Help with Stratus

[IowaCowboy]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? ME

We bought a used car in southern Maine October of 2011 (2001 Dodge Stratus 83,000 miles on odometer at time of sale). Dealer disclosed in the buyer's guide that there were no known problems. Car had Maine inspection sticker which was issued by the dealer (who also has inspection license). Car was brought to owner's residence in Massachusetts and was registered, insured, and passed both safety and smog check. Vehicle was given a 30 day 50/50 warranty by the dealer.

Two months later in January of 2012 and about 1000 miles later, vehicle was out of service as the A/C compressor seized up and destroyed the alternator belt. Later in the Spring of 2012, vehicle seems to be unusually low to the ground (as it was at the time of sale) and it hit an obstruction in the road and the catalytic converter sprung a leak where it meets the rest of the exhaust. Mechanic in Mass repaired the exhaust with a section of pipe. Vehicle is drivable for a few months more until the catalytic converter sprung another leak from hitting an uneven panel in a mall parking garage. This time, the leak is between the manifold and the intake on the catalytic converter. Vehicle is drivable except it has a loud exhaust. Now the check engine light is on.

Went to several shops and was turned away as the bolts that hold the catalytic converter to the manifold are rotted (rusted) and that they will most likely break off making replacement impossible. Rough repair estimate for the replacement of the entire exhaust system (was told entire exhaust was no good in Spring of 2012 when the temporary fix was applied) is at least $1000 (if not more). The cost of the catalytic converter is approximately $450 alone as it requires a direct fit catalytic converter specific to the vehicle but is available aftermarket. The temporary fix failed around July of 2012. Now the vehicle is making noises that sound like failure of the exhaust is imminent and vehicle will only be used for short trips (2-3 miles at most and no highway driving) and will be removed from service when the exhaust fails or the state inspection sticker runs out (whichever comes first). I am trying to see if I have ANY possible recourse against the dealer (federal law or the laws of the state of Maine, where the vehicle was purchased). Dealer seems to have absolutely no sympathy at all. First failure (A/C compressor) was repaired by the dealer and no discounts were given. We are also determining whether to repair the vehicle or replace/trade the vehicle because other serious defects may exist and show up after the vehicle is repaired.

Any advice would be welcome.

 

[Banned_Princess]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? ME

We bought a used car in southern Maine October of 2011 (2001 Dodge Stratus 83,000 miles on odometer at time of sale). Dealer disclosed in the buyer's guide that there were no known problems. Car had Maine inspection sticker which was issued by the dealer (who also has inspection license). Car was brought to owner's residence in Massachusetts and was registered, insured, and passed both safety and smog check. Vehicle was given a 30 day 50/50 warranty by the dealer.

Two months later in January of 2012 and about 1000 miles later, vehicle was out of service as the A/C compressor seized up and destroyed the alternator belt. Later in the Spring of 2012, vehicle seems to be unusually low to the ground (as it was at the time of sale) and it hit an obstruction in the road and the catalytic converter sprung a leak where it meets the rest of the exhaust. Mechanic in Mass repaired the exhaust with a section of pipe. Vehicle is drivable for a few months more until the catalytic converter sprung another leak from hitting an uneven panel in a mall parking garage. This time, the leak is between the manifold and the intake on the catalytic converter. Vehicle is drivable except it has a loud exhaust. Now the check engine light is on.

Went to several shops and was turned away as the bolts that hold the catalytic converter to the manifold are rotted (rusted) and that they will most likely break off making replacement impossible. Rough repair estimate for the replacement of the entire exhaust system (was told entire exhaust was no good in Spring of 2012 when the temporary fix was applied) is at least $1000 (if not more). The cost of the catalytic converter is approximately $450 alone as it requires a direct fit catalytic converter specific to the vehicle but is available aftermarket. The temporary fix failed around July of 2012. Now the vehicle is making noises that sound like failure of the exhaust is imminent and vehicle will only be used for short trips (2-3 miles at most and no highway driving) and will be removed from service when the exhaust fails or the state inspection sticker runs out (whichever comes first). I am trying to see if I have ANY possible recourse against the dealer (federal law or the laws of the state of Maine, where the vehicle was purchased). Dealer seems to have absolutely no sympathy at all. First failure (A/C compressor) was repaired by the dealer and no discounts were given. We are also determining whether to repair the vehicle or replace/trade the vehicle because other serious defects may exist and show up after the vehicle is repaired.

Any advice would be welcome.

Most likely this is your car, and the expense and falure of it after a year or so is your problem.

 

[Banned_Princess]

here is the ME lemon law.

http://www.mass.gov/ocabr/business/autos-transportation/lemon-law-used.html


seems like it doesnt apply to you, since you had others work on vehicle.

 

[latigo]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? ME

We bought a used car in southern Maine October of 2011 (2001 Dodge Stratus 83,000 miles on odometer at time of sale). Dealer disclosed in the buyer's guide that there were no known problems. Car had Maine inspection sticker which was issued by the dealer (who also has inspection license). Car was brought to owner's residence in Massachusetts and was registered, insured, and passed both safety and smog check. Vehicle was given a 30 day 50/50 warranty by the dealer.

Two months later in January of 2012 and about 1000 miles later, vehicle was out of service as the A/C compressor seized up and destroyed the alternator belt. Later in the Spring of 2012, vehicle seems to be unusually low to the ground (as it was at the time of sale) and it hit an obstruction in the road and the catalytic converter sprung a leak where it meets the rest of the exhaust. Mechanic in Mass repaired the exhaust with a section of pipe. Vehicle is drivable for a few months more until the catalytic converter sprung another leak from hitting an uneven panel in a mall parking garage. This time, the leak is between the manifold and the intake on the catalytic converter. Vehicle is drivable except it has a loud exhaust. Now the check engine light is on.

Went to several shops and was turned away as the bolts that hold the catalytic converter to the manifold are rotted (rusted) and that they will most likely break off making replacement impossible. Rough repair estimate for the replacement of the entire exhaust system (was told entire exhaust was no good in Spring of 2012 when the temporary fix was applied) is at least $1000 (if not more). The cost of the catalytic converter is approximately $450 alone as it requires a direct fit catalytic converter specific to the vehicle but is available aftermarket. The temporary fix failed around July of 2012. Now the vehicle is making noises that sound like failure of the exhaust is imminent and vehicle will only be used for short trips (2-3 miles at most and no highway driving) and will be removed from service when the exhaust fails or the state inspection sticker runs out (whichever comes first). I am trying to see if I have ANY possible recourse against the dealer (federal law or the laws of the state of Maine, where the vehicle was purchased). Dealer seems to have absolutely no sympathy at all. First failure (A/C compressor) was repaired by the dealer and no discounts were given. We are also determining whether to repair the vehicle or replace/trade the vehicle because other serious defects may exist and show up after the vehicle is repaired.

Any advice would be welcome.

Let me propose this:

Suppose that before all these mechanical faults surfaced you chose to trade the Stratus in on - say a new Chevy Impala - and you told the dealership (truthfully) that “there were no known problems”.

My guess is that you would be equally as unsympathetic as is your seller (and certainly no more legally vulnerable) if later the Chevrolet dealership tried to soak you for the cost of repairing the A/C, the exhaust system, replacing the cat/converter, etc. etc.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

These are all normal repair items. When buying a used car, a valid pre-purchase inspection should give an indication they are potential problems coming down the road. Based on your story, I suggest you also inspect the brake lines, in the engine compartment and under the vehicle, as well as the coolant lines running between the radiator and engine. You will likely find those candidates for replacement also. Used cars are regularly sold for over $10,000 with repairs like this coming due within a few years. The key is to look for them prior to their failure and steer clear of those cars.

 

[sandyclaus]

here is the ME lemon law.

http://www.mass.gov/ocabr/business/autos-transportation/lemon-law-used.html


seems like it doesnt apply to you, since you had others work on vehicle.

Sorry, BP... but last time I checked, the vehicle was bought in ME = MAINE. The link you provided was for the Mass Lemon Law (OOPS!)

Here is the link for the MAINE Lemon Law info:
http://www.bbb.org/us/Storage/16/Documents/BBBAutoLine/ME-LLsummary.pdf

The Maine Lemon Law MIGHT have applied here, but again, since the mechanical work was done by someone OTHER than the dealer, you may have voided any protection it might have afforded you.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

The ME lemon law's coverage of this vehicle is expired.

 

[sandyclaus]

The ME lemon law's coverage of this vehicle is expired.

Where do you see that?

If a motor vehicle does not conform to all express warranties and the consumer reports the nonconformity to the manufacturer, its agent or authorized dealer during the term of the express warranties; a period of three years following the date of the motor vehicle’s original delivery to a consumer; or the vehicle’s first 18,000 miles of operation – whichever occurs earliest – then the manufacturer, its agent or authorized dealer must
make the necessary repairs to conform the vehicle to the express warranties. The necessary repairs must be made even after the expiration of the term of the express warranties, the three year period, or the first 18,000 miles.

While the express warranty has long since expired, neither the 3 year period, or by the sounds of it, the first 18,000 miles have passed. Even then, as it states, the repairs would have to be made even after the warranty expired.

As it states here, the manufacturer, its agent or authorized dealer would have had to make the necessary repairs. That's where OP screwed up - by not taking the vehicle back for repairs to the dealer where it was purchased.

 

[ecmst12]

Lemon laws are for NEW CARS. "The vehicle's first 18000 miles of operation" happened around 9 years before OP bought the car. It most definitely does not apply here. "The original date of delivery to the consumer" means the FIRST TIME a customer bought the car.

10 year old cars with 83k miles should never be expected to be reliable or last a long time. The dealer only gave you a 30 day warrenty for a reason. If you want reliability, get a new car or a late model, low mileage used car with a nice LONG warrenty.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

The original delivery to consumer, was when the car was new.

 

[swalsh411]

No lemon law anywhere covers 11 year old cars. Something is being passed around if anybody thinks otherwise. puff puff give.

OP should have had the car inspected prior to purchase. Absent a written warranty the dealership is not responsible for anything as the car was sold as-is.

 

[latigo]

. . . . Absent a written warranty the dealership is not responsible for anything as the car was sold as-is.

Just to clarify - but not to indicate that it is of any particular significance here - "sold as is" does not entirely absolve a used car dealer of responsibility to the consumer when transacting such business in the State of Maine.

Maine Revised Statutes Title 10 Commerce and Trade
Part 3 Regulation of Trade
Chapter 217 Used Care Information

§1475. Disclosure of information

1. Written disclosure statement. No dealer may sell, negotiate the sale of, offer for sale or transfer any used motor vehicle, including any used motor vehicle transferred to another dealer, unless the dealer affixes to the vehicle a conspicuous written statement containing the information required by subsection 2-A.

2. Required contents of disclosure statement.

2-A. * * * * * The statement required by subsection 1 must contain a complete description of the motor vehicle to be sold, including, but not limited to:

* * * * *

C. A statement identifying any and all mechanical defects known to the dealer at the time of sale. (Emphasis supplied)
* * * * *

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

There is a difference between a mechanical defect present and a mechanical defect that is in the process of developing. All car and trucks about the age of this vehicle, sold in any rust belt state will incur rust issues with the brake lines, metal coolant lines, exhaust system etc... No law will ever be made requiring every auto dealer to spend thousands of dollars rebuilding a vehicle prior to sale for future anticipated repairs. To do so, would involve the requirement for them to also rebuild all engines, transmissions etc.. also.

 

[swalsh411]

Just to clarify - but not to indicate that it is of any particular significance here - "sold as is" does not entirely absolve a used car dealer of responsibility to the consumer when transacting such business in the State of Maine.

[/I]

The burden of proof would be on the OP to show the dealer knew about the problem. Good luck with that.

Why do you think many dealers don't inspect high mileage older cars they sell? Because then they can say they were not aware of any defect.