ADRB Question

[ArmyOTH]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? MS

Hi, My name is Chris. I enlisted into the Army in November of 2006. In January of 2007, our company was given an authorized absence (family day, 36-hour pass, midcycle leave, etc) from January 27 at 10am to January 28 at 7pm. No that isn't 36 hours, but that's a whole different issue. Sometime on January 27, my Company Commander decided to file charges against me for being AWOL. I don't know why. My Drill SGT contacted me by telephone on the morning of January 28 to inform me of these charges and told me not to come back to base. Again, I don't know why.

I spent around a year attempting to facilitate my return to military control. Went to my local Army recruiter, tried to contact the Company Commander, and even the Battalion Commander. I finally ended up at PCF fort Knox, on my own accord. I stated the situation, wrote it down, etc. I was told I could remain enlisted, then the story changed to my contract was being terminated, but I could reenlist. I went to JAG, refused to mark lines through the Chapter 10 Request. Refused to sign it. I did this primarily because I had not read it, and wasn't about to be instructed where to mark and sign on a document I had not read.

Then the JAG starts telling me i'm being insubordinate, I can reenlist, the paper just says I've been to JAG. So I sign it, very, very lightly. The JAG then marks through the sheet. I go home the next day. Guess what? OTH discharge, RE-4. I can never reenlist, i'm considered a coward and a criminal, etc.

So I start digging around online for some sort of recourse. I learn about the ADRB. I spent hours in the DoD Boards of Review Reading Room. Chapter 10's more or less never get upgraded. But, i've got the charge sheet charging me with a crime on a date I had authorized leave. I have the charge sheet throwing me into DFR status before my 30 days of AWOL were up. I have documents stating I wasn't given the allotted (at least) 72 hours to confer with counsel, which I have found a regulation for.

I'm bringing up the fact that my offense was initiated and mitigated by my Company Commander charging me with a crime, and me being told not to return to base. I'm further stating I was coerced into signing the Chapter 10, I didn't mark lines through the document, I spent the time during my offense trying to return to military control, I wasn't given time for counsel, I was thrown into dfr too early, etc

I couldn't find anything in the reading rooms on how the Board feels about people being thrust into awol status because you were charged with a crime you didn't commit, and told not to come back.

Anyone think I have a shot? I certainly didn't plan on going awol, and I certainly didn't plan on being discharged like this.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? MS

Hi, My name is Chris. I enlisted into the Army in November of 2006. In January of 2007, our company was given an authorized absence (family day, 36-hour pass, midcycle leave, etc) from January 27 at 10am to January 28 at 7pm. No that isn't 36 hours, but that's a whole different issue. Sometime on January 27, my Company Commander decided to file charges against me for being AWOL. I don't know why. My Drill SGT contacted me by telephone on the morning of January 28 to inform me of these charges and told me not to come back to base. Again, I don't know why.

I spent around a year attempting to facilitate my return to military control. Went to my local Army recruiter, tried to contact the Company Commander, and even the Battalion Commander. I finally ended up at PCF fort Knox, on my own accord. I stated the situation, wrote it down, etc. I was told I could remain enlisted, then the story changed to my contract was being terminated, but I could reenlist. I went to JAG, refused to mark lines through the Chapter 10 Request. Refused to sign it. I did this primarily because I had not read it, and wasn't about to be instructed where to mark and sign on a document I had not read.

Then the JAG starts telling me i'm being insubordinate, I can reenlist, the paper just says I've been to JAG. So I sign it, very, very lightly. The JAG then marks through the sheet. I go home the next day. Guess what? OTH discharge, RE-4. I can never reenlist, i'm considered a coward and a criminal, etc.

So I start digging around online for some sort of recourse. I learn about the ADRB. I spent hours in the DoD Boards of Review Reading Room. Chapter 10's more or less never get upgraded. But, i've got the charge sheet charging me with a crime on a date I had authorized leave. I have the charge sheet throwing me into DFR status before my 30 days of AWOL were up. I have documents stating I wasn't given the allotted (at least) 72 hours to confer with counsel, which I have found a regulation for.

I'm bringing up the fact that my offense was initiated and mitigated by my Company Commander charging me with a crime, and me being told not to return to base. I'm further stating I was coerced into signing the Chapter 10, I didn't mark lines through the document, I spent the time during my offense trying to return to military control, I wasn't given time for counsel, I was thrown into dfr too early, etc

I couldn't find anything in the reading rooms on how the Board feels about people being thrust into awol status because you were charged with a crime you didn't commit, and told not to come back.

Anyone think I have a shot? I certainly didn't plan on going awol, and I certainly didn't plan on being discharged like this.

Absolutely not, I don't buy your story and neither will the board.

[ArmyOTH]

Even though it's in the evidence of record, the same record the Board will see (again) when they request it from NPRC? I mean, sure I could lie to the Board, but my records won't.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

Even though it's in the evidence of record, the same record the Board will see (again) when they request it from NPRC? I mean, sure I could lie to the Board, but my records won't.

Yes, nothing has changed from your first post and neither has my answer.

[ArmyOTH]

So you are stating you would not believe a person who can prove a case with the evidence of record? I see. I tend to suggest it's a good thing you aren't on the ADRB, as not considering evidence would put you in the same category of failing to follow Army Regulations. Thanks for your effort in replying though.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

So you are stating you would not believe a person who can prove a case with the evidence of record? I see. I tend to suggest it's a good thing you aren't on the ADRB, as not considering evidence would put you in the same category of failing to follow Army Regulations. Thanks for your effort in replying though.

I can not see your "evidence" and most individuals seem to assume they have a much stronger case then what exists in reality. Since you are such an expert please explain to me how any of this evidence is going to help your case. You left for an entire year with no valid reason. Even if you were authorized for the initial pass that brought AWOL charges against you the following 362 days were surely not authorized. Do you have a recorded conversation with the individual that ordered you not to return to the base? No, so then your Chapter 10 discharge is warranted. Even if you were ordered to not return, it is not a lawful order. You were under no obligation to follow it and will be held accountable for the actions resulting from it.

The ADRB is not a judicial proceeding. It is very similar to an article 15 hearing. The men that sit on that board have heard your story 1500 times before you even thought to make it up. You are wrong and time will prove me right.

Just to make you feel better.

You are absolutely right. There is no doubt that whatever you think should happen will happen.

[ArmyOTH]

Well I do tend to think I should be an expert on my own record. After all, if I didn't know anything about it, i'd be in a rather poor position to claim or dispute anything. The point you seem to fail to understand, which I suspect is because you are too busy dispensing negative advice, is that I don't have to make up a story.

I have the request for leave form stating that I was on authorized leave. I have the charge sheet, in which an officer, swearing under oath, accused and charged me with AWOL. In case you were unaware, that is a crime. I can prove I received a call from the base while I was on authorized leave. Can I prove what was said? No. I can further prove that I proceeded directly to my Army Recruiter's office. I can prove I had contact with him for the full year and did as he instructed. I can prove I made attempts to facilitate my return to military control by going to local bases, and being released.

At this point, other than what was said during the phone call, I don't need a story because by "prove", I mean there are documents verifying all of this. I can prove I attempted to contact the commander who signed the initial charge sheet. And so forth and so on.

Which poses the logical question of, if I intended to go awol and stay away, why would I put up such a fight to go back?

Thanks for your negative feedback though. Perhaps you had a bad experience of some sort.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

Well I do tend to think I should be an expert on my own record. After all, if I didn't know anything about it, i'd be in a rather poor position to claim or dispute anything. The point you seem to fail to understand, which I suspect is because you are too busy dispensing negative advice, is that I don't have to make up a story.

I have the request for leave form stating that I was on authorized leave. I have the charge sheet, in which an officer, swearing under oath, accused and charged me with AWOL. In case you were unaware, that is a crime. I can prove I received a call from the base while I was on authorized leave. Can I prove what was said? No. I can further prove that I proceeded directly to my Army Recruiter's office. I can prove I had contact with him for the full year and did as he instructed. I can prove I made attempts to facilitate my return to military control by going to local bases, and being released.

At this point, other than what was said during the phone call, I don't need a story because by "prove", I mean there are documents verifying all of this. I can prove I attempted to contact the commander who signed the initial charge sheet. And so forth and so on.

Which poses the logical question of, if I intended to go awol and stay away, why would I put up such a fight to go back?

Thanks for your negative feedback though. Perhaps you had a bad experience of some sort.

I may just be tired of pretentious little kids like yourself feeling like they more than I do. Like I said time will prove me right and you wrong.

[ArmyOTH]

Being that you tend to knock how other people construct sentences, you might want to take a look at your last response. If i'm pretentious, as you say, why would you even bother? All I asked was a yes or no question, I could do without your negative commentary. I suspect time will prove that at least one of us is open about your military career, while the other is hiding behind some childish "I am right, you are wrong" argument. If you are that "tired" of me, perhaps it's best you reply elsewhere.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

Being that you tend to knock how other people construct sentences, you might want to take a look at your last response. If i'm pretentious, as you say, why would you even bother? All I asked was a yes or no question, I could do without your negative commentary. I suspect time will prove that at least one of us is open about your military career, while the other is hiding behind some childish "I am right, you are wrong" argument. If you are that "tired" of me, perhaps it's best you reply elsewhere.

I am tired of pretentious little kids like yourself that think your 17 seconds of research on Google make you an expert. You know absolutely nothing about this process or the regulations behind it. I wouldn't consider 3 months of dishonorable service as a career.

I will say this one final time and I hope you understand this time.

The ADRB is not interested in your reasoning behind why you stayed AWOL for a year. You were AWOL for a year and were discharged for it. You voluntarily accepted a discharge in lieu of court martial, even if you signed very lightly with your fingers crossed. You can only receive an upgrade to your discharge if the category of discharge was given in error or if the discharge was given unjustly. You can tell all the little fairy tales you wish but there is nothing that will change the fact that you were AWOL. You also accepted a discharge in lieu of court martial. Based solely on those two simple facts alone the non-judicial board will deny your request. Do some research on the percentage of upgrades that are granted by the ADRB each year. Your chances are absolutely non-existent. The board has a history of believing the sworn word of career officers over immature children that ran away.

I still have trouble grasping how you failed to make contact with anyone. I don't understand why you did not simply return to the base.

Go play lawyer somewhere else.

[ERAUPIKE]

Originally Posted by ArmyOTH

Even though it's in the evidence of record, the same record the Board will see (again) when they request it from NPRC? I mean, sure I could lie to the Board, but my records won't.

This is incorrect. Your research should have shown that the board will only review information you submit. You are there to prove your case. This is an appeal. It would be advantageous for you to hire an attorney to represent you in this case. You will lose either way, but then you will have someone else to blame again.