hello!

Thank you in advance if you make it through my story and timeline and are able to offer any advice. My husband and I are both students and do not have a ton of money to work with an attorney without knowing whether the cost is more or less than any damages we might be owed. We rent in California and we are dealing with a property management company that refuses to inform us about compensation we are due. A pipe was damaged and caused flooding underneath our building (not caused by us or anyone else, just an old weakened pipe as confirmed by the plumbing co. that did repairs). Our unit has been the site of repair for this issue, and we previously lived for 1 month with only half of our bedrooms available to us, and for the last 2 weeks at a family member's house while further construction took place. The full timeline:

May 6th, 2015: I notified our property manager that we reported the noise of rushing water coming from underneath our unit. My husband had previously notified a neighbor who owns his unit so that the HOA could be informed directly; we have no relationship with the HOA as renters. At that time, our unit was thought to be unaffected and the HOA sent out vendors to assess the situation

May 20th, 2015: HOA representative notifies us that our unit will be the access point used to access the site of damage. At this time, I request details from our property manager regarding compensation for the loss of living space during the period of repair; no response received until June 17th

May 28th, 2015: Repairs begin. Our second (of two) bedroom is emptied (contents moved into larger bedroom and throughout unit) and a hole is made in the floor to accommodate technicians and equipment being moved underneath structure in order to remove moisture. Hole in flooring is left open and area beneath structure is left exposed

June 17th, 2015: We are informed that an additional hole will need to be cut in the living room in order to facilitate further drying and that we will need to vacate the premises. We demand determination of compensation before leaving for the dates of 5.28 when repairs began until 6.17. A total of $440 was credited to us - half of our approximate daily rent multiplied by the (20) days of lost living space (total monthly rent is $1195, ~$40/day, $20 per day of lost living space was provided). At this time, we are told that we will be compensated for 1) loss of use, and 2) living expenses while relocated. We relocated to the home of family members, and it was confirmed that we would receive compensation to provide to these individuals for housing us. At the time I write this (July 1st, 2015), we still have not received information on the compensation amounts for loss of living, relocating to our family’s home, or daily meal allowances

June 18th, 2015: Premises vacated

June 19th, 2015: Further repairs begin

June 29th, 2015: Restoration company contacts me to let me know that repairs are finished but multiple areas of flooring need to be replaced, and that the unit is extremely humid and needs to be aired out. I contact our property manager who has no timeline for these repairs and still has no information about the money due to us. I inform PM that we will not be returning to the unit until the construction is completed in totality, and that we will not be making trips to air out the unit (we live on the first floor backing up to an alley so leaving the windows open is not an option). I request information about how they plan to guarantee that the humidity will be resolved. No response received

July 1st, 2015: Rent payment is sent out for the month of July in the amount of $755 (total rent minus $440 credit); no date set for return to unit

Regarding renters insurance - initially I filed a claim with our renters insurance company, but it was denied because none of our property was damaged due to the leak.

The explanation that our property manager has provided to us regarding the lack of compensation information is that neither the HOA’s insurance company nor our owner’s homeowners insurance company have provided them with any amounts. We do not wish to break our lease, risking the possibility of a battle for our security deposit. We simply want the fair amount of compensation to be provided for the loss of our home, as well as appropriate compensation to the individuals who have housed us thus far, and repayment of the money we have spent on food. I am unsure of what we are actually entitled to in terms of the numbers, so I am reluctant to go to small claims court because I do not know what is appropriate to ask for. I also do not know whether we should continue to try to work this out with the property management company or if this is the responsibility of the owner.

Thanks again for anyone who has made it to the end and can offer any help!

 

[Gail in Georgia]

"I inform PM that we will not be returning to the unit until the construction is completed in totality, and that we will not be making trips to air out the unit"

You're jumping the gun here even considering suing for any of this since you haven't even moved back into the rental unit yet.

"The explanation that our property manager has provided to us regarding the lack of compensation information is that neither the HOA’s insurance company nor our owner’s homeowners insurance company have provided them with any amounts."

Makes perfect sense.

" We simply want the fair amount of compensation to be provided for the loss of our home, as well as appropriate compensation to the individuals who have housed us thus far, and repayment of the money we have spent on food."

Your rent reduction is the compensation for the loss of your home. It's your family members who should receive compensation for housing you, not you. And mom and dad didn't feed you during all of this? Hopefully you have receipts for what you claim you spent on food.

Gail

 

[RRevak]

Why in the world would you be compensated for food? Does your housing also include food in your rent payment?

 

[FarmerJ]

Its a stretch to ask for anything more than the prorated amount of rent for the days you could not use the unit . I suggest you contact the landlord via certified mail and make it clear that you have no problem using small claims court to ask the court to decide if you should be awarded a partial refund and feel free to remind them that its likely that they would not look very well in court trying to explain why they were entitled to full rent on that unit and how the repairs did not prevent you from using any part of the place to a Judge. I suspect that when they think it over they may decide to work something out with you rather than look like idiots in court.

 

[RRevak]

To continue FarmerJ: You are potentially entitled to compensation for rent but NOT anything you spent on food. Just because you were living elsewhere doesn't mean you stopped buying the same groceries that you would have been buying had you still been living in the unit. In other words, regardless of where you were living you were still going to buy food. You don't get that money back. And since you weren't actually paying to stay elsewhere I would argue you aren't due money for that either. I WOULD argue that your landlord wasn't entitled to rent at all while you were not occupying the unit due to no fault of your own. That is what you need to be concentrating on, not the other nonsense.

 

[Zigner]

To continue FarmerJ: You are potentially entitled to compensation for rent but NOT anything you spent on food. Just because you were living elsewhere doesn't mean you stopped buying the same groceries that you would have been buying had you still been living in the unit. In other words, regardless of where you were living you were still going to buy food. You don't get that money back. And since you weren't actually paying to stay elsewhere I would argue you aren't due money for that either. I WOULD argue that your landlord wasn't entitled to rent at all while you were not occupying the unit due to no fault of your own. That is what you need to be concentrating on, not the other nonsense.

I recently had a situation where it was possible that I would have had to vacate my home for approximately 1 week to have some repairs made. My homeowners insurance offered to pay the difference between what I normally would have spent on food and what I would have ended up spending while in a hotel. For example, if my food bill at home using my own groceries was $25 per day, and my food bill for eating out on each of those days was $40 per day, they would have paid me $15 per day.

(It was moot for me since I didn't have to vacate after all)

 

[RRevak]

I recently had a situation where it was possible that I would have had to vacate my home for approximately 1 week to have some repairs made. My homeowners insurance offered to pay the difference between what I normally would have spent on food and what I would have ended up spending while in a hotel. For example, if my food bill at home using my own groceries was $25 per day, and my food bill for eating out on each of those days was $40 per day, they would have paid me $15 per day.

(It was moot for me since I didn't have to vacate after all)

Except OP did not indicate they were staying in a hotel. OP stated "individuals who have housed us" meaning, they potentially could have still purchased groceries. If they were in a hotel then I would argue differently.

 

[Zigner]

Except OP did not indicate they were staying in a hotel. OP stated "individuals who have housed us" meaning, they potentially could have still purchased groceries. If they were in a hotel then I would argue differently.

If they can show they incurred more for meals than they normally would have, then it's not unreasonable for the OP to expect compensation for the difference.

I'm not disagreeing with you, just pointing out another view point.

 

[acantrell15]

" We simply want the fair amount of compensation to be provided for the loss of our home, as well as appropriate compensation to the individuals who have housed us thus far, and repayment of the money we have spent on food."

Your rent reduction is the compensation for the loss of your home. It's your family members who should receive compensation for housing you, not you. And mom and dad didn't feed you during all of this? Hopefully you have receipts for what you claim you spent on food.

Gail

I agree that the rent reduction for the days we are out of the home would be fair, and that is all we expect, but no one from the PM company will confirm this. And I also agree about our family members (not mom and dad, by the way...) receiving the compensation for housing us, but again, no one will provide any information on the amounts and how they will be receiving this money. They have not been feeding us, they have simply been allowing us to stay in a guest bedroom. This means we haven't been using the food from their pantry/fridge, and there isn't room for us to bring all of our groceries over to cook like normal. While we are not staying in a hotel, our daily living is very similar to staying in one (again, no room to store our own food, not having other food readily available). We do have receipts.

I am not trying to make a profit on this, and I think I have a pretty decent understanding of what we are entitled to, but I can't get anyone in the PM office to acknowledge what we are owed. That is the only reason I am seeking advice about either sending a legal demand letter or figuring out a way to persuade them to be more forthcoming with the necessary information.

Thanks for your perspective, it is much appreciated!

 

[acantrell15]

Why in the world would you be compensated for food? Does your housing also include food in your rent payment?

Of course not, but my home has a full pantry/fridge/freezer that I do not currently have access to, and the guest bedroom where I am currently staying doesn't provide a lot of options as far as storage of new groceries goes...

 

[Zigner]

I agree that the rent reduction for the days we are out of the home would be fair, and that is all we expect, but no one from the PM company will confirm this. And I also agree about our family members (not mom and dad, by the way...) receiving the compensation for housing us, but again, no one will provide any information on the amounts and how they will be receiving this money. They have not been feeding us, they have simply been allowing us to stay in a guest bedroom. This means we haven't been using the food from their pantry/fridge, and there isn't room for us to bring all of our groceries over to cook like normal. While we are not staying in a hotel, our daily living is very similar to staying in one (again, no room to store our own food, not having other food readily available). We do have receipts.

I am not trying to make a profit on this, and I think I have a pretty decent understanding of what we are entitled to, but I can't get anyone in the PM office to acknowledge what we are owed. That is the only reason I am seeking advice about either sending a legal demand letter or figuring out a way to persuade them to be more forthcoming with the necessary information.

Thanks for your perspective, it is much appreciated!

If you weren't charged to stay there, then you are not entitled to compensation for the lodging.

Or, from another perspective, you are entitle to be reimburse every penny you were forced to spend for lodging. In this case, that means $0.00

 

[acantrell15]

If they can show they incurred more for meals than they normally would have, then it's not unreasonable for the OP to expect compensation for the difference.

I'm not disagreeing with you, just pointing out another view point.

Thank you! The individuals who have housed us thus far do not have the space in their kitchen to hold the extra groceries, and we are not using any of their food/ingredients while we live here. We would normally be using food we have in our pantry/fridge/freezer, but since we do not have access to that food, we have been making small trips to the grocery store for some staples and eating out the rest of the time (total food spent on the 2 of us has been, on average, about $20 per day; we are not going out for steak and lobster dinners...)

 

[acantrell15]

If you weren't charged to stay there, then you are not entitled to compensation for the lodging.

Or, from another perspective, you are entitle to be reimburse every penny you were forced to spend for lodging. In this case, that means $0.00

Absolutely! I am not seeking compensation for myself, I am looking to get the information to provide to the family members who have been allowing us to stay here. I explicitly asked our PM if it was acceptable to stay with family members instead of living in a hotel (the area they were trying to lodge us in is in a notoriously bad part of town and we felt safer with these family members) and they confirmed it was ok. They also confirmed that these people would receive compensation for housing us, but now will not provide an amount.

 

[Zigner]

Absolutely! I am not seeking compensation for myself, I am looking to get the information to provide to the family members who have been allowing us to stay here. I explicitly asked our PM if it was acceptable to stay with family members instead of living in a hotel (the area they were trying to lodge us in is in a notoriously bad part of town and we felt safer with these family members) and they confirmed it was ok. They also confirmed that these people would receive compensation for housing us, but now will not provide an amount.

They should be getting their compensation from you and you could then request to be reimbursed. So, how much are they charging you?

 

[FarmerJ]

My take is that it doesn't matter where you stayed you were not able to use the rental unit as it was designed and enough of it was not usable that you should have been able to get a pro rated refund of rent for the number of days you were not able to use that rental SO stop waiting for management to act send them a demand letter via certified mail NO emailing use real paper, make a copy and keep copy stapled to your certified reciept telling them this is your demand to them that they have one week to pony up just the pro rated refund or you will file in small claims asking the court to order them to give you a refund and your filing fee and remind them since you reside in the tenant friendly state of California you are okay with them looking bad while explaining to the court why they should not refund you any money and how the repair had no major impact on your units habitability!